State v. McCleskey – Trial Transcript Vol. 1

    State v. iicCleskey 

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ELT TY pry 3 TN FT hay 1 RIED GEE WEE 5 gon ign Bh on TR Ted on & 8 “HE COURT: All right, #r. Turner, are you 

ready to hear your motions? 

£ ile PARKER: Your llonor, for the purpose 

record, this is Indictment A-40553, The State vs 

Warren HeClesky and three other individuals, char 

with murder and two counts of armed robbery. A 

not guilty has not previously been entered by 

Mr. McCleskey., 

MR. TURNER: 1 think there are two things we fee 

te take up before anything else is done, The firs 

to do with voir dire of the jurors. 1 have discus 

the matter with Mr. Parker and what I would propose is 

this. Due to the massive pre~trial publicity in this 

case I think we should question each juror individually, : ~a 

Part of my reason for that is I filed the notion to dig- 

migs because of pre-trial publicity, but I don't think we 

can properly get into that until we have an individual 

chance to see what -- the individual prospetive jurors 

have a right to state what they have or hive not seen, 

I think we would get more candid and ope response 
~ 

from 

       
          

   

jurors without any peer pregsure, and fi 

we ask that we be allowed to voir dire 

and that we be allowed to nake oO 

oe » Se . ig S oh § yon pin, Be Fg 2 Hr dh Wg " after the questioning of the panels 

 



THE COURT: You have a right >» the second part 

of the motion. 

On the first part, I have permitted that previously. 

any purpose to be gained except a delay in 

out of the presence of each other. 

what you are talking 

about. This is not a case where people would be, for 

inatanca, if it were a case that involved prejudice or 

something like that, you night not want to speak freely 

& juror might be hesitant to speak freely in front of 

other jurors, but as I see it, this is 8 ns far as I 

know, it is nothing but a murder case and armed robbery 

case, and I try them routinely without the necessity of 

doing 

pe: point this out to the Court. 

THE COURT: am not saying any case is routine, 

bo case that I can recall of in recent 

received as nuch publicity as this matter. 

I can think of many more. 

I would disagree with the Court, 

have newspaper clippings that we can introduce, 

THE COURT: Have you filed those s0 I can see them, 

spaper clippings that are showing 

unusual interest 1 this cage, I will read them, but -=- 

We have them right here, Your HORGr.  



  

      

  

  Secondly, in terms of questioning the jurors about 

the pre-trial publicity in this case, 1 am concerned 

that anything one individual juror might say could be 

vrejudicial in terms of saying it in the presence of 

the other jurors. You might bave one juror that has 

followed the case vividly in the paper and he or she 

could bring up matters that might contaminate the rest 

of the panels, 

THE COURT: The Court considers that more than the 

first point. To avoid the possibility of contaminating 

a whole panel or panels of the jury, 1 will grant the 

motion. 

ME. TURNER: All right, sir. 

The other thing, Your Honor, is a motion we filed 

in terms of the death penalty. We filed the motion asking 

that the death penalty be declared unconstitutional in 

terms of its application in this case, and I would be 

prepared to submit a little evidence on that by way of 

testimony from the District Attorney. 1 have already men- 

tioned to him the fact that I would be calling him as a 

witness in this case in terms of that particular aspect 

of things, 

Now, my question to you is, would you prefer to deal 

with that motion at this time or after the jury hes Deen 

selected? 
      



  

THE CQURTs Mr. Parker, are vou planning to ask 

for the death penalty? 

MR. PARKER: Insofar as Mr. McClesky is concerned, 

ves, sir, I intend to let a jury pass on that question, 

TRE COURT: If you are going to have to call 

Mr. Parker, if you feel like you have to sometime in the 

proceedings, I see no reason to take it up before the 

trial, 

MR, PARKER: If he wants to ask me guestions, I will 

be glad to put on the record things 1 have told counsel. 

THE COURT: Why don't you do that since I will know 

what you all are talking about. 

fiRe TURKER: ~All right. The way I prefer to do it 

is by way of cross—examination. I expect to show that the 

District Attorney singled Mr, McClesky out alone for that 

particular punishment, even though he char¢es all three 

individuals with the same crime, Apparently the District 

Attorney sees differences in levels of guilt because he ® 

hae not asked for the death penalty in the other cases, 

and my understanding is that he does not intend to do $0; 

therefore, I would like to get it on the record just what 

the District Attorney's attitudes and beliefs and inten- 

tions are in this matter so we can have it if it's neces- 

sary for an appeal on this issue. 

In my mind, murder ig murder, no matter whether 

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three people, four, or only one committed it. To 

single out one and say you should die if you are con- 

<n g is the essence of being arbitrary ang a
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victed of th 

capricious, in my opinion, and that is what we wish tc 

attack. We can do it now or later. 

THE COURT: Do you want to make any statement? 

MR, PARKER: I will be happy to, Your HONOL, 

As I view the evidence at this point, it is the 

State's contention, and we hope to prove, that 

Mr. MeClesky is the triggerman and that is why I have 

asked to try him first and that is why I will qualify the 

jury and ask that they consider the question of punishment 

in this case. Hy present intentions are not to try the 

other co-defendants for the death penalty since they are 

not the triggerman., Unless something develops at this 

trial that changes my mind, that is my present intentions. 

HE COURT: I have read the cases that deal with 

the "triggerman® and although they haven't made a definl- 

tive ruling, you can read between the lines. There may 

be such & ruling, and I won't say anything further about 

it, 

All right, go ahead, Hr. Turner. 

MR. TURMER: Well, is the Court saying that we 

should pursue the matter at this time or what, or 

reserve it? 

 



  

THE COURT: I would just as soon pursue it during 

the trial, but I leave it up to Mr. Parker. If he wants 

to deal with it now, we can do so. I don't know the 

details of the case except for the evidence that was sub- 

mitted to me to make an in camera inspection. 

MR, PARKER: I don't intend to be called as a witness 

before trial or during trial, and I think that ought to be 

made plain right nows I don't intend to get on the stand 

for Mr. Turner. If he wants to ask me something before 

the Court or the jury, I will make the statement in my 

place. 

BR. TURNER: He can't tell we who I will call, 

MR. PARKER: I can exactly tell him what I will do. 

MR. TURNER: I am going to subpoena him as a witness, 

THE COURT: Have you subpoened him before now? 

HR, TURNER: HO, I just talked to him about the 

matter this morning, It came to my attention of exactly 

what he was planning to do. 

THE COURT: Do vou have any law about that? 

MR. TURNER: Well, Your Honor, he is a witness just 

like everybody else. I have given him plenty of notice. 

it is his decision in terms of what happens in this case. 

I think that makes him almost a star in terms of this 

particular motion, 

THE COURT: Well, whether he is a star or not, I 

 



  

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want to know do you have any authority for calling the 

Pistrict Attorney as a witness, If you do, I can be 

addressing myself to that legal question in advance. 

Me TURNER: At this time I don't, because as 1 

said, this was just brought to my attention this morning. 

AS you recall, the last time we were in court -- 

le PARKER: This was not brought to his attention. 

Hie has been knowing for weeks about this. I told him the 

first time we had a discussion I was going to let a jury 

determine the fate of his client. 

Mie TURNER: Dut not as to the other defendants. 

He told the Court he didn't know what he was going to do 

then. Hy motion ig the treatment that my client is 

receiving as compared with the other defendants, the 

particulars of this particular case, 

THE COURT: If you do determine to call him before 

the jury and he tries to refuse being called as a witness, 

I will rule on whether he can be compelled to testify. 

MRe TURNER: All right. Well, on that basis, Your 

Honor, I would yveserve any other motions I have until 

such time as {it appears to be appropriate in the trial, if 

it is all right with the Court. The rest of them have 

basically been worked out between myself and Mr. Parker, 

THE COURT: All right, gentlemen, let's send for a 

Urry. 

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(Whereupon, the prospective jurors entered the 

courtroom, after which the following proceedings were 

had.) 

THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, we are not going 

to keep all the jurors here at one time. We need you 

here while we administer the oath and ask certain gues- 

tions, You will not be here long at one time. If you can 

all squeeze together and make room for everyone, you won't 

pe here very long. 

How, will all the jurors please rise and raise your 

right hand, 

(Whereupon, the voir dire oath wag administered to 

the jury.) 

HR. PARKER: Ladies and gentlemen, I am about to 

read the charges to you. I ask that you pay close atten~ 

tion because there will be different guestions that will 

be asked vou following the reading of the charges, 

This is Indictment A-40553, The State vs. Warren 

McClesky and three other individuals who are charged with 

murder and armed robbery in two counts, A true bill was 

returned by the Fulton County Grand Jury on June the 13th, 

1978, and to that bill of indictment Warren HceClesky 

enters his plea of not guilty. 

The indictment reads substantially as follows: 

State of Georgia, County of Fulton, in the Superior Court 

 



  

of said County. The Grand Jurors selected, chosen and 

sworn for the County of Fulton, to wit, Carroll B. Brown, 

Assistant Foreman, and the other individuals whose nanes 

appear in the indictment, in the name and behalf of the 

citizens of Georgia, charge and accuse Warren MceClesky, 

and three other individuals, with the offense of murder, 

for that said accused, in the County of Fulton, State of 

Georgia, on the 13th day of Hay, 1978, did unlawfully and 

with malice aforethought, cause the death of Frank Robert 

Bchlatt, a human being, by shooting him with a pistol, 

contrary to the laws of said Btate, the good order, peace 

and dignity thereof. 

Count Two, and the Grand Jurors aforesaid, on their 

oaths aforesaid, in the name and behalf of the citizens 

of Georgia, further charge and accuse Warren McClesky and 

three other individuals, with the offense of armed robbery, 

for that said accused, in the County of Fulton, State of 

Georgla, on the 13th day of May, 1978, did unlawfully, 

with the intent to commit theft, take from the person and 

immediate presence of Ronald Warren Dukes the following 

property, to wit: One thousand, five hundred dollars in 

money ©f the value of 81,500 and the property of Ronald 

Warren Dukes, as baillee, and six dollars in money and one 

256 and the r
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 man's Timex wristwatch, all of the value © 

property of Ronald Warren Dukes, by iatimidation and by 

 



  

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" i £ Cu Wr SU Wa nas oR a on Fh 2% AS a A wo 2h YVR RPE mB eR wy 
use Of a pistol and a snolgun, Lhe game Heing Oilehlslive 

weapons, contrary to the laws of said Htate, the good 

order, peace and dignity Cthereorl. 

Count %hree, and the Grand Jurors aforesaid, on thelr 

& 1 further charge anki accuse Warren HeClesky and 

  

. 

three other individuals, with the offense of armed robbery, 

for that said accused, in the County of Fulton, Btate of 

Georgia, on the 13th day of say, 1978, did unlawfully, 

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with the intent to compeit theft, take from the person and 

immediate presence of George A. Halcom, the following 

property, to wit: One Garcia .38 automatic pistol == 1 

guess it's 380 automatic pistol, of the value in excess 

of $100 and the property of George A. Malcom, by intimi- 

dation and by use ©f a pistol and a shotgun, the same 

being offensive weapons, contrary to the lavs of sald 

State, the good order, peace and 

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Raving seen the crimes commitied QY LTO NAVIN Dedard snk 

in regards to the guilt or innocence OL the delendant. at 

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Is your mind perfectly impartial between the btate 

and the accused? 

are any of you related by blood or marriage to the 

defendant, Warren McClesky, or to Frank Robert Schlatt, 

the victim, Ronald ¥., Dukes, Ceorge A. Halconm 

Your Honor, the jurors appear to be qualified. I 

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® do have some additional ques 

MR, PARKER: Do any of you know Hr, John Turner, 

counsel for Hr. McClesky, or have you ever had any 

dealings with him? 

adies and gentlemen, the following individuals 

may be State's witnesses or defense witnesses in this 

sage, If you know any of these individuals, I please 

ask you to so signify. 

The first names are the co-defendants, David 

Burney, Jrs Are any of you familiar with that name; do 

you know anybody by that name? 

The second individual is Bernard Depree, alias 

Bernard Dupree, difference in spelling, D=e-p-r-e-e and 

Deu=-p=r-e-e, [0 any of you know that individual or any- 

one that has associated with him? 

The other individual is Ben Wright, Jr., a co- 

defendant. Do any of you know him? 

The following additional witnesses may appear in  



  

this case, Classie Barnwell, Does anyone Know her? 

Marshall Darrell HMalcow; Mamie J. Thomasy Dan 

Oliver; Ben Lester Tyson; James Crier, Jr.; Henry 

Kelloms, HN-e=l=l-O=mn=-53 Scott Helms, Heg=l=~s}; 

Everett New, N-e-w; hig wife, FHrs. Connie New; Officer 

Ls Go Beard, B-e~a~r=-djy Officer H. RK. Baugh; Cfficer 

DeEe Kelly; Patricia Ann Jackson; Sharon Hardeman; 

Barbara Cooks; Mary Dorsey Jenkins; Harold Jewsone; 

William Jewsome; Oscar Thomas Hosea; Offie GG, Bvans; 

Mr. Lewis R. Blaton; R. ££. Nickerson; Terry Chastain) 

Mike Henson; Brenda Lee Hardy; Raymond G. Myers; 

Hrs. Raymond G. Myers; ann Butts; Steven J. Labovitz; 

Stephen A. Kermish; Mra. Hozell Horgan; Bdgar Blalock. 

Yes, sir. DBO you know Mr. Blalock? 

THE JUROR: Yes, sir. 

MR, PARKER: Which Hr, Blalock do you know, sir? 

THE JUROR: Senior and junior, 

MR. PARKER: Do they run a repair garage? 

THE JURCEK: Ho, sir. He ig a Union Qil distributor 

in Jonesboro. 

MR. PARKER: I don't bhelleve that this is the same 

One, 8ir. 

Amuse McPherson; Stan Hendony Art Krissky;y Hrs. Elaine 

Galanti; Edmund Johnson; Porothy Umberger; Evonne Fuller; 

Paul Ross, R-o=-s-83; Art Kiessling; Crady Hix; Norma Elsner; 

 



  

Brenda Jenkins; BE. Glenn Beavers; Mrs. Catherine Taylor; 

Janes PF. Clark; Mra. Shelby Pryor, P-r-y-o-rj; Hilliam 

L. Tidwell: Olen Chadwick; Bill Brvanty Terri Mathis; 

Dr. William RR. Anderson; Sergeant J, 7. Cameron; Louis 

A. Cuendet, C-u~g-n-d-g¢=-t; Tony CG. Raney; James W. 

Howard; Kelly MH. Fite Joseph P. Hancock; Marsha 

Gilverman; Elizabeth Quarles; fergeant H. W. HeConnell; 

Letective 8. C. Dorseyy Detective G, 8. Gordon; Lieutenant 

We Ke Perry. 

Yes, ma'am. 

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 JUROR: Sir, I knew Officer Schlatt and I also 

know Gfficer Dorsey. 

THE COURT: Hedanm, will you mind standing up so the 

court reporter can hear you. 

THE JUROR: I know them work related, 

MR, PARKER: What panel are you on, please? 

THE JURCR: Panel 8. 

MR. PARKER: What is your name? 

THE JUROR: Mrs. Dorothy Smith. 

MR. PARKER: You knew Officer Schliatt? 

THE JUROR: Yes, sir. 

MRe PARKER: You also knew who? 

THE JUROR: Dorsey and Perry. 

MR. PARKER: Hay 1 ask her some additional ques- 

tiong? 

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1 impartial juror? 

GFF & & tt 2x] Pay on 3S COURT: Yes, SiY. 

TALI ELE. ad 4 “5 1 
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ail from coming 

PARKER: Would that keep 

WII ROR § BO 

PARKER: IX you have any 

you work for, please’ 

Atlanta Motor Transport, and 

gown to the shop. 

questions? 

1 

you from being a fair 

TURNER: Again, Your Honor, I will reserve all 

of my questions until we get around to the individual P 

portion. 

THE 

have a doubt about vour ability to be 

5 be § 0 5 wok cr Een dw COURT: All right, 

Lo Bl OR £95 i ten Te be PARKER: Thank you, 

FY a 0 00 3 wi 
LOUIE S AL any and gentlemen, you 

fair and impartial 

as a juror, that is, fair and impartial to the State and 

to the defendant, pleage let that fact Le Known. 

not 8 ground 

serve, If 

impartial, I will hear from 

JUROR: 1 would 

Ra p¥s § 3% wth 

COURT: Willi you 

for belng excused; 

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re be) 5 0 of 1 * That 

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you have a doubt about your being fair and 

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MEREIARETS. Fhe @ 

COURT: All right. 

PARKER: Lillian 

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Sargeant Te. As 

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Bturgis; Margene Turner; Pat A, Offutt; Vicki White; 

Boland Laney Ge. Griffin, CG-r-i=-f-f~i~n; initial H. Mallory, 

Heg=l=l=o=v=-yv3 Richard C, Brown; Officer W, D., Resmnondo; 

Officer HM. R. Carey; Detective C, HE, Simmons; Detective 

BE. J. Hansen; Detective A. H. Shelton; Detective C. Fe 

MeClues De O. Magee, H-a-g-e~03 Detective HR, 6. Hubbard; 

Gfficer R. E+. Darden; Cfficer HM, R. Currance, 

Cou=r-r-a-n=-c-e; Detective J. A, Walker, Jr.; Detective 

Ke Jowers; Detective Welcome Harriss Officer 0D. E. “
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MeMichen, Hec=M-i-c=h=@-n; Sergeant W, B, Holmes; Chief 

Alan Waters; Sergeant Lloyd G. Gross; Deputy Sheriif Jim 

Burns; Deputy Sheriff Carter K, Hamilton; James A. 

Walker; Captain Virgil Brown; Detective Larry Smetzer, 

I believe that ig all 1 have, Your Honor. 

THE COURT: Do vou have any questions you would 

like to ask the panels as a whole? 

MR. TURNER: No. Again, Your Honor, I would reserve 

any questions I have until later. 

THE COURT: All right, #r. Sheriff, you may segues- 

ter the jurors and we will call them in one at a time, 

THE DEPUTY SHERIFF: Ladies and gentlemen, as you 

can see, due to the size of the courtroom we don't have 

the necessary space for you, Deputy Price is going to 

take vou back down to the fourth floor, the room you went 
F “ 

into this morning, Room 404, Plesge go in that room, not 

 



  

the jury assembly room, but Courtroom 404, and we'll 

bring you up according to your panel. 

All right, if you will, go with him now, please. 

TEE CLERK: Philip 8. Horris. 

THE DEPUTY SHERIFF: Mr. Horris, will you remain 

standing and give us your occupation, and remain standing 

until both parties have an opportunity to ask you several 

guestions, 

THE JUROR: I work for the corporate aviation 

facility on the Atlanta Airport called Hanger One, 

theorpoFated, I am a vice pregident for them and do some 

travelling, approximately two days a week, to our other 

operations in other cities in the Southeast in the capacit; 

of safety, comformity, fuel handling, compliance to paper- 

work procedures and things of that nature. 

Sos 2 A Bal Al 
BY BR. PARKER? 

8; Mr. Morris, are you married, sic? 

A Yes, Bir. 

Q And do you have children, sir? 

A Yes, 81x. 

{J And how old are your children? 

A I have a young man twenty-two and another son 

twenty. 

{J And what are they presently doing? 

 



    

A My older son is attending Auburn University. 

The younger one is working for an air freight company at the 

airport. 

0 Have you served on jury duty before? 

A Yes, sir, about three years ago. 

O Was that a civil or criminal case or both? 

A It was civil, 

{ Did that jury reach a decision, and, of course, 

don't tell me what it was? 

A Yes, sir, it did. 

Q And how long have you been in the Atlanta area, 

A Bince 1937. 

0 oes your wife work outside the home? 

A Yes, she works for Southern Alrways Company, the 

airline, as a secretary. 

ME. PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

HR. TURHEXR: 

Mr. Morris, my name ls John Turner and I represent 5
 

the defendant, Warren McClesky here. 1 have a few questions 

I would like to ask. Some questions might be of & personal 

nature, but in any event, we are trying to decide whether you 

can be a falr and impartial juror in this case, so please 

don't take cffense on any question, 

3 

What is your educational background, sir?  



  

A High school. 

Q All right. What about your employment history; 

where else have you worked besides in your present position? 

A I have been with Hanger One for twenty-one years. 

Prior to that 1 worked for the Mational Life and Accident 

Insurance Company for three years. 

& All right. What did you do in that position? 

A 5 sales agent, insurance sales, 

4 All right, And the twenty-one years that you 

worked for your present company, how == have you worked in 

different positions there? 

A Yes, Just last year I took on my present duties, 

Prior to that I was the line foreman fox the Atlanta opera- 

tions which was pretty auch in the same area except for one 

department. 

G All right. Where are you from originally, sir? 

A Born in Waynoka, Oklahomajy northeast Oklahoma. 

& 1 believe you say you have been in this avea 

since when? 

A 137. 

Q Do you have any interests or hobbles? 

A Yea, I enjoy swimming, some painting, very little 

0 All right. Now, you say that you served on a jury 

before. That 1s correct, isn't it? 

 



  

A Yes. 

{Q Have you ever served on a Grand Jury before? 

A HO, 

# Do you have any family, friends or relatives who 

pave ever been the victim of a crime or have you ever been 

the victim of a crime? 

A No, 8ir, 

Q bo you have any family, friends, relatives or 

associates who are involved in law enforcement? 

4 > 

A 1 have a cousin whose son is a police officer, 

very remote. 

, A1) right. Would that in any way cause you tO 

be prejudiced in this particular cease? 

A Ko, sir. 

{2 Have you ever done any work in law enforcement in 

the military or otherwise? Y 

A Ho, sir. 

¥ All right. Do you know who lr. Frank Schlatt is 

or was have you ever heard the name before? 

A I do not, no. 

u Do you listen to TV and read the papers? 

AB Ye8. 

$, All right, The Atlanta Journal and the local 

stations? 

A TeB 

5 J 

a de 

 



  

¥ All right, How often do you do that? 

A Quite often; every day, 

GQ All right. Which papers do you read? 

A I read the Journal. 

9, All right. Have you read or heard anything about 

this particular case? 

A I do not recollect that I did. I am sure I must 

have, but I do not recollect. 

Q If I state to you that this is the case involving 

the shooting of a police officer at a furniture store, have 

you read or heard anything about that particular matter? 

A I don't recall it, no, sir. 

\% Do you have any attitudes, beliefs or feelings 

about the crimes of robbery and murder that would not allow 

you to &it on this jury? 

A I don't believe 80. 

¥, All right. I believe that the prosecutor is going 

to qualify the jury for the death penalty in this case, Do 

you have any == 

MR, PARKER: How, Your Honor, that doesn't make 

any difference whetner I do or don't. I haven't asked 

this juror any of that and I object te him implying 

what I will do. I don't have to qualify anybody, Your 

HONOr. 

MR, TURNER: 8ince he has given us notice, I think 

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it is proper for mé to get into his feelings about the 
wi 

ge death penalt 

THE COURT: Why don't we do this. Why don't you 

wait and see if he does ask the questions, 

MR. PARKER: Your Honor, the State doesn't have to 

ask prospective jurors those questions; I can choose at 

random those 1 may and those 1 may not, 

MRe TURNER: By the same token, he might end up on 

the jury and the prosecutor has served notice on us that 

they intend to ask for the death penalty based on three 

specific acts set out in the statute and I think we are 

entitled to question the man about his feelings on it. 

THE COURT: Proceed, 

Oo (By Mr. Turner) what, if any, feelings do you 

have about the death penalty? 

A I have very mized emotions about it. Deeply in 

periods of my life, in one way or another, I would have to 

state honestly at this time that I do believe in it. 

#; all right. Now, on that basis would you be able 

to sit as a fair and impartial juror in this case? 

A Yes, sir, I believe 80. 

%; Now, if you were selected as a juror in this case 

and you nade a determination, and we get to that stage of the 

trial, would you be able to consider any circumstances in 

mitigation, or whatever else, in terms of punishment, separate 

 



  

and apart from your feeling for the death penalty now? 

A Yes, 1 believe 80. 

Cl In other words, you could look at the matter 

separately and deal with the separate issues? 

A Right. 

PURNER: Thank you, sir. 

(Whereupon, the juror wag excused from the court- 

LOOM. ) 

THE COURT: Mr. Turner, you have the right to go: 

through the entire forty-two jurors or additional jurors, 

but you might want to consider if you would pass on the 

jurors per panel, . It would free the others to go on with 

the other business of the court, 

HR. TURNER: Let me check with my client for just a 

minute, 

THE COURT: All right. 

MR. TURNER: Your Honor, my client would prefer to 

go through the whole panel, 

THE COURT: All right. 

THE CLERK: Mrs. Doris FPF. Walters 

BY RT 5H UY ERY 
BY MRe PARELNS 

¥) Where are you employed as a rental clerk? 

& Wesley Heights and Hardee Court Apartments, 

S 
-— a 

 



  

0 What side of town is that on? 

A Bast, Southeast -- Northeast. 

Q All right. What does Hr. Walters do? 

A Salesman. 

§ and for what company? 

A Sears Roebuck and Company. 

{J Does he travel or is he in a particular store? 

A Particular store, he don't travel. 

¥ Which one is he at? 

A Hast End, Gordon Street. 

Q And how long have you been the -= you are in 

charge of the rental office at the Wesley Heights Apartments? 

A Well, I collect the rent, but I have a project 

manager, lI mean, she's over ne, 

& How long have you been doing that type work? 

A A Year. 

#, And were you employed outside the hone prior to 

that? 

A MO» 

¢ And Hr. Walters has been with Sears how long? 

5 Six vears, 

$3 And what did he do prior to that? 

A A Georgia Tech officer, 

Q Do you have any children? 

A Three. 

i & 
“u™ 

 



      

{3 AnG thelr ages? 

A Eighteen, eleven and six. 

&) And what is the eéighteen~year-old doing? 

A She started Georgia State this fall. 

OQ 1& she still in high school now? 

A Ho, she 18 going to college now at Georgia State. 

ave you ever served on jury duty before? 

{ Civil cases, criminal cases or both? 

a C i Vv i 1 ® 

¥] And without telling me what happened, did those 

civil Juries come to decisions? Were you able to reach a 

A Let me see. It's been three years ago. I think 

I never was in on a case, 

8 All right. HNrs. Walters, are you conscientiously 

opposed to capital punishment? 

A Well, if my statement is correct, maybe in some 

cages; I'm not sure, 

Gi Sone cases you are opposed to it and some cases k 

you are not? 

A Yen, 

% Those cases where you would be opposed to capital 

punishment, could you not vote for capital punishment regard-~ 

Toa as en pag wade Yop is ST. C4 Pe ATE Te wry ye $ 3 4 A 
legs of what the evidence was or might indicate? 

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correct? 

A Yes, 

£7 YF yan we $n Bw [™ #5 5 8 9 Pr ow FY nag RB gn 3 ao wd oF as ny dg. # All right, Do you have anv close friends or 

relatives oy 

Of a crine? 

DG 

£% 1 wr wy 
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Was what? 

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Georgia 

Or have you, yourself, been the victim 

you have any close friends or relatives in law 

no. Could I say that == well, I once had, I 

374 
5 J 

4 
nforcement, my husband was a police officer 

the situation to me, please. 

3a Po E 

“egn 

he still doing that now? 

right. Would that cause you to prejudiced 

n terms of heaving evidence in this case? 

4 b 
fo 3. right. Have vou heard 1@ hame Frank Schlatt 

right. Do you read the papers or listen to 

right, you read Have or seen anvthing about 

 



  

   

the Dixie Furniture Store robbery wherein a police officer 

wag killed? 

A Yes, 

0 What, if anything, have you read or heard about 

that? 

A Well, I heard it on the news, you know. Was it a 

stakaout Or == 

( All right. Let me ask you this question. Do you 

recall how many times you have heard or seen anything about ¥ : 

that particular case in the news? 

A Well, when it first happened, 1 heard about it, I 

guess, 

¢ Did you read about it in the newspapers? 

A HO. 

L¥ Just heard about it? 

a) Un Lhe news. 

iJ How often do you read the newspaper? 

A Well, mostly on weekends, Sunday's paper. 

{J Now, would anything you have heard or read about 

this case cause you to be prejudiced at this point, without 

hearing any evidence? a 

{3 All right. You said that == well, you expressed 

some reservation when you were asked about the death penalty, 

You sald you were for it in some cases and against it in 

 



  

others. Could you be a little more specific about what your 

feelings and reactions are, Or do you understand? 

A Well, my opinion is, it depends on what -- what 

the crime wag or whatsoever they did, you Know. 

¥ All right, Bow, if vou were selected to sit on 

this jury and a determination was made of quilt in the first 

instance, then it would be your job as a juror to determine the 

proper sentence which might involve the death penalty. With 

your attitudes and beliefs do you feel that you could fairly 

and impartially sit on the jury and make that determination? 

A Well, I would give the best answer to the best of 

my knowledge, that is all. 

All right. Do you have any reservation in sitting he 

in thia case because the death penalty might become an issue 

here? 

A The guestion again is what? 

LQ The question is, do you have any reservations 

about sitting on this case because the death penalty might 

become an issue, that is, that you might be called upon to 

make a determination on that issue? 

A Hoe 

4) All right. What is your answer "no" to then, you 

can sit on this jury without any reservations, is that it, or 

do you understand the question? 

a HOt re ally ® 

 



  

0 All right. Hy yuestion ig, this case might 

involve the application of the death penalty. Do you have 

any feelings one way or the other about becoming a member of 

thig jury if you are selected because this case might involve 

the application of the death penalty? Are you still having a 

problem with 1t? 

A Yes. 

Q All rights In other words, would you have a problem 

sitting on this case if the prosecutor asked for the death 

penalty for this man? 

A Well, I don't guess I would be too comfortable, but 

I would. 

f 

¥ Why do you say you wouldn't be comfortable? 

A Well -- 

MRe TURKHER: 1 have no further questions. 

THE COURT: Madam Juror, don't discuss anything 

that has been asked you; don't discuss this case at all 

with your fellow jurors, please, ma'am, 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from thé court=— 

FOOM, ) 

AHE COURT: Gentlemen, do you all have any objection 

we 
A to me sending the sheriff in to tell the first juror not 

fo 34 in an a ay 
to discuss the case? 

ha oy EEF IERIE Te fra CF Ep zr iy An Red 
BE. TURNER: Lig ¥ YOUuz S0ONn0OL & 

we Nall Maal 

 



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HRe PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

BY MR. TURNER: 

Q Mr. Marshall, my name is John Turner. Have you 

ever served on a Grand Jury pefore? 

©“ HO 

¢ Okay. Have either you or your friends or relatives 

ever been the victim of & crime? 

A BC» 

0 Okay. Do you have any {riends or relatives or close 

associates in law enforcement? 

A HO» 

J Okay. illave you ever heard the name Frank Schlatt 

before? 

A NOC» 

® Do you read the papers and listen to the radio or 

TV? 

A Yes, 

O Okay. Have you read or heard of any coverage con—- 

cerning thie particular case? 

# NO o 

# Okay. Have you read or heard anvthing about a 

robbery at the Dixie Furniture Store wherein an officer was 

shot? 

A I recall that there was one, 

+ All right, What have you read or heard about that? 

 



  

a robb 

sat of 

A The only thing that I can recall is that there was 

ery and that an officer was killed. 

circumstances and facts cause you any difficulty 

4 

able to mit on this jury as a fair and impartial juror? 

i EN PN 
Fa i) a 

0 Okay. How, would the fact ~- well, would those 

ifn LDeinyg 

{ All right. The prosecutor aight ask for the death 

penalty in this case. Do you have any attitudes or beliefs on 

A Are vou asking me if I believe in capital punishment? 

¥ Yes, sir. 

A Ye 5 1 GO ® 

0 Bll right. And would you be able to sit on 

as a feir and impartial juror with your beliefs? 

Q You would consider the evidence fairly? 

A Bight. 

iB. TURNER: Thank you, sir, 

THE COURT: Mr. Juror, please don't digcuss 

Case or any aspect of it with your fellow jurors. 

telling that to all the jurors separately as they 

the jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the 

FOO. ) 

I an 

go into 

Cour t—- 

 



  

ety es EAR R rad Px end & : 

CHE CLERK: WW, EH, Thompson, 

Ps Ct 

THE JUROR: I an retired. 

al Na 22 T3 Pa Rk Cy LF ¥s [2 

BY MBs PARKER: 

£3
 

buginess 

criminal 

Hr. Thompson, what was your occupation? 

I was in the wholesale furniture manufacturing 

And what company was that, sir? & o [ 4 

Southern Crosses Industries. 

Were you travelling or were vou stationary pretty 

Bothe I was in sales. 

Are you married, Mr. Thompson? 

Yes, I am. 

Does she work? 

BO, 8ir, 

30 you have children, sir? 

dave you ever served on a civil case 

~~ _ » 

casey 

Yes, I have, 

don't tell me what happened, but did 

come to a decision in the case? 

before Or a 

In one case, and in one case no. I have been on 

 



  

two Of 

5
 

Fa
i 

that you have worked in the furniture business, 

| 
- correct? 

A 

aver Leen 

BH 

shoot ing 

paper ar 

A 

closely a 

articles, 

them, 

£29 x 3 
Ld IK You, 

£ am EAD ive inn Win di ge, Bn Ao nam go ER He Thompson, name 1g my 

Farniture manufacturing, 

Are you 

NO, I'm not. 

familiar with the 

Bir, 

Jonn Turner. You said 

is that 

ves, 

Dixie Furniture Store? 

Have you or any of your family or close friends 

the victim of a crime? 

BO» 

Have you heard the name Prank 8chlatt before? 

130. 

Have you heard anything about the robbery and 

at the Dixie Furniture Store in terms of the news- 

radio or television? 

Ig that on Marietta Street? 

Yes, 

Yes, gir, I read it in the newspaper. 

what have you read about that? 

Just read that it heppened., I didn't follow it 

t 

was going to b 

3 

2 my 
- 

 



  

A I just read une. 

{J All right, Did you form any beliefs or attitudes 

about that as a result of reading or hearing the articles about 

the crime? 

A It was an unnecessary shooting. 

0 All right, B50 you =-- well, would that cause you to 

have any difficulty in sitting on this case? 

A Well, I think it would, ves. 

HR. TURHERs Thank you, Sir. 

THE COURT: 8ir, the question ultimately every 

juror has to face ig, with your attitudes and what you 

have read, could you sit as a fair and impartial juror 

in this case and weigh the evidence in reaching a verdict, 

or do you think that because of your belieis that you 

could not do that? 

THE JURGH: Well, I believe that -~ I don't believe 

I could be impartial, no. 

THEE COURT: All right, sir. 1 will excuse you, 

Thank vou, You may return to the fourth floor assembly 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused {rom the court- 

TOO ) 

"ey — All 

FERED #% Chrys 3p Yoel dw 3 a ga TR ov RAR 
HE CLERK: ingle We Hurd. 

THE JUROR: Tool and dye maker. 

 



  

8) Who do you work with? 

A U.B8., Tool and bye, 5600 Mason Road, Stonewall, 

Georgia, 

{ And are you a gupervisor or what, Bir? 

fi No, sir, I am just a tool and dye maker. 

0 And how long have you been in that type of work? 

. I have been with & A That type of work all my 1if 

the present company for nine years. 

Are you from that area down there? 

A Yes, sir, I live in Pine Tree Subdivision, College 

Park mailing adoress. 

v, hat is Fulton County, is that right? 

A Yes, Sic. 

{J Ave you marvied, sir? 

A Yes, sir, 

$ and do you have. children? 

A Yes, Bir. 

9, What are their ages? 

A One is eleven, one is eight. 

¥ Have you served on jury duty before? 

A Not in the state of Georgla, 

\¥ What state, 

A Texas, 

Was that a civil case or criminal case? (5: 

 



  

A It was a civil case. It's been about twenty- 

five years ago 80 I forget what it was even about. 

Q How long have vou lived in Georgia, sir? 

A Fifteen years, seventeen years, 1 came to 

Georgia in '65. That would be thirteen vears, wouldn't it? 

HR. PARKER: Thank you. 

BY MR, TURNERS: 

8; Mr. Hurd, sy name ig John Turner and 1 represent 

the defendant here, 

A I'm sorry, you will have to speak a little louder. 

3 Have you had any prior jury experience? 

A Bo, sir. 

¥ Do you have any friends, family or have you, 

yourself, been the victim of any Crime? 

A No, I haven't; however, let me inject this. I am 

+ 

& combat veteran out of World Vay 1 hoo
t 

Ld 

All right. And this -- SY
 

pre
d 

ne
 

o>
 This makes me approach things a little differently 

on this basis than most people who have never seen violence 

would do it. 

{ All right. In what recard would that cause you -—- 

A In other words, 1i somebody stuck a gun in my Lace, 
N 

my reactions would be different, I would say, "Yes, sir," until 

he made his first mistake, 

LE All right, sir. Have you heard the name F 

im 

 



  

Schlatt before? 

A Wo, I haven't, Did vou mention it this morning? 

aos gi a Jom ET Np mee Frank &chlatt? 

MR, PARKER: I believe it was mentioned. 

THE JUROR: I heard all of thew, but there were 

{3 (By Mr. Turner) All right. IX you read the news- 

papers and listen to 9V and radio? 

& I do not read the newspaper very auch. I do try to 

catch the news on TV. 

0 All right. Do vou recall having heard anything 

about the Dixie Furniture Store robbery wherein a police officer 

was shoi? 

A Bo, I do not. 

- 

right. Would you have any difficulty in sitting Q Al 

on a cage wherein those were the issues? 

A I don't think so, but there again, let me restate 

that this is one of the idiosyncrasies carried out of World 

War 1I, and it makes me mad for anybody to stick a gun in my 

face. 

% All right. 8c would the use of guns, say, be 

prejudicial to you in sitting on a case involving robbery or 

possible murder or whatever, would that cauge you to De 

» 

i? prejudiced 

A Under certain circumstances, ves; but there again A - F 4 

 



  

I haven't heard the case and I couldn't tell the 

2
 

you to have any difficulty? 

BR. PARKER: I will object to that, 

circunstances. 

Fe 
TORE HOBO » 

don't believe he can possibly answer the question, 

I will let you rephrase your one guestion, 

Mr. Juror, the question that ultimately 

THE COURT: Let me ask this one question and then 

what certain eircumstances in your mind would cause 

I 

faces every 

juror is whether they can be a fair and impartial juror, 

fair and impartial to the State and to the defendant. 

Rotwithstanding how you might feel about anything, could 

you sit as a juror in this case and listen to the evi- 

dence and judge that evidence and arrive at a fair and 

impartial verdict, whatever that verdict might be? 

THE JURCR: Yes, sir, this I can do. 

THE COURT: You haven't heard anything about the 

evidence and I haven't, either. 

THE JUROR: fees, 8iCe. 

THE COURT: He hag answered the guestion in the 

abstract, DO you want to rephrase your guestion? 

0 {By Mr. Turner) So as I understand it, your answer 

is that you can sit on this jury as a fair and impartial juror? 

A That's right. 

i Understanding that 

and robbery and sO forth? 

  

TH 
x art of the o.. » 

(8 £9 TE 3 involve Juns



  

A Violence, 

Q What attitudes or opiniong do you have On the 

A If ~~ to me, if it has been determined by the 

psychiatrist and the criminologist that a man cannot be 

rehabilitated, then I am in favor of the death penalty. 

ME. TURNER: Thank you. I have no further 

JuUestions, 

THE COURT: Mr. Juror, don't discuss your questions 

or this case at all with the other jurors, please, gir. 

Go to the jury room, 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

room. ) 

THE CLERK: Hrs. Lucile T. Shively. 

re 
THE JUROR: Housewife, 

[" 

A de is in the concrete block business. 

% Does he own hig own business? 

A Part=-owner. 

Fie 4 bE a 5 a 5 BEAT ORE ow bi gn TEE, SE SEN Soh STR Ld Does he manufacture blocks and bricks? 

£5 Right, 

wr
" or

 

=
 pr
 

~ YJ
 ot
 

Pa
w 

wi
d 5
4
 

< [4
5]
 

<i
 hildren, Hrs, Shively? 

| Jom 

 



  

ment? 

H 

Da
 

Fo
ss
 

A 

And thelr ages? 

Twenty-eight, twenty-four and 

. he Bl as 
1s the 

a 

Ph wre Sk E CO . TRE i a _ Allg what 18 the twenty 

sCHOOL? 

dave you served on 

NO» 

Have yau evayxy 

ING o 

How long have you been 

Approxirately 

Are you from this area 

HO» 

where are you from? 

Alabama. 

Ww Are you 

Re Ys NY 3 3 Vpposeaea sy ogy B 

LP . ay 
L825 p Ha 8s 

10 o 

twenty-eight year old 

been called 

conscientiously 

twenty. 

% $ x Mik A A 4 bo child married: 

twenty-four year old child? 

year old child? 

> Bat . 
VY DRIOYE& ¢ * } a

d
 

fo
 

&Y
 Po 

“© hefore? 

in the Atlante area? 

twenty vears., 

opposed to capital punish- 

 



  

ER: Thank you. 

BY MR, TURNERS 

i My name is John Turner and I represent the defen- 

dant. I have a few questions I would like to ask you, please, 

Have you ever been the victim of a crime? 

A NO 

Q What about any of your friends or relatives? 

& robbery maybe, 

¥ All right, And who was this? 

A A neighbor. 

All right. This is a robbery case, among other 

things. Would that cause you to be prejudiced or have any 

reservations about sitting on this case? 

P41 el) * 

0) 0 you have any close friends or relatives in law 

U All right. You hesitated for a second I thought 

when 1 asked you if you would have any problem sitting on this 

case because it involves robbery. Was that just a misinterpre- 

tation on my part or your answer was that you would have no 

problem? Is that still your answer? 

aten Jo
es
 

P
o
t
s
 

8 

GQ Do you read the newspapers and watch TV and 

to the radic? 

“ig 5 

 



  

A X@B, 

{J Ail right. Have you ever heard the name Frank 

schlatt before? 

A NG, 

0 All right. Are you familiar with any facts or 

clrcumstances reported in the media about the Dixie Furniture 

Store holdup wherein 2 police officer was shot? 

A KO. 

Q You have not heard of that before? 

A Ti IN 

& You say that vou are not opposed to the death 

penalty, is that correct? 

A Yes, 

{3 What attitudes or beliefs do you have on that 

subject? 

A 

& iy 
SUL L 

Well, I believe if somebody is proven guilty of a 

icient crime, that the death penalty ig warranted. 

Q All right. In your mind is proof of guilt of the 

crime sufficient? Would you consider other evidence before 

making a determination about the death penalty, other than just 

innocence or guile? 

are saving, 

= 

£5 

  

Right. 

you would leave your mind open, is that what you 

tO hear all of the facts? 

Certainly. 

—-d =



  

ax $y 
bik TURKHER: Thank you, ma'an, 

THE COURT: Hadam, 1 am telling all the jurors, 

don't discuss this case or what has been asked you with 

the other Jurors, please. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

room. ) 

THE CLERK: leonard J. Larson. 

“HE JUROR: I am a mechanic for Delta alr Lines. 

a Mr. Larson, how long have you been with Delta? 

A Ten and a half years. 

Q And what did vou do prior to that, sir? 

& UeBe Alr Force, 

£2 For how nany years? 

A FOU. 

# Did you enlist, sir? 

p:3 Yea, sir. 

{ Are you marvied, sir? 

A Bo 

QO Have you ever been married? 

A Yen, 

0 Are vou widowed or divorced? 

A Givorced, 

Q Do you have any children, sir? 

wo (GF 

 



  

A hiree., 

{ And what is the oldest child's age? 

A “hirteen this month. 

2 Are all of your children still in school? 

A Yes, 

i Have you served on a civil jury before? 

Pe NG. 

0 Have you ever served on & criminal jury? 

A HO » 

Q Have vou ever been called for jury duty at all? 

A PC 

& Are you from the Atlanta area? 

A College Park. 

{O Born and raised there? 

A Oh, no, just since I got out of the service, 

9, Where are you from originally? 

A North Carolina. 

HR. PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

a FR. STORER BY BR, TURKER: 

¥ Mr. Larson, my name is John Turner. What did you 

do in the Air Porce, sir? 

A Hechanic. 

4 All right, Have you ever had any experiences in 

law enforcement in any fashion or form? 

A HO. 

“48m 

 



  

oo
 vy $ 

enforcemn 

A 

friends. 

{ 

Schlatt 

5 

& 

news on 

$23 

the Dixi 

shot? 

pi
d 

cana 

separate 

  

Do you have any friends or relatives in law 

ent? 

Some =~= a couple of acquaintances, but not close 

All right. Have you ever heard the name Frank 

before? 

Just this morning. 

All right. Do vou read the paper or listen to the ad 3 5 

V often? 

When I get a chance. 

All right, Have you read or heard anything about 

e Furniture Store robbery wherein a police officer was 

death | g vour attitude, if any, about the A ? aN 4 

It seems to me that vou don't get repeat business. 

Then would vou have any problem in sitting on this 

it involved the application of the death penalty? 

I don't believe s0. 

All right. Would you be able to sit and view the 

on guilt and innocence and then turn around and nake, 

required, a determination on the death penalty with a 

unbiased attitude in this case? Would you be able to 

the two, 1 am saying? 

-4 Ge



  

“ 
x 

in other 

don! Ao 
[= undergtand vour guestion. 3 od 

words, if selected for this jury and you 

made a determination of guilty, the next thing that might happen 

is that the jury might have to reconsider the evidence in terms 

of what sentence to impose. Now, I am saying, would you be 

able to approach that phase of the trial with a free and unbiased 

attitude in terms of determining punishment? 

P
o
 

To
ne
d 

say 

bi) Py 
HO Fd 

FR 

HE 

that were 

form 

room. ) 

matlan, 

closed 

with 

{Wh 

go 

I believe 80. 

So despite any leanings that == would it be fair to 

hat you have leanings toward the death penalty? 

I don't think I lean that way. 

PURNER: Thank you, 8ir. 

COURT: Mr. Juror, don't discuss the questions 

asked you and don't discuss this case in any 

LE Vo) 

the other jurors. 

ereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

SEY dP 

LERK: Bdna Walls. 

JUROR: 1 an & nurse. 

COURT: Speak up a little louder, please, 

JURCR: I am a nurse. At the present my job is 

win and I am doing lab work, lab technician. at 

the present. 

 



  

Re PARKER: 

43 Are you & registered nurge? 

& LPH, 

# LPH? 

A Yes, sir. 

o And how long have you been doing that type of work? 

A About twelve years. 

5) And when you say your job closed out, were you doing 

private nursing? 

A Mo, sir, working at a hospital, 

(} Any particular one: 

A Ft. McPherson Army Hospital, 

% Were you employed by the Pederal Government at 

Ft. McPherson? 

A That's right, 

£ And you axe a lab technician now at Ft, HCPherson? 

A That's right, 

Q You still work then for the Federal Government? 

A Yes, sir. 

% & Are you married, Hrs. Walls? 

A Yeas, 1 am. 

$ what does vour husband do? 

A He grades lumber, works in a lumber compa 

§ 2% 3 «gon i . pe $ ng - “ Ao ogy oo 3 A He works in a lumber company. 

 



  

thing? 

£% 

PEN 

£3 
ky 

you 

your opposition 

over your 

to vote 

Which one? 

Cobb County, 

one of the big na 

I wouldn't know. 

Do you children? have 

Ho, 8ir. 

Have you ever served on jury duty before: 

Naver have. 

And have you aver been called before? 

an excuse, 1 had been working. 

gonscientiously 

panishunent? 

hips sf 2 5, py gr oe 5 gh ura oh fa $y % hon be pe oe o Do I oppose to capital punishment? 

opposed to ‘am. Are you conscientiously 

punishment? 

Yes, I am. 

that opposition to 
" 

Would capital punishment cause 

against giving somebody the death penalty due to 

to it? 

150» 

Pardon? 

la you vote to give someone Lhe deal 

5 

Qajectlions to 

 



  

A Conld 

please? 

Q IL 

gullty and your 

sider the possibility of 

A I would consider 

THE. 

THE 

THE 

BREE {i 
FS BN 

3% 4 TT) LT 3 ER EY HR, TURNERS: 

A HO, 

i What about any of 

A, HO. 

8 All 

Dixie 

»
 

po
si
 

bd
 

you were given two choices, 

Furniture 

heard 

1 vote -- would you ask 

- 

if you found a 

two choices were life and death, could vou con- 

of the alternatives? 

COURT: I can't hear you, ma'an. 

JUROR: I would consider it. 

COURT: You would consider it? 

JUROK: Yes, I would try to consider 

¥ Thank you, ma'am. 

J Have you ever been the victim of a crime before? 

sir, I haven't, 

vour close friends or associates? 
ol 

right, Have you read or heard anything about 

Store robbery wherein a police officer was 

about 

recall what you heard about it? 

just listened at people talking in the lab 

and this and that, they heard someone got Killed, 

$ Based upon those conversations would you be able to 

 



  

A I didn't hear you, 

tl I say, based on the conversations and what you have 

read or heard about, would vou Le able to sit as a falr and 

impartial juror in this case and listen to the evidence as it 

comes from the stand? 

A 1 suppose 80, but just listening to what other 

people would say. 

Q Have you formed any opinions or attitudes as a 

result of what you have read or heard other people say? 

Let me ask you another ways. Do you know Of any 

reason why you couldn't sit as a fair and impartial juror in 

this case? 

A Ho, I don't, 

0 Would you be willing to sit as a fair and impartial 

juror in this case? 

HR. TURMER: Thank you, ma'an,. 

THE COURT: Madam, don't discuss any aspect of this 

case with the other Jurors. 

THE JUROR: Yen, Sir. 

¥ THE COURT: Co to the jury room, please, 

(thereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

YOO } 

 



  

FRET A re DRS HE ww gow ke a —  Y BE i HE Sn THE CLERK: Hrs. Marguerite Bbohler. 

1 Do you work outslde the home? 

A 168, 

Wl What do you do? 

& For the Federal Reserve Bank. 

i Downtown? 

A Yes, 

U What do you do with then? 

A I work in the Savings Bond Division, 

Q And how many years have you been there? 

A About thirty years. 

0 I'm sorry? 

A About thirty years, 

Q And what does lr. Bohler do? 

A fe ig an attorney. 

44 And does he still practice? 

GG And is he by himself or with a firm? 

A de is Dy himself. 

¥ Where is his office located? 

A In East Point. 

& He doesn't have anybody in the office with him? 

A NO. 

 



  

Does he aver represent people charged with 

A Hinor crimes. 

£3 Have you ever gone to the courtroom to listen to 

him? 

i Hi Tn BR 

iJ Does he ever discuss his cases with you? 

A Rarely. 

Q I you ever try to pry it out of him? 

», Has he been practicing law for a number of vears? 

Q And do you have any children? 

4 dave you served on jury duty before? 

A i have been called but I have never served, 

# Mre. Bohler, are you conscientiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

A 0 

Er be PER dr Re Fy RETTIG. 19) ” fay 4 23 wy 

File PARALNS SOANK YOU, Ma ali. 

5 BY MR. TURNER: 

# My name is John Turner and I represent the defendant 

here, Have you or any of vour friends ever been the victim of 

a erine? 

5 L
H
 

Ld
 & 

 



  

* po vou read the newspapers, watch TV and listen 

to the radio much? 

A I listen to the TV news fairly regularly. 

Q All right. Do you recall whether or not you have 

heard anything about the robbery of a Pixie Furniture ptore 

wherein a police officer was shot? 

A I have a vague recollection of just hearing some- 

thing about it, but I don't remember any details, 

As a result of what you might have heard ox seen, 

es
, 

4 
i
 

do you have any prejudices resting on your mind now that would 

not allow you to sit as a fair and impartial juror? 

A 1 don't believe s0. 

MR. TURNER: I have no further questions, Thank 

YOu. 

THE COURT: Madam Juror, when you go in the jury 

room don't discuss any of the questions that were asked 

you or any aspects of this case with the other JULOL SE. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court=— 

room, ) 

THE CLERK: Ponald 0. Hudgins. 

THE JUROR: I work for Sears Roebuck and Lompany. 

RT EY EL A PEEP EY BY Mi. PARKEH: 

1 Sears what, sir? 

A sears at Jefferson Street. 

 



  

A
 

So
nd
 

Fark. 

» 

And what do you do with them over there, sir? 

I am an inspector, a quality inspector. 

And how many years have you been with Sears? 

Hineteen, 

How many years over at Jefferson Street? 

Off and on about ten years. 

And are you married, Mr, Hudgins? 

Does your wife work outside the home? 

L She owns her own business. 

rk
 

What type of business is that, sir? 

It's a floor and wall covering business in Forest 

noes she sell and also install carpet? 

No, sir, she is a -- she sells and coordinates the 

colors and things like that, she is a decorator. 

& 

the carpet? 

so 
Fa 

Does she have people that work for her that install 

WF a . % 
W228, B 1¥ « 

Are they actually her employees, sha hires them? 

No, sir, they are subcontractors. 

bo you have children, sir? 

And what is the oldest child? 

Sixteen. 

 



  

{J Ig he or she still in school? 

’ 

®] Have you served on jury duty before? 

A eg, Bir. 

y “3 3 oh 3 
{ Civil case? 

vey 
{3 Criminal case? 

* & Yo I dan 

£4 2g Bll 

(3 Bow long ago was that, sir? 

A AbOut three vears ago. 

0 Are you from the Atlanta area? 

A Bagt Point. 

A Yes, Sit. 

"s Bf ge yor rs es ow 3 a nian ARR go 2 on ’ 2 wh Ge go) TALI el 
Ld FINA 3 You gongdientious iy LPO Be Lo Ce i tal Pun iB 

ment? 

# oN os Foam 
kh CELE | Bie 

A % i 3 ER hh il te FUE $s ¢ “se ow 
Ville FPARMALIS LENE YOU, 81T., 

yr % POEYEY 1 
£2 MP oo STANT AL ANS 

a 3%%4 » BF a wt ig SO ra IER a Sp dala gy J Pe Your ma & us ret TES a TER TROT J Og 
We ue facts of this cage involve the Dixie Furniture 

Store where a robbery ogourred and a police officer was shot. 

Have you read or heard anything about thats 

ul YF # * “5 - 

eh $8 F 5 1X ® 

9) All right. What, if anything, have you read Or 

heard about it? 

 



34 Pe FRET: Pt” 
& 

 
 

5 
reat 

 
 

me 

 
 

God 

2K» o Lov 
iY 

wi 

 
 
 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 

 
 

AL 

 
 
 
 

HELE 
¥ is 

 
 

LE 
x de 

 
 

wd WT 
¥ ak at 

RT 
A at 

a 

  

“
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 



  

{ And where are they located? 

A Technology Park, 110 Technology Parkway. 

8 0id vou help establish that business? 

A Yas, my husband is the president. 

& How long has that company been in operation? 

A FOUur vears. 

{2 And do you work actively in the business on a day=- 

to-day Lasis? 

A Yon, I do. 

ta Do you have to travel any? 

& Do you have children, Mrs. Glover? 

A Yes, I have a nine year old son, 

¢ . Is that son presently in school? 

A Fourth grade, ves, 

i
d
 

Have vou served on jury duty before? 

A Ho, I have not, 

{ Have you ever been called before? 

A Ko, I have not, 

¢ What did vour husband do prior to establishing his 

own businesg? 

A fe established two other businesses, both in com- 

puter industry. 

. And did he sell those or close them or what? 

5 Well, one of them he still owns stock in, and the ru
 

pi
 

 



  

¥ other one was purchased by another company, £80 he 18 

inactive in both the other two companies. 

& Mrs. Glover, are you conscientiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

oN 4 3S 

FR. PAREER: Thank vou, ma'am. 

MEK. TURHERS 

& Mra, Glover, my name is John Turner and I represent 

the defendant in this case. Have you ever been the victim of a 

crime? 

A HO 

3 Any of your friends or relatives 

Fo HO oe 

0 Do vou have any close friends or relatives in law 

enforcement? 

A My husband's brother just retired from the police 

force in Meridian, Hississippil. 

$ All right. Would that in any way cause you to be 

prejudiced in this particular case? 

Fa) I would think not. 

0 All right. This cese involves allegations arising 

out of the Dixie Purniture Store robbery wherein & police 

officer was shot. Have you heard or read anything in the nows= 

paper or news nedlia about this case? 

pt i 40 not renpenber 1t. 

 



  

TUREER: 

COURT: 

Or EE Ho 

in the jury room, 

(Whereupon, 

LOOM, ) 

THE CLERK: 

THE JUROK: 

Electric Company. 

PARKERS 

Jour name 

Paul Reale, 

Q I'm SOYTY. 

5 2 A Ly » 

A Yes, sir. 

». Q An 

& Twenty-three 

5 No, that's 

Q The cable 

d ne & my 36 4 

PY The caulie 

Where ware 

Hew Jersey. 

Are you 

  

is what, 

i Is that in Sandy 

you 

I was in Maryland for 

from 

iL TE Te xp % Hank you. 

drs. Glover 

it with 

Thank you. 

your 

Ho further questions, 

n't discuss this case 

jurors when you go 

the juror was excused from the court- 

Paul Ja 

gir? 

3 
LE 4 

You are 

YEEES 

BOYCrO8Ss., 

bafore 

ot 

SFA Kew 

with 

Springs 

Jersey: 

Peale. 

? 

ir. 

Era Y 
yveax F J 

hd how long have you been with 

you came LO 

ana 

Blectric, 

western 

sir? 

Norcross, sir? 

prior to that,



  

A Yen, 

0 Mrs. Reale, are you married, sir? 

A Yea, sir. 

{ And do you have children? 

ww 5 
A YEH 

{ What ig the oldest child? 

p< Pie x pe de ot 1 Th Fd Po iventy=-8ig, DOV. 

0 Is that child married? 

A 8 he married? 

£2 Yess, 

A MO» 

& Is he on his own? 

“ » 

£2)
 

A Ye b 
4 

Q Do you have any other children that are not in 

A That are =--— 

¥ fot in school? 

A I have a daughter living at home; she's twenty- 

tnree, 

Q Have you served on jury duty before? 

A I have been down here twice, I haven't been 

gelected for a jury. 

¥ This is your third time? 

A Yes, sir. 

MR, PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

 



  

£
7
 

i
 

and radio 

» 

Fw 

| 

Furniture 

case? 

off 

in any way 

being a fa 

bo
 

Or & 

Do you read the newspapers and listen to the TV 

often? 

little. very 

Have you heard or read anything about the Dixie 

Store Company robbery, which is the basis of this 

Would the fact that there was robbery and the 

icer was shot, in terns of what think the evidence 

show, cause you unable sit in this case 

as a fair impartial juror prevent you from 

ir and impartial juror? 

TURNER: Thank you. 

ny 

Tit 
No 

FE e E COURT: JUror, don't discuss this case 

ny aspects of it with the other jurors. 

Have I been selected? 

COURT 3 

(Whereupon, juror was excused {rom the court- 

TOON. ) 

  

Ral er “en 

WEE 4 Pas oi hy TT Bs 4) 3 os 
his CLERKS SON vie Holder. 

Fs w a Fe _ PURPA | en wn i ne Bn grin sm RE £74 i GPR 1 “ 
tHE JUROK? Cwner and operator of Holder Tire 

in Hapeville, 

~~ Sue



  

air? 

those 

i 

x
 

L
a
 

Juri 

Fit 

in AR 

Mre« Holder, how long have you owned that business, 

Beg your pardon? 

dow many years have vou owned that business? 

Since '57. 

. 
FS And you established it yourself, sir 

or 

Bid you form the company yourself? 

And are vou married, sic? 

Yeu, 

And how old is your oldest child, sir? 

Twenty-three. 

1s that child married? 

Hr. Holder, have you served on jury duty before? 

Yes, 

Civil cases? 

NO ©ivili cases, 

Criminal cases? 

Right. 

Don't tell me how you voted, but did that jury or 

8, were they able to come LO & decision? 

 



  

2s wn Cn 3 Be NL rik Uy | RRA, pn 4 or 4 MRas PARKER: Thank you, 8ir. 

RET MEF EY RTE YS a ty ee Xo n MR. WURKER: NO questions, 

THE COURT: All right, Mr. Juror, don't discuss 

any aspects of this case with your fellow jurors. You 

may go in the jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

YOO. 

LERKY Wayne Fo. Martin. 

HE JUROR: Computer programmer for Delta Air Lines. 

G Mr. Martin, how long have vou been with Delta? 

A Nearly thirteen years, bovember will be thirteen 

Years. 

GQ And what, do you actually draw your own programs? 

0 Where did you get your training on that, sir? 

A Prom Delta Alr Lines, 

Q Where did you go to school, sir? 

A To college or high school or what? 

O College. 

Fi Georgia State University, Abraham Baldwin Junior 

College, Clayton Junior College, and Auburn University. 

O re. Martin, are you married, sir? 

A Yes, sir. 

 



  

(J Do you have children? 

A Two girls. 

O What is the coldest girl, how 01d? 

A She's five, 

{0 Have you served on jury duty before? 

A HO, Sir. 

(2 Have you ever been called before? 

A No, 8ir. 

J You are from the Atlanta area, is that right? 

A Just for the last thirteen years. 

{J Where are you from originally? 

A South Ceorglia; Quitman, Georgia. 

MR. PARKER: Thank you. 

¥, Mr, Martin, do you have any close {friends or 

associates in law enforcement? 

A Ho ¢ 8B ire. 

Q All right, Have you read or heard anything about 

+ 

the facts of this case? You will find if you are selected 

to sit as a juror in this case, the defendant is charged with 

robbery and murder in connection with the Dixie Furniture 

Store where an officer was shot. Have you read or heard any- 

thing about the facts of this case in the news media? 

A No, sir, not to ny knowledge. 

# So this is the first time you have heard anything 

 



  

about this particular matter today, is that right? 

A Ag far as 1 know, ves, sir. 

on this case? 

A NO, 81lr. 

¥ 

Would that cause you any reservations about sitting 

5, Would you be able tO sit on this case as a fair and 

impartial juror? 

Mike TURNER: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Mr. Juror, don't discuss this case or 

any aspects of it with your fellow jurors, and you may 

gO to the jury room, 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

LOO, ) 

THE CLERK: Robert Le. Hamilton. 

THE JURCR: 1 work for the Atlanta Public School 

System as a building maintenance mechanic, 

BY MR. PARKER: 

& Atlanta Public School Syste? 

A Yes, sir. 

& What do you dO with them? 

A Building maintenance mechanic. 

Q And how long have you been with the sChool system? 

A iwenty-seven years, 

-69~ 

 



  

§) And are you assigned to a particular school? 

A Environment, I work at all schools. 

*, Are you a supervisor there? 

A Just work ag a supervisor and worker. 

Q Do you work on the heating and eirv-conditioning 

asystens? 

A That is the main j0b, 

0 Are you married? 

A Yes, sir. 

0 Does your wife work outside the home? 

A TOE, 

oO What does she do? 

A Nurse. She works for a children's nursing home. 

&, Whereabouts, sir? 

A It's Martha's Play School, preschool. 

Q Is she a registered nurse, sir? 

A HO » 

Q And do you have children of your own? 

iY Yes, 

Q How many children do you have? 

A Three. 

Q What is the oldest child? 

A Twanty—-seven, 

Q what 1s that child doing? 

A Works with a company on Industrial -- it just 

 



  

slipped ny mind. 

{} Is that child married? 

A Yes. 

G The child is on its own? 

A Tes, 

J And what is the next age of the child? 

A Twenty-four, 

OQ fihat is that child doing? 

A fie works where they make plastic bags. 

{ Is he or She married? 

A NO 

#) How about your third child? 

A She's at home, 

0 and how old is she? 

A Twenty-two, 

{ is she going to school? 

A No, she is working. 

{ Have you served on jury duty before? 

A Yes, sir, 1 have. 

#) Civil cases? 

A Civil and == well, civil cases, I guess BO, yes. 

Wa Have you ever served on a criminal case where some- 

body was charged with a crime? 

A Yes, 

Q Don't tell me what happened on the criminal case, 

 



  

the 

FY 

¥ 

church? 

A 

prevent you 

defendant's 

9% 

£5 

FY IESE 
a RB 

jury come to a in that case? 

BY era gov 

i885. 

PO you go to 

Sometimes, 

Are you a nember of any particular church? 

Yes, 

You don't have to, but do vou mind telling me which 

It's a church out of town, Saint Patillo Baptist 

membership hasn't been moved te the city. 

You say it's out of town? 

TE8 

is Wheres that? 

McRae, Georgia, 

Hamilton, are you conscientiously opposed to 

punishment? 

Opposed? 

Yes, Sir. 

Hot really. 

Your attitudes towards capital punishment wouldn't 

impartial decision as to the from making an 

guilt or innocence, would it? 

my ™ a + 4 Shi s-Y u TE 
I ag sure it would not, 

“Rs PARKER: Thank you. 

Be 

 



  

L¥) Bir, have you heard or read anything about the 

Dizie Furniture holdup wherein an officer was shot? 

Foy I don't recall, 

MRs TURNER: Ho further questions. 

THY COURT: Hr. Juror, don't discuss this case or 

any aspects of it when you go in the jury room. You may 

go in the jury room now, 

{¥hereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

room, ) 

THE CLERK: Carolyn J. Ballard. 

THE JUROR: I work for the Atlanta Board of 

Education; I am a cashier at Walter F. George High School. 

Sa hE B40 1 1 1a 
BY MR. PARKERS: 

& I'm sorry, I was busy talking. Who do you work for? 

A The Atlanta Board ©f Education, I an a cashier at 

Walter Ceorge High School. 

&; Cashier, what does that entail? 

A I just take the teacher's lunch money. 

Qo And how long have vou been doing that type work? 

A Eleven years. 

Q What does Mr. Ballard do? 

A He is a sheetmetal worker. 

£3 And where does he work? 

A He worke for Gardner & Son on Jonesboro Road. 

- y 

 



  

ET 4 . 3 i va PRE Bh 5. VEE DO you have any children? w
r
 

K
o
 

a Yes, sir. 

& How ©ld 1s the oldest child? 

A He's thirty-nine. 

¥ Is he married? 

A Yes, they are all married. 

{J A211 married? 

ey 39 - ; > ZEAE a eh RIN 23 Fo od oo AA, won at {} Have you served on jury duty uwefore? 

¥ » 
=
 

of
 

95
 

e
y
 

wo
 

ny
 F
s
 

a
a
 HS
 

¥ 

bi
 

oe?
 

B
o
t
 “ 

© ”
 Ad * [+
2 © FP 

A re
 

=
 

@ 

{] In a civil case, criminal case, or do you remember? 

A I don't remesber. 

) Mrs. Ballard, are you consclentiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

A Fo, I'm not. 

# Your attitude toward capital punishnent wouldn't 

prevent you from Reing a falry juror as far as rendering a 

verdict as to quilt or innocence, would it? 

A No, 8ir. 

{i You can be impartial? 

i
 

om
 = 5 i 
8 

-
 % " ® 

MR. PARKER: Thank you, ma'en, 

BY MR, TURNER: 

i &; Have you heard or read anything about the Dixie 

Furniture Store robbery or are you familiar with that? 

 



  

paper 

anything 

Ww thout ha 

A 

3.5 

your 

Ys LOO 

All right, Did you read 

it? 

FT 

L3T ¥y 4 3 i b's wre p £5, En 3% iy Fy TK a 5 WHAT Gia YOU near about 

Just heard 

  

All right, Then you have 

3 that @aBuiiae 

that correct? 

I do Enow thet. 

“ 
Causa 

) TREE os Fou or § oF goo ye vy ® 3 heard the evidence? 

Ny BiU 

ai EMEIT RI IR ID FR = we To » 
Res TURNERS Lani YOUa 

JASE de 2 14 Cy £4 i 
Ff i BEER AS { 

Fr TR 
Cilis LOPS §L A 

fellow jurors. 

oe (Whereupon, the 

Al TI I TI EA Lo 
anyiiing 213 

” 

tv? 

yas pea "4 < JORG 
Beard no det 

  

RG 

ar re ad 

FFE in Sb i Ea xn of FE HR AR NE al ” 4 1 
* ik Ey CLERKS ik 53 ¢ XAOS] He 

BRET CTR ITN RE EL RN a a 
eile JURORS 4 afl Go nousSewiie. 

Ty -— 

Yau HC 

aspects 

i} 8 
1 

EN : 
L® $0} ng 3 

L113 

% 2 5 
& i 

you to be prejudiced in this 

the 

T 

in that, 

Case 

jury 

 



  

does Mr. Hoore do, please? 

A He is an air traffic control supervisor. 

# And how long has he been doing that? 

A Twenty years plus, twenty-one or something. 

# bo you have children, Mrs. Moore? 

A iO F 4 5 i Le 

GQ And have you served on jury duty before? 

ir. A HNO, & 

4
7
%
 

+ #4 you from the Atlanta Metro area? 

A For the last twenty years I have been in ti = a 

{ And where were you prior to that? 

A Little Bock, Iowa. 

$ Little Rock, Iowa? 

A Yes, Sir. 

# Where is that in relation to Des Moines? 

A Northwest about 180 miles. 

Q iow about your husband, what part of the country 

is he from? 

A Carrollton, Georgla, 

Q Hrs. Moore, are you conscientiously opposed Lo 

capital punishment? 

3 NO, Bir. 

t Your attitude towards capital punishment wouldn't 

prevent you from being a fair and impartial juror, would it? 

 



  

Thank you. 

BY HR, TURNER? 

& Ma'am, what is your. educa 

please? 

A Graduate fron high school 

University 

# All xight. Ang what oour 

school? 

h What courses? 

U uid vou graduate from law 

n Yes, sir, T did; 1 have a 

8 Would your training as an 

sit on this jury as a fair and impart 

Do you think your lega 

hamper you in any way? 

A NC 

® All right. Ni 

when you were in law school? 

Fi Noy B ire 

Q Have you had courses 

A Yes, sir, 

( All right, HOw many 

A Probably two, 

don't remenber exactly. 

Re, 5 Fe 

  

courses have 

tional background, 

and John Marshall 

seg did in 

school? 

LLB Degree. 

attorney enable 

al judge of the fac 

in criminal law? 

you had? 

I graduated ten years ago and 

1 

t En} 

&W 

you to 

8? 

1 background or skills or training would 

id you specialize in any given area



    

0 You graduated ten years ago. Have you ever taken 

the Bay Exam or anything like that? 

A It has been nine years since I have taken the Bay 

EXanme 

* I guess it would be fair to say a lot of that would 

2 

be old hat now, or would it? 

A Oli FJ ves * 

¢ Do you read the newspapers and listen to the radio 

or TV much? 

A Yes, sir. 

# All right, Bave you heard anything about the Dixie 

Furniture Btore, does that ring a bell with you? = 

A HO o 

# All right. Have you heard anything or read any=- 

thing about a robbery wherein a police officer was killed at 

the Dixie Furniture Store? 

A KO, sire 

8 Okay. How, you sald you were not opposed to the 

death penalty. What, if anything, is your attitude on that 

subject? 

A The statutes of the state would reguiate, 

& All right, So, in other words, you are saying you 

don't have any particular personal point of view, you just look 

at what the law gays, 1s that right? My question to you was, 

what personal point of view, if any, do you have? 

 



  

A I do not have a personal point of view. F 4 

MRe TURNER: "Thank vou, ma'am, 

THE COURT: Hrs. Moore, don't discuss the Questions 

that were asked you or anything about the case with your 

fellow jurors. You may go in the jury room, 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

COON.) 

THE CLERK: Robert E. Smith. 

THE JUROR: 1 am assistant purchasing agent for 

C & Bb Hational Bank, 

BY HR. PARKER: 

Do you have a brother, Hr. Smith? 

A TWO. 

OG Do they practice law? 

Bank? 

a Twenty-two years. 

Q And are you married, sir? 

A Ho, Bir. 

Q Have you ever been married? 

A HO» 

{2 Have you ever served on jury duty before, sir? 

A i have, ves. 

{ Civil or criminal or Hoth? 

 



  

Both, 

Don't tell me what happe pres 
¥ 
* 

reach decisionag? 

£4 

capital 

A 

affect you 

crime? 

8 Ye Sir. 

Are you from the Atlanta 

Yes, 

Mr. Smith, are you consc 

punishment? 

PNG o 

Your attitude toward cap 

in any way in being 

I don't think so. 

Thank vou, 

What is your background, 

I completed high school, 

What were you majoring i 

In finance, 

All right, Have you eve 

Ho, sir, I haven't. 

What about any of vour r 

All right. Do have VOU 

ned, but d 

area, sir? 

ientiously opposed to 

ital punishment, would that 

a fair and impartial jurox? 

Six. 

sir, educationally? 

oneé year of college. 

n, sir? 

r been the victim of a 

elatives or close friends 

any ciose friends or 

 



  

associates 

A 

¢ 

with these 

A 

mine, they 

ment. 

n
y
 

S
u
m
 

prejudiced 

A 

Q 

surrounding
 

officer was 

be 
+ 

4 
Ty Fs

t 

the death penalty. 

who ave in law enforcenent? 

I have two, 

All right. Would you describe your relationship 

two people that you were referring to, please? 

Well, both of them are just personal friends of 

are officers with the Fulton County Police Depart- 

All right. Would that in any way cause you to be 

in this particular case? 

I don't think so, 

» 

All rights Are you familiar with the allegations 

the Dixie Furniture Store robbery wherein a police 

shot? 

HO, Sir. 

Have you read or heard anything about that? 

Not that I recall. 

You. say that vou are not conscientiously opposed to 

What, if any, personal views do you have on 

that subject, sir? 

on 

#5 

any gyuestions that were asked you with the 

You may go to 

I believe it is justified in some cases, 

MRe TURNER: Thank you, sir, 

THE COURT: Myr. Smith, don't discuss this case or 

other jurors. 

the jury room, sir. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from Cour t-— 

 



  

rOOn.) 

THE CLERK: Mra, Florence Hobley, 

THE JUROR: I work at Atlanta Federal, Service 

BY HMRe PARKERS 

Q Excuse me, I couldn't hear you. 

A I work at Atlanta Federal Savings in the Service 

8, Do you process loans? You are in savings? 

A Bavings and Loans. 

$ Savings and Loans? 

A Yes, 81ir. 

(J And do you help process loans? 

A Ho, 1 am senior teller, 

%) How long have you been with the Atlanta Pederal 

Savings Company? 

A Kine years, 

L¥, What does Mr. Mobley do? 

A He i8 a news director, WGUN. 

Q WGUN? 

A 1e8. 

0 How long has he been with then? 

A I guess about eight, seven or eight years, 

£2 And do vou have children? 

 



  

Fi I have four. 

How old is the oldest child? 3
 

1 A Bo I have to really say? 

0 No. They are all in school or married? 

A I have my youngest one which is eleven years old, 

The rest of them ave finished. 

£ Are they on their own, making thelr own way? 

A Yes. Well, one works for the State; the other 

one works in Kansas, works with the mental retarded, and nay 

gon is in the United States Navy as a petty officer. 

® is one of vour children a doctor? 

C Have you served on jury duty before? 

8 NO  ] 

@ Have you ever been called before? 

4) Hrs. Mobley, are you conscientiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

A HO » 

8 Your attitude toward capital punishment, would that 

prevent you from making an impartial decision as to a defendant's 

guilt or innocence? 

2 Bi 
£5 BO» 

FT # YA SRD PERG 3a aw fe CF dS 
Mike PAREER: ANéanes YOU, 

5 3 a I 

 



  

} Mrs. Mobley, what is your educational background, 

please? 

A I would say I had one and a half years -- 1 didn't 

finish college, 

0 Where did you go to school? 

A In Florida. 

Q What were you majoring in? 

A I was majoring in education. 

0 Have you ever been the victim of a crime? 

yi NO. 

Q What about any of your relatives or family? 

A HO» 

{ Do you have any close friends or associates in law 

enforcenent? 

& Jes, 

& All right. Who would they be? 

A Floyd Helton, 

¥ Besides that, do you have any friends who are 

police officers, investigators or anything of that nature? 

0 Do you listen to the news and read the newspaper 

ocften? 

A I don't particularly read the newspaper, I listen 

LO the news. 

Q Have you heard anything about the Dixie Furniture 

 



  

Store robbery where a police officer was shot? 

A Cnly on the news. 

0 what did vou hear about that? 

B At the time it happened, that is all. 

{2 All right, Did that form any lmpressions in your 

mind eat that time, did vou think anything about it? 

A NO, 

Q Do you have any prejudices in your mind now about 

what you have heard? 

G bo you feel you could sit as a fair and impartial 

juror in this case? 

5 Ye Be 

4. You said you were not opposed to the death penalty. 

What is your personal attitude on that, if I wight inquire? 

A On the death penalty? 

% Yes. 

A I would say that premeditated murder or something 

on that order. 

8 All right. If you were called upon as a juror, 

there will be two phases to this trial, the first one is to 

determine guilt or innocence, and if a guilty verdict is 

returned, the next phase will be to determine punishment, 

life or death, If you are selected as a juror and you vote 

guilty in this case, would you be able to deal with any 

3a el 5 DH Sanat 

 



  

evidence dealing with mitigation w 

A Yes. 

(2) -e gesplte 

feelings? 

A Yes. 

25 YS Frits eItays 

FMR. TURMHERS 

AT ENE TF 
ald COURT: 

Pe PR pr 
CLERK . 

PRET 
i Aes JUROR: 

for Nelle I wOrk 

FARKER 

F™ 8 on 
A La $1 bunne , Py ® 

Government? 

A I am a he 

rimary health clinics [ 5 

y \ iy . po i 

A Ye 5 ¥ 1 Lik) » 

{2 Have you 

a Yes 

ADOUL 

& And you 

A Divorced. 

8 Do you have 

alth worker, 

{ How long have 

twenty-nine 

are 

4 B th a fair and oper 

what you have sald otherwise about 

YOU. 

58 Mobley, don't discu this 

inne 

Dunne, 1100 Virginia Avenue, 

the Federal Covernnent. 

what do you do with the FPederal 

I help 

in the community. 

You work for the Department ©f Health, Educati 

vou worked for them? 

YEArs. 

single? 

children? 

-8 

wind 

ca 

ud 

~ at 
Bal ® 

applicants who want 

an 

with them moat of your working time? 

 



  

(2 And ave you married, Mr. Einball? 

%, LF ge 

Fa! LG0 

Q Do you have children? 

THO» 

§ iow old is the oldest child? 

A Thirteen. 

5% $y " 3 # an » x 7} 2 a» 

8 Both children in sChoOl? 

A Right. One is in grammar school and one is in 

high school. 

Q lave you served on jury duty before? 

A Yes, sir, about ten years ago. 

Q Was that a civil or criminal case? 

A Civil. 

ave you been in the military, sir? Pi
ni
 i 3 

We 4 

{ Are you from the Atlanta area? 

A Yes, Ben Hill. 

J ir, are you conscientiously opposed to capital 

punishment? 

A Do you mean the death penalty? 

9) LEH Sir. 

A 0) 

Q Your attitude towards capital punishment, that 

wouldn't keep you from making an impartial decision as to 

the defendant's guilt or innocence? 

Po a 
WF 

 



  

A HOys Bir. 

HMR. PARKER: Thank you, S81r. 

Q Have you read or heard anything about the facts 

involved in a robbery at the Dixie Furniture Store and the 

shooting of a police officer? 

A NO 

J You haven't heard one thing about it? 

A fiot one thing, not until this morning, 

THE COURT Mr. Kimball, don't discuss this case 

or any aspects of it with your fellow jurors. You nay 

go into the jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court=- 

COON. ) 

THE CLERK: Robert L. HRagle., 

a ES TAY Fann #920 PRE | % Pe THE JUROR: Jewelry dye maker. 

0 You are retired from who, sir? 

A Dye maker. 

Q Tool and dye naker? 

A YER, Bir. 

A I worked for myself. 

 



  

#, Did you own your own business? 

A Yes, 

£ What was the name of your business? 

8 Re Ls Nagle Company. 

id Uid you sell that business or -- 

A No, I still work at that trade. 

# And, Mr. Ragle, you are married, is that correct? 

A Yes, sir. 

J And ‘do you have children, sir? 

A I have & 80n. 

{ What is his age? 

A rardon? 

G How old ig he, sir? 

A He 1s twenty-eight, 

{2 And is he married? 

A Ho, he's away from home, he's an attorney with 

the State. 

$ Is he with the Attorney General's Office? 

A Ho, he is with the EEOC, something, the new 

organizations they have over there, 

& How long has he been with them? 

A Well, that organization was just planned, you 

Know, just this summer. A chap by the name of Beasley head 

that up. I don't know where he cane from, but anyway, it's 

new agency over there. 

 



  

, Have you gerxved on jury duty before, sir? 

A Ho, sir. 

& Have vou ever been called before? 

FA Several years ago I was called, about five vears 

ago, right at the very busy time that 1 had to work in my 

business and 1 asked to be excused, 

#, Gir, are you conscientiously opposed to capital 

punishment? 

A 1 have an open mind on it, I would not say I was 

for or against it, It's a thing I never thought I would be 

called on to pass On. 

0 Your attitude wouldn't prevent you from making an 

impartial decision as to the defendant's guilt or innocence, 

would it? 

A HO 

MR, PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

BY MR. TURKEK:2 

{) Mr. Nagle, what is vour educational background, 

A I have two years of college. 

O And in what area? 

A in what area? 

{Q Yes, sir. 

A Just general. 

0 Have you ever been the victim of a ¢rime? 

dd 

 



  

been 

your 

to be 

associates 

the shooting of an Cfficer Schlatt at 

  

A Of a crime? 

LJ Yes, 

8 HO, NOL personally. 
*« she 

{J All right. What about any of vour friends or p- £ “ 

A i know of friends that have been victims, you know. 

Q All right. You say not personally. Have you ever 

connected with the perpetration of a crime? 

A NO o 

LJ Mot, of course, as a defendant, but have any of 

stores, [or instance =-- how nany stores or == 

A I just have a place of business. 

LJ Has that ever been yobbed? 

A Burglarized one time, 

G All right, Now, would that in any way cause you 

prejudiced in this particular case? 

A No, I don't feel that it would. 

# All right, Do you have any close friends and 

in law enforcement? 

GC All right, Have you read or heard anything about 

the Dixie Furniture Store? 

wu 

A i saw it on the news, you know, 

¥] All right. What did you see on the news? 

A I just was aware that there was a case, you know,



  

that this officer was shot, but, you know, every nicht, just 

like this past weekend, I am aware that there was a robbery, 

you know, at the Holiday Inn or wherever. 

2 411 vight, How, did you form any impressions as 

to the guilt or innocence of the people involved in that when 

you heard thet? 

didn't know enough about it to form any. L
o
 

F
y
 

ed
 

2 All right. Do you have any impressions today on 

that now? 

A Hoe. It's been some months ago and with all the 

other problems of trying to survive, it is kind of melted out 

of my mind. 

MR, TURNER Thank you. 

HE CQURT: Mr. Nagle, don't discuss this case or 

ny aspects of it wit! we
t your fellow jurors, and you may go 

to the jury room, 

(Whereupon, the juror wags excused from the court- 

TOON. ) 

THE CLERK: Donald Ge. Gosden. 

HE JUROR: I work for I.B.H., a8 & business 

planner. 

Fi bi 1% oe AF Eat 
8Y Mie PARKER: 

ny BY an 0 Wek, SRI 
# Hr e+ Gosden? 

» Pon 2 ca 
H Gosa ile 

 



  

A 

products 

Atlanta 

£5 

£ 

W 

  

wWenty-one years, 

planner do, 

work on forecasting the business potential for new 

= - an i 
£071 Iaele 

rogt of that 

Wo, only the last four years 

Germany 

u married, 

children? 

nineteen, 

that child 

the other children in 

- EA
 

before? you ever



    

6 You just were not selected? 

A That's correct. 

4 Are you conscientiously opposed to capital punishe 

ment, slg? 

Fo) Ne, sir. 

# Would your attitude keep you from making an 

impartial decision as to the defendant's guilt or innocence? 

A i don't believe so, 

HRs PARKER: Thank you, sir, 

LT SX ARE en FB lh 
Pd HiRes A UIBISE NS 

¢ flava you ever had any experience in law enforcement 

in the military or otherwise? 

A Ho, Sir. 

{ All right, Do you have any close friends or asso~ 

clates in law enforcenent? 

£3 Okay. Have yor heard anything about the robbery 

Furniture Btore wherein an officer pL .
 

t
d
 

pA
 

PR
 

~
 

E
2
5
 and shooting at the I 

A i read a newspaper article, 

Fo 2 w 4 ov Fa ge a a 5 joe J km on 4% 3% o in gn poo Ey be Be x A & Ali Yight. How many articles did you read on that, 

if you can recalls 

A Several, perhaps half a dozen, 

i 

 



  

i | All right. As a result of reading those articles 

did you form any opinions, attitudes or beliefs about this 

case? 

A I don't believe so, 

8, All right. Would you be able to sit as a fair and 

impartial juror in this case today? 

A Yes, 

#, All right. What is your opinion or belief on the 

death penalty? 

kb I believe it is appropriate, I guess: I don't 

have any moral objection to it. 

O When you say you believe it is appropriate, in 

& Fo
rd

 

—
 

€3
 

} 3
 3 on
 

2 £5
 5 f¥
 

.
 © Hi a

 & a!
 

= & ¥
 

i
 GO you mean, or is that a blanket 

statement? 

A I would say it's a blanket statement, yes. 

(4 All right. Well, does that mean you have a leaning 

more towards capital punishment than away from it, or how would 

you characterize it? 

Pa
g 

o>
 or
 La
 

-~
 

Wi
 bably slightly away on a balance, 

Hike WURWER: Thank you, sir. 

E COURT: Hr. Gosden, don't discuss this case or 

any aspects of it with your fellow jurors, ahd vou may ¢o 

to the jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror wag excused from the court- 

roo. ) 

 



  

idk CLERK? Miss Barbara J. Westone 

THE JURGR: 1 work for Davison's Department Store. 

marker. 

ER 

How long have you been with Davison'e? 

About eight years, 

And you do what witn them, a marker, you say? 

Is that pricing merchandise? 

Yes. 

Have you ever been married? 

BO o 

Have you ever been called for jury duty before? 

dave you ever served? 

Civil case, criminal case? 

I guess it was criminal. 

Fardon? 

I think it was criminal. 

Was it where someone was charged with a crime? 

a ou = Rr | oe | gn 0 rh a 

it was a misdemeanor. 

A misdepeanor? 

 



  

& Are you from the Atlanta areca? 

Fol tow I live here in Atlanta, 

¥ Where were you raised? 

A In Fayette County. 

L¥ How long heve you been in Atlanta? 

A ADOUtL seven Years. 

Q Do you regularly attend church? 

A Yes. 

w
r
 

a
d
 

J
 

Ma
 Q eg OQ & Lt
 pind telling me which one? You don't have 

A (ii, yes, Pentecostal, 

{2 How, Miss Weston, aye you conscientiously opposed 

to capital punishment? 

Fa Yes, 

8, Your opposition towards capital punishment, would 

that cause you to vote against it regardless of what the facts 

the case might ba? 

po 

A Yes, I would say so, because of & bs
. o

d 

ie doctrine of our 

church, We have a manual that we go bv, 

J Does your church doctrine oppose capital punishment? 

a 50 vou would oppose the imposition of capital 
a 

nt aed Prebook 341 Y Onn ta \ 8 Sei ae g., RI Ny 434 
yunishient regardless of what the facts would be? 

O You would not even conglder that as one of the 

 



  

alternatives? 

A, Ho, I wouldn't, 

THE COURT: MT. 

ask? 

HRs TURNERS HO 

THE COURT: Hiss 

this case, 

TURBER: 1 h 

a right to sit on the 

Turner, any questions you want to 

guestionag from ne, 

weston, I will excuse you from 

ave an ohijection to that. She has 

case regardless of what her attitude 

igs If the learned prosecutor wants to use one of his 

strikes to strike her, 1 think that would be proper, 1 

have seen nothing that says she c<¢an't git, 

TilE COURT: The Court is not passing on the attitude, 

Iam taking it on what she sald. Uo either one of you 

have any lav you want to subnit to me in this regard? 

MRe TURNER: 1 have no law at hand right now. All 

I can say is 1 have heard nothing that she said to indicate 

a lack of ability to 8 it as a juror, If the Court excuses 

her, I would like to note for the record my objection at 

this time, 

THE COURT: Yes, sir. BHMiss Weston, I will excuse 

you, and I suggest you go. to lunch and report back to the 

jury room on the fourth floor at five minutes of two. Be 

gure and tell them when you get back where vou have been 

and veport back there in an hour, 

 



  

BY 

electronics 

§ 
* M ® a 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from 

LOO ) 

HE CLEKE: Robert Ce. Sesrs. 

THE JUROR: Chief building in 

PARKER: 

{ Where is your office located? 

A in the Pulton County ade 

6 The building back behind 

Yes, sir 

thie oo 

ninistration Bullding. 

® 

4, And how long have you been with the County? 

¥ Balt, 

Q FOUr years? 

A FOE, 81k 

do prior to that? 

0
 # 

» 

was an engineer at Lockheed 

x 
engineer 

a good number of years? 

Georgia Company, 

A Ten Vesrs. 

{ and how about before that, sir? 

A Usie Alr Porce for twenty~four vears. 

Q Did vou retire from the U.S. Air Porce? 

A 168, Si» 

5 hat did you do with the Air Force, sir, were 

WY 

oh 

you 

 



  

a pilot? 

Mo
y 

pa
 

ERE FOF Sete 
BLLLICEL » 

# 

A 

Q 

A 

Cages 

Q 

or innocent, but 

more 

reach a de 

a pilot, but primarily a communications i was 

Mr, Sears, are you married, sir? 

Yes ¢ Bir. 

Do you have children? 

Four children. 

all of those children married or on their own? 

They are all on their own, two are marvvied, 

y 

But all are on their own? 

Gir. 

Have you served on jury duty before? 

and several criminal 

Don't tell me how the criminal juries decided, but 

:¢ision? Don't tell me whether it was guilty 

1 want to know, did they come to ‘a decision? 

I don't believe 80, It's quite a few years ago and 

or less forgotten how it came out. 

enter the Air Force in 19407 

Did you enlist, sir? 

No, 1 graduated {rom West Point and went straight 

~100- 

 



  

into the Air Force. 

be! Z0U are a west Point graduate? 

A Yes, sir, 

Mie PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

i dave you read, sir, or heard anvthing about the 

Dixie Furniture Btore robbery wherein a police officer was 

shot? 

A I heard about it on the radio, ves, sir. 

¢ What did you hear about it? 

A Just == that 1s about all, that an officer was shot, 

and 1 don't remenber any more details, 

£2 All right. Would you be able to sit as a falr and 

inpartial juror in this case? 

. Fo 
p23 ies . 

{2 Okay. Would you be able to sit as a& fair and im- 

partial jurer in this case despite the fact that vou are 

employed by Fulton County? 

a Yeu, 

g Okay. Po you know the Distict attorney =- 

£ Hoy BAL 

Q -= Lewis Slaton? 

& HO 

Q Lo you know any of the courtroom personnel here? 

A NG, Sit.  



  

¥ re 

you 

the 

£ivke Then you never have had any dealings with a
 

Fa
 

Parker or the Judge or anyone else? 

Fa! HO ’ 8 i Te 

(2 Okaye What is your opinion on the death penalty, 

A On what? 

LQ The death penalty. Do you have an opinion or are 

opposed tao 1t? 

A 1 have no objections to the death penalty. 

) what, if anything, is your personal opinion, if 

can state it for us? 

A I think the death penalty has useful purpose in 4%
 

Rost Severe cages, 

HRs TURNER: No further questions. Thank you. 

THE COURT: Mr. Juror, please don't discuss this 

case or any aspects of it with vour fellow jurors, You 

may go to the jury room, sir. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused {rom the court- 

THE COURT: Gentlemen, we have called twenty-four 

jurors. We'll have to call forty-nine jurors, as I 

figure it, plus any that are excused, and we'll take a 

recess how and be back here at two o'clock, 

(Whereupon, a recess was taken for the noon hour.) 

reir r 8 " 5 EE Fo ~ yr 
Tin COURT: Adi T1G hte Let's call the next juror. 

 



  

THE CLERK: figs Jessie De. Horne, 

Ey 

THE JUROR: Richway, Customer Service. 

Fv y Ls Lg Pel a 

BY Flite FARK ESS 

# I didn't hear you. 

A Richwayv, Customer Service. 

0 Which store do you work at? 

A Downtown, 

2 The one on Broad Street? 

¥ How long have you been with them? 

By
 

ww
 Four VyeRrs. 

{ What did you do prior to that? 

Bh A student. 

J Did you go to college? 

% Which one? 

2% Clark. 

% bid you graduate? 

{2 What were vou majoring in? 

A Clinical dietetics. 

(3 Are you single? 

A Yes. 

i Have you ever served on jury duty before? 

+) « gy + r
e
 

-103- 

 



  

{2 flow long have you been in Atlanta? 

A Eight years. 

8; were you born and raised here? 

Fo) HQ a 

Q Where were you born and raised? 

A In Vidalia, Ceorgila. 

¥ Miss Horne, are you conscientiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

Ft
 LQ If you were given two alternatives, that is, life 

or capital punishment in a particular case, could you consider 

the death penalty between the two alternatives? 

Foy Yes, 

QO Your attitude towards capital punishment wouldn't 

prevent you from belng & fair and impartial juror as to the 

guilt or innocence in this case? 

A NO 

MR, PAREER: Thank you. 

BY HMR. TURNER: 

Q ave you read or heard anything about the robbery 

at the Dixie Furniture Store? 

A Just on the news, 

¥ All right, What did you hear? 

A I don't even remember, 

Q kay. Do you know of any reason why you couldn't 

~104~ 

 



  

BY MR. 

case or anything about it with 

YOu may go to the 

(Whereupon, 

room, ) 

THE CLERK: 

THE JUROR: 

PARKERS 

What does 

4 He is a 

A Yes F 3 ir @ 

££ {dre 1 me Baan ge 
WW LOW On EEE 23 

Yes, threo, 

what is 
Row 8 

SAT50 

A Thirteen, 

O What is the 

A Thirty-four 

”™
» pas
es Py
 

Thank you. 

Madan Juror, 

jury room. 

the juror was excused 

Mrs. Agnes Awtrey. 

Housewife. 

Mr. Awtrey do, pleage? 

he 

twenty-one vears, 

the youngest child? 

oldest one? 

them? 

air and impartial juror? 

don! 
4 

t discuss this 

the other jurors. 

from 

Do you have any children, Mrs. Awtrey? 

the 

He works for the Postal Service, carrier. 

\¥ The thirteen-vear-old is still in school? 

~105~- 

a Fo
 

# $1} a
l
 rim 

 



  

A Yes, 

8, What is the next one's age? 

é I have one twenty-five and one thirty-four. 

GQ The one twenty-five, is that child married? 

5 Mo, he don't live at home, 

{ Is he working? 

a IT.8.0M, 

0 Have you served on jury duty before? 

A Ho, Sir. 

0 Have you ever been called before? 

Yes, Bir. be 

* 

Q Are you conscientiously opposed to capital punish- 

ment? 

A Ho, Bir. 

Q (our attitude towards capital punishment, would that 

prevent you from being a fair and impartial juror == 

A 146 ? fad i Ag 

LJ -= in determining the guilt or ianocence of the 

defendant? 

A Ho, sir. 

8 You could be fair and impartial? 

jo RP BA WD IY « % > 39 
Ae PARKERS JOank you, 

¥ What is vour work background, please? 

-106~ 

 



  

A I am 8 bookkeeper. 

0 All right, go ahead, 

A Just accounting, that is the only position. I 

retired last year. 

Ld From the County, you say? 

Fi) Ho, accounting, 

9) Wag that the only job you have ever held? 

A For thirty-three years. 

{J Okay. Have you ever been the victim of a erime? 

pA Ho, sir. 

0 What about any of your family or friends? 

A No, sir. 

{4 Do you have any cloge friends or relatives or 

agsgociates in law enforcement? 

A HO sir. 

A Okay. Have you read or heard any news reports on 

this particular case? 

A No, sir. 

Q Okay. Arve you familiar with in any way the circum- 

stances of this particular case? 

A Kothing but what he read this morning. 

G Okay. Have you heard anything or read anything 

about the Dixie Purniture holdup? 

A Ohy ves, I didn't == 

Q What did vou read about that? 

-107~ 

 



  

£5 

news and TVs 

Which 

A where 

0 OKav. 

hension of any of 

A HO ' 8 

L¥, wall ’ 

the guilt or innocence of anvone 

a result of the 

el) g 
i i 

Pa! 

2V that much. 

PRG A a8pecLs OI 

(Whereupon, 

room, ) 

THE 

fh © 

Hig 5 § 

B5Y MR. PARKER: 

{3 Which 

A Cotton 

G Cotton 

  

reports 

Léecause 

COURT s 

CLERK: 

JURORS 

heard was what was 

was what? 

wag shot. he 

well, did you hear anything 

che individuals involved? 

did you form any 

in connection 

that heard? You 

I don't read that much 

Thank you, ma'am, 

it with your fellow jurors. You may 

the juror was excused from the 

Karianne Hahser., 

I work for an insurance agent. 

insurance agency do you work for? 

States. 

States? 

1 E 

alzout the 

opinions or attitudes 

wi th tha 

Madam, don't discuss this cage or any 

on the 

about 

£ f
o
 

rr
 

£, 4 

-- 

go to the 

Cour te



  

“@ 
* 5

 

i
 ent £9 

I's
 

ment? 

that 

A That is the Whitley Insu 

of Cotton HStates, 

1%, And what do vou do for h 

oh a secretary. 

QJ What does Mr. Bahgser do? 

A He is an architect. 

is he self-employed? 

A Ae is with the Atlanta 8 

And how long has he been 

About sixteen years, 

Q Do you have children? 

A TWG boys. 

Q And thelr ages? 

Twenty-two and twenty-fo 

Are they both married an 

A tne married. 

0 Both on their own? 

A One in school, ves. 

Q liave you served on jury 

A MNO» 

9. Are you conscienticusly 

A HO 

§ Your attitude towards ca 

from being a fair a prevent vou 

School 

of 

rance Agency, he is an 

Board. 

with thon? 

Ur 

OwWwny their 5 3&3 

duty before? 

opposed to capital punish=~ 

pital punishment, would 

nd impartial juror as to 

 



  

the guilt or innocence of a particular defendant? 

H 443 @ 

MK. PAREER: Ti 

BY BR. TURNEK? 

{3 What is your educational background, please? 

A I am a high school graduate, 

Q Have you worked any place other than with the 

A Other than the insurance agency? 

0} Bight. 

Q Where else have you worked? 

A The Veterans Adminigtration some vears ago. 

“ 4 In what capacity 

A secretary. 

a All right. Any place else? 

A Yes, 1 have worked for a dentist. 

# All right. DO you have any close friends or 

associates in law enforcement? 

A bo. 

LJ Have you ever been the victim of a crime or any 

of your friends Or associates or relatives? 

A Our house was broken into one time. 

GC Alli right, Would that in ahy way cause you to be 

prejudiced in terms of sitting on this jury? 

~1106~ 

 



  
 
 

 
 

 
 
 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

 
 

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go to the jury room. 

(Whereupon, 

EO0m. ) 

Odell Watkins, Jr. ’ 

Lockheed Alyxcraft Company. 

£) Mr. Watkins, how long have you been with 

A Pilteen years, 

& And what do you do Log¢khead, sir? 

A Router operator. 

0 what does that entail? 

A deg your pardon? 

does that entail? What 

Ohiy that 1s a machine that routes parts 

to the table and the router 

e¢ and it makes the certain configuration of a part. 

Q Are you married, sir? 

A Yes, 

+ Lo you have chidren? 

A Yes, 

$3 How many children do you have? 

around 

  

the juror was excused from the court- 

Lockheed? 

tO a tool. 

the 

 



  

ment? 

A, 

w
s
 

SO
F,
 

Po
re
 

b
e
 

\ 

How old is that child? 

Wine. 

Is that child in school? 

Yes, Bir. 

Have you served on jury duty before? 

HO, Biv. 

hever been called before? 

be ao TEE oN 
HO E10» 

» 

ere’ a
 

ow
 Were you born and ralsed 

Yes, sir. 

Are you congclientiously oppoged to capital vunigh=- 
 § lh 2 

Rk Ol rE Pr ie Ea TD ety . Bag your pardon? , # 

Are you eonscientiously opposed to capital punish- 

Po 

El 

If you were sitting on a jury and you found a 

defendant guilty and you had two options, death or life, would 

you consider the possibility of death? 

FN 

| 

being a 

of he 

L) 

Yes, I would, 

And your attitude, would that prevent you from 

fair and impartial juror as to the guilt or innocence 

=F on ofS = TS 

Geiengant’ 

 



  

BY HE, 

“4, 

®, 

Furniture 

{ 

with 

air 

or any aspects of it with your 

nay 
- 

§ Okay. 

that cause 

and 

= 3 a 3 oe 
£% Le) FJ BLY 

54% RE DEE #yi] wy Yr as i 
HRs PARKER: ran WEILL Sil e 

Las JE RE AR BFE 5 PS 
fF 3 Ri adh 8 

Have you read or heard anything Dixie 

Store robbery wherein a police © was shot? 

Would the fact that the accused is charged 

be unable to sit in this case as a vou to 

partial juror now? 

HO. 

MR. TUBKER: Thank YOU. 

Mr. watkins, don't discuss this 

fellow jurors, and 

Pe gO to the jury room, 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused {rom the court- 

YOO, ) 

of the 

  

THE CLERK: Rollin C. Sharpe. 

THE JUROR: My name is Rollin C, Sharpe. 1 work 

for Colonial Pipeline Company. 

PARKER: 

£7 Bol ae 5% a Yeas ob Be om As wrénis 3 with C¢ 1 ny jal ? 
L BE es OiI&Y | 945 7 wig QQ YOu GL WwW 03 LOL0OHhid8x 

A I an in the Purchasing Department and have charge SE 

aR 
materials, 

Q How long have you been with them, sir? 

=114~-



  

A Since 1971. 

{ What did you do prior to that, sir? 

A I worked for -=- I originally worked for Sinclair 

Pipeline Company, and then they were part of Colonial Pipeline 

Company, and then I went back to Sinclair and then BP 0il 

Company during the two years in between, 

£2 You pretty much have been in the pipeline businessg —- 

A Yes, sir. 

0 -= #1) your working life? 

A Since '61l. 

2 Are you married, Hr, Sharpe? 

x ™ N 

A Yes, sir. 

{Q And do you have children? 

R
i
 3

 
he
 Yes, sir, three. 

£2 What are their ages? 

hy All married, yes, sir. 

® lave you gerved on jury duty before? 

A Yes, sir. 

, Civil casas? 

A RO, 8ir, 

{ Criminal? 

FEY Te8, 81r. 

2 pon't tell me how the criminal cases were decided, 

“ll5=- 

 



  

Dut 

  

were you able to come to a decision in those cases? 

A Yes, 

Thank you. 

MB, TUKHEN: No questions. 

“HE COURT Mr. Sharpe, don't discuss this case 

or any aspects of it with your fellow jurors, and vou 

may go the Jury room, 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the 

YOON. 

THE Hiss Carol A. JERE S 

Cay rental for manager 

a Lincoln-Mercury 

PARKEXK 

cay rental == 

A Cary rental panager., 

U For a Lincoln-dervcury dealership? 

) Right. 

&. Which one? 

A Willet,. 

#, De Know Fr. vou bergerman? 

& ¥eg, I do. 

OQ Do you work for him? 

A Lo, I don't, we are counterparts. 

0 Are you from the Atlanta area? 

court-



  

ment? 

that prevent you from being a 

the qu % 
Ae 

A 

Yes, I am. 

were you born and raised here? 

Ko, J have been here about five years. 

And where are you from? 

Chattanooga, 

Bid you go ‘to school down here? 

to, I didn't. 

Did you go to college? 

Where? 

University of Tennessee, Knoxville. 

Did you graduate from there? 

Yes, I did, 

And what did you major in? 

Home economics, merchandising. 

Have you ever served on jury duty before? 

Are you gonsclentiously opposed to capital 

NOs I'm nots 

You're attitude towards capital punishment, Fa & 

pr 
3 

be
 

Ng : Fe a AR ov Pr HROTEY > GRIER. BPN - 
OF innocence afl a defendant? 

I don't believe it would, no. 

22 CHEE ab be B Fists » py £4 a dhe 3 ville PARKER: Thank YOu, 

-il?- 

punish~ 

would 

air and impartial juror as to 

 



  

6 Have you read or heard anything about the Dixie 

Furniture Store robbery and the officer who was shot in that? 

apout 

juror 

A I read a little bit about it in the newspaper. 

4 PO you recall what you read? 

A Just what had happened very vaguely. 

# Did you form any opinions or attitudes or beliefs 

the guilt or innocence of anyone as a result of that? 

A Not to my knowledge, no. 

0 Do you think you could sit as a fair and impartial 

here? 

A Yes, I believe so, 

% Any reservation in your mind about that? 

A No, sir. 

MR. TURNER: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Miss James, don't discuss this case or 

any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may go 

to the jury room, 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court-— 

LOOM ) 

THE CLERK: John FF. McCadden, 

THE JUROR: I am an English graduate student at 

Georgia State University, presently not enrolled, and I 

am employed part-time as a waiter in a restaurant 

-118~- 

 



  

downto 

b 4 1S * 

MR Le FARREE 

there? 

Fi 
Va 

in the morni 

the Veterans 

Wile 

8 | 

23 {£5
 

£7
 

S
a
d
 

~
 jen, what restaurant is that? 

pe 
fo PN TR a Dy gw RRR reasant at 555 

that while Was say part-time, you 

Yes, it is, 

What Kind of hours you normally work d& 

from 4130 to 1:08 My ‘hours are generally 

Ne 

Are you from the Atlanta area, Mr. McCadden? 

ws LJ wi 

Peachtree Street, 

are in 

Originally Alabama; Tuskegee Institute, Alabama, 

Were you born in Tuskegee? 

your father teach there? 

Ho, he is employed as 

Administration Hospital there, 

Gg i» - 2 a SH Ae FT of pet 
WOW, at'e YOu Barrie g 3 ir? 

Ho, I'm not. 

Have vo ty served on fury dutv before? 
Sav 2 hd ol Li eve  #g HE 3 V hd Of) i | [9.84 - & [#1 % LE % p36 3 0 LI 

ie Vel e 

been in Atlanta, sir? you 

Lhls summer, 

2 8 

will it before 

-11 

Le YOu graduate, 
3 ” 

Sar 2 P, 

an educational therapist at 

 



  

A AC my present rate, another year, 

Q Has most Of your college work been at Ceorgia 

State? 

A lo, it has not, only this. #Hy undergraduate degree 

ig from the Univeristy of the Scuth in Sewanee, Tennessee. - 4 

£ Are you working on your Hastex's Degree? 

A That's correct. 

§ Were you in the Pealinary at one time? 

A HO. 

8, How did you happen to pick Sewanee? 

A I went to high school at Saint Andrew's School 

which also ig on the same npountain with the University of the 

South, although I did not go directly to Sewanee from Baint 

Andrew's, 1 trangferred in my sophomore year. 

A MI o MeCadden, are you congcientiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

A I can’t really say that I have given capital punish- 

ment & great deal of thought, but if I were to be présgsed on the 

point, I would have to say there would be lots of elements to be 

taken into consideration, 

0 And what would you want to take into consideration? 

A I can't really say that 1 am prepared to answer 

that. I guess --~ 1 don't know, I don't know. I guess == I con- 

« 

gider that every facet Of ‘justice has several shades and it 

would just depend. It would depend «= it would depend. 

 



  

Fb, wn wn Te 
Thani 

  

YOU, 

NO guestions. 

MeCadden, don't discuss 

™ oh BS wu og He pis ary 8 Or any aspects of it with your fellow jurors, 

FOO’ 

(Whereupon, the juror wag excused 

room.) 

(} And who ave you a salesman for? 

company called Picker X-ray. 

ry v4 "a 

4% R=ray @ 

& Be wy od ed Tat # y bd ~ gw x bn 8 ” Q And do you sell X-ray machines? 

Bil « 

0 How long have you done that, sir? 

A POUr vears. 

{; dow long? 

2X FOUL years. 

& And what did you deo prior to working with 

A=ray? 

and prior was with the buPont Company. 

anda 

from the 

LP) is go 5 yau may 

Cour fe 

6g BRETT. o 
PLCKEX 

Atlanta, 

 



  

were vou in real estate sales? 

Homes only or all fields of it? 

All of ‘it. 

How long were you with DuPont? 

Bleven years. 

Are you married? 

én. 

DO you have children? 

YB. 

How old are your children? 

Eight and ten. 

Are they in school? 

Yen, 

Have you served on jury duty before? 

NO» 

Have you ever been called before? 

LY 
Tes. 

How long have you been in Atlanta, sir? 

This time about seven years, 

ANG where were you raised? 

In Atlanta, 

TOU ware born and raised here? 

MRe PARKER: Thank vou, sir. 

 



  

BY MR, TURNERS 

Q Have you read or heard anything about the Dixie 

Purniture Store holdup and the officer who was shot in that? 

A If this is the one where the officer was shot and 

then the police department made a concerted effort to find him, 

it was in the news several months ago, yes. 

0 What, if anything, did you read or hear about that? 

A Just that. 

Q Does that cause you any difficulty sitting on this 

case as a fair and impartial juror? 

A I would think from reading that that would certainly 

be on my mind. It seemed to be a senseless crime, 

{J 411 right. Is there any way that you can disabuse 

vour mind from what you have just expressed, do you feel? In 

other words, can you put the thoughts that you just articulated 

out of your mind in terms of considering the evidence? 

A I would probably have a hard time doing that. 

CG Well, give me & yes Or no, if you can, please. 

THE COURT: Hr. Hiles, let me ask you a guestion 

and then he can rephrase his question. The ultimate 

question that every juror has to face 1s whether you can 

be a fair and impartial juror, whether vou can decide this 

¢age on the evidence you hear from the witness stand and 

he law given you in charge by the Court. Do you think 

anything you have read or heard would Keep you from being 

3 
be i 

-l ore 

 



  

vou 

wor xo 
ri & 

falr and impartial juror? 

THE JUROR: 1 would probably have to say ves, that 

could not be fair, based on what I have read about it. 

SNE e hw £9 en 1a 0 

KER: Thank you, 

HE COURT: All right. dr. Hiles, I will excuse 

2 

from this jury and let you return to the jury 

sembly room on the fourth floor. Thank you very much, 

and thank you for your candor, 

LOOM ) 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court=- 

THE CLERK: Robert F. Burnette, 

SHE JUROR: I am 8 letter carvier for the Postal 

gervice, Atlanta, work at Station K, 

Sir, how long have you been with the Postal Service 

Approximately twelve years, 

Hag all of thet been in Atlanta, sir? 

Are you from the Atlanta area? 

Yeu, sir. 

Born and raised here? 

Yes, ir. 1 spent some time in Hiami, PFloride 

I have spent the majority of my life in Atlanta. 

Are you married now? 

-124~- 

? » 

 



  

va BY Fo Ey ay 
ps 3% af 1 0g 

3 FEU 00s ol PSP i #, elt ages? 

A Thirteen, ten and six. 

* And are they all in school? 

& 128, Bille 

{J lave you served on jury duty before? 

5 HO, Bile 

{ Have you ever been called before? 

A NG, iT. 

i where is Hcelynn Avenue? 

A That's in Northeast Atlanta, Morningside area, 

runs out off of North liighland Avenue. @ 

, flow long have you lived in that area? 

ha. Bo, 3 Xn a EE 
A Approximately six years, 

A 8 bb Nf el ne . is 2 po Bie PARKERS Fhank you. 

SRF Th PETER 50 1 BY ME. TURNER: 

Q Mv pare is John Turner and I represent the defen- 
& 

Furniture Store robbery wherein a police officer was shot? 

A it's been some time back, I heard a little bit 

oy Ah an 2% gh al ib oT bn ie a aX Be a by 4 & $d Bo you recall what you heard about it? 

i Not really, just thet an officer was shot. 

 



  

Q All right, Would that cause vou any difficulty 

or would you have any difficulty in sitting on the jury of a 

panel that was considering that matter, given that set of facts? 

A No, Bir, 

£) All rights “hen you would be able to put out of your 

mind anything that you have heard about the casé up to this point 

and just listen to the evidence ag it comes from the stand? 

A Yes, sir. 

#) Po you think vou could be a fair and impartial juror 

otherwise? 

A ¥es, sir, 1 do. 

MRe TURNER: Thank you, 

THE COURT: Mr. Burnette, don't discuss this case 

Or any aspect of it with your fellow jurors. You may go 2 

5 

in the jury room, sir. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

TOO, ) 

THE CLERE: Hre. Clifford L. Lutton ¢ Ae 

‘HE JUROR: 1 teach English at Morehouse College. 

§ Mrs. Lutton, how long have you taught Enalish at wad 

Horencuse? 

A This is the seventeenth year. 

GG Have you ever taught anywhere else? 

 



  

A Yes, sir, I taught at Vassar and Rogary Hill, a [ 3 3 vt 
’ 

prep school. 

§ 

{2 And what does Hr. atton do? 

A He is a teacher with the Atlanta Public Schovls. 

Q Does he teach Bnglish, too? 

A He teaches English ag a second language to foreign 

students. 

0 Is he == ig there any specialty in foreign language? 

EY He is teaching English as a second language, he is 

not teaching a foreign language. 

Il 

§ Do you have children? 

& Have you ever served on jury duty before? 

A Yes, Bir. 

¥ ivil or eriminal or both type cases? 

P
a
g
 

Ho
 ] 

ea
l have been on just one case, it was a criminal 

Case. ’ 

8, pon't tell me what happened in that case, but did 

the jury reach a decision? 

a Ho. 

ha T DIR e i FIR Fe & Hox § MR. PARREK: Thank YOU. 

1 Si os FG hen PY LY 

BY Elie TURK Bags 

po
 

f
i
 Do you know of any resson why you can't gilt as a 

fair and dspartial juror in this case? 

A WO BiY. 

 



  

4 Okay. Have you read or heard anything about the 

Bixie Purniture Store holdup and the officer who was shot in 

that occurrences 

MR, TURNER: Ko further guestions. 

THE COURT: Mrs. Lutton, don't discuss this case 

with any of the other jurors in any way. You may go to 

the jury room. Thank you, na'an. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

OOM. ) 

LT y's HTS fr a wom ¥i%enie py " fom ® fe sing " 

THE CLERK: Mra. Bama T, Cason 

oe 

THE JUROR: I work {for Evelyn Ellis Hailing Servicej 

it's a direct mailing service in the Rhodes-Haverty 

Building. 

* And how long have you worked for them? 

b Oh, ten or fifteen vears., I work part-time, 1 

don't work all the time. It's kind of a seasonal thing. 

6 And what does lr, Cason do? 

A He is retired from the Department of Argriculture. 

§ And what did he do? 

A BE fay 95 45 1% P Tt om de ERA deen Am A Lis Government. WHat Gig ne aos 

¥] YES, 

<4 Oo
 i 

 



      

A He was a statistician, clerk. 

- 0 DO you have children? 

A Yes, I have two boysa. 

¥. Their ages? 

A Their ages? 

0 Yes, na'lsm, 

A {Twenty-six and thirty-one. 

0 Are they both married? 

A Bao, one single and one married, 

9 Hoth on their own? 

8) Have you served on jury duty before? 

i Ho, 1 haven't, 

{2 Have you ever been called before? 

A One time. 

{J Mrs. Cason, are you conscientiously opposed 

capital punishment? 

B® gy J 
£3 Yeu " 

{J if you had two alternatives in a case as far 

penalties go, that is, impose the death sentence or life 

penalty, could you at least consider the imposition of the 

A I don't think 80, ne. I would have to gay 

  

 



  

{ Under any circumstances vou would not consider 

A HMO oe 

HRs PARKERS 

THE COURTS 

Mie TURNER: 

COURT: 

you return to the 

(Whereupon, 

TOO, ) 

BLA ERIDESRD 
Mie TURNER: 

I would note the objection I made in the last similar 

situation and 

particular juror is concerned, 

in this case? 

5, LT 
5 iG8 

(J Are you conscientiously opposed to capital punish- 

ment? 

would 

Thank you. 

Ay questions? 

No questions. 

Mrs. Cason, I will excuse you and let 

jury assembly room on the fourth floor. 

the excused from the court=- 

For the purposes Of the record, again, 

renew it at this time insofar as this 

Yes, 8ir. 

Mra, Dorothy We. Smith, 

Dorothy Smith, Motor Transport, City of 

and impartial juror 4  



  

£ 

Le. 

that 

the guilt or innocence of the defend 

BA Ta 
5 ig 

case, is 

& 

1%, 

judiced? 

A 

a 

that you 

A 

the job, 

{2 

tions wit 

A 

i 

the Dixie 

  

of 

HO » 

Your attitude towards capital punishment, would 

prevent you from being a fair and impartial juror as to 

EW FE Ee hl 
PARKERS 

TIE IN NYE 
TURIMER 

earlier you mentioned that you knew 

the who night be called to testify in this 

that right? 

yey, 

Okay. Hould that in any way cause you to be pre- 

bE 

sR)» 

Okay. How well do you know any of the individuals 

answered affirmatively that you did know? 

I only Enow them through job related, 1 see them on 

50 you ave saying you have just had casual conversa- 

atx * 
ik § the 

Are you familiar with the circumstances surrounding 

Furniture Store holdup? 

I read about it in the papers 

Okays What did read about it? WEL YOu



  

A Everything that was printed. 

Q All right. Por how many weeks that you can recall 

did you read anything, do you remember reading anything about 

A well, I read the paper every dav. 

\¢, Okaye. Would it be fair to say that you have read 

practically every article that has been run on thig particular 

matter? 

A Host likely. 

0 Okay. As a result of reading those articles, did 

vou [orm any opinions or attitudes about the guilt ov innocence 

of anyone involved in this cage? 

& BO o 

Q Okay. 80, putting those two factors together, the 

fact that you know the individuals or some of the individuals 

who might testify personally and the fact that you have read 

everything, you still say you could be a fair and impartial 

juror? 

A I think so. 

Mi, TURNER: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Hrs. Sniith, don't discuss th he
 

Fo
 
w
a
 

o
d
 

# &
 

yo
 

N
y
 

~
 v - 
“
 

31
 

any aspects of it with your fellow jurors, and vou may 

"a go to the jury room, please, ma'am. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the courte 

-132~ 

room. ) 

 



  

THE CLERK: Mrs 

“HE JUROR: 1 

BY i. PARKER 

OQ Who do 

Waa oF YP RW 
ABBY ance 

nN 

& 

  

Agent i" 

you actually 

a company 

Darger. 

that dis 

Pe a BL iy a Bi wo pn EN me mem gn os 
WORK LOY, Hrs. Darner? - 

called Berklin & Jordan, 

For how dong have you worked for them? 

7a po Pi es 
¥ BIW: & Quy 

Who did vou 

Buck Creek 

Were you Keepl 

Oo you have 

Bom vw en mave You 

HO, i have 

nave you 

vid, 1 Dave 

Hnere are you 

Philadelphia, 

have iow long 

i gn bw 
SS Wi 

engineer for a manufacturing firm 

served 

that? 

Industries. 

i . uw 4 wr Boum on Togs ar 
£38 the ix WOR Fi too? 

correct. 

8 a& partner in a lumber company. 

children? 

on jury duty before? 

NOT 

beth 2% ei y SCTE. Bon pe JR Ste man pri * 
ygen called before? 

not. 

fron, originally 
- pd 
& 

the "J
 You been in Atlanta avea 

~133= 

occupation. 

and



  

x Ghlriteen years. 

#, Are you conscientiously opposed to capital punisgh- 

A wa, I am not. 

{ Your attitude towards capital punishment, would 

that prevent vou fron belnyg a fair and impartial juror as to > a u & J 

the guilt oy innocence Of a particular defendant? 

3, 5 » way gn po] A Ho, it wouldn't. 

ff Fs TEE 0 PR LY LIS D8 CF CE 9 PL ile PARAEKRS Thank YOU. 

i 54 al 8 5 
SY ME. TURNER: 

£ LH a fy wl og Bn 1 ’ PE A en Te Te ] APT | oy w gos 3 & " bo fing ™ a WS. DArRer, nave you read or heard anvihing about 

the circumstances surrounding the Dixie Furniture holdup and 

the shooting of an officer in May of this year? 

i) po ie x % vo Be py gine dN 
£3 Pilly 4 AIEAVE TOC e 

(J You haven't heard one thing about it? 

Sad 1 oe y a £8 k » 

AR. WRGNER: Thank you, 

~~ E ard 3 Bo fh a SE I LR hi gen co En Anes aia. ew fo. VRQ Ji W WR ae 2v b TO etn fo de a 
asks QUGILS MES, Jammer, don't discuss this case 

Or ans 2 Of it with your fellow jurors. You may 

W
g
 

mn
 & 

go Lo the Jury room, 

le 3 ot Ear rE aR Sr SR a AR PEN Rh 20h a wh huey 3 RE EN 
(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court— 

hE CLERKS Mrs. Waldtraut 8. Lavroff. 

ROR 1 am an aaministrator. 

~134- 

 



  

ment? 

A 

® 

FX 

What does Mr. 

1) 

lie is retired. 

and what did 

Georgia 

Georgia State? 

doing 

he 

btate 

up one 

$8 pe i 3 
Math 

Lavroff do? 

Go? 

’ 

one particular location? 

University. 

Of 

ematics 

anvthing now or just enjoying 

a university administrator. 

the departments? 

Department, 

retire- 
' 

lio, he is at home, he is retired. 

DG you have an 

HNO 

hi 4 

Have you served on jury duty before? 

Ho 8B ir, 

wiigre are you 

ry gn 
bf i hd ® 

“wenty—-gix yea 

Are you consci bt
 

from originally? 

you been 

LE. 

entiously opposed 

~-i3 be 

to capital punishment? 

 



  

| wo oh 1 Keep you 

Gv 

not totally opposed 

would 

BY 

innocence 

A Ho 

not De 

Meg 

HME 

3s 34 
a i 

or any a 

Q Your attitude towards capital 

from being a fair and impartial juror as to the 

> 
OL 

Excuse 

I sald, 

totally opposed 

punishment, would that 

guilt 

a = a
a
 a particular defendal 

« I would be very reluctant about it, but I am 

$C 1%. 

me? 

I would be very reluctant about it, but 1 

tc it as per vour statement. 

« PARKER: Thank you, 

« TURKER: Uo questions. 

E COURT: Mrs. lLavroff, don't digcuss the cage 

spect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may 

40 £0 the jury room. 

{W 

COONie ) 

Lit 

hereupon, a 

£11 
oh Ah Bg 

the juror was excused from the court- 

CLERKS Joseph CC. league, Jr, 

THE JUROR: I am vice president of Jova, Daniels, 

Busby, Architects, and I am an architect, 

0 Where did you go to school? 

A Georgia Tech. 

( When did you graduate, sir? 

 



  

Q And are you married, sir? 

Fa Ek ZT . 

F. L8H o 

a
 

Ho
t J Does your wife work outside the home? 

ar cn we 3 ie an gt 
£ Yes gp BIDE GORE 

£2 what does she do? 

A She 1s an interior designer. 

G Do you have any particular specialty as far as a 

part of your architect practice is concerned? 

A to, sir, I have worked mostly in the commercial 

architectural field. 

2 Po you have children? 

A HO, 8ir, NOL HOW, 

id Have you sexved on jury duty before? 

A Ho, sir, I have not, 

J Are you from the Atlanta area? 

A Yes, sir. Well, no, you mean originally? 

A I am originally from Hacon, Ceorgia. 

Jol Ta IN ISEENRYD 1 TET. UAE 
Piil e Hf LF 8 § 98 1 Thank You * 

: 

{ Have you read or heard anything about the Dixie 

Furniture Store and the officer who was shot in May of thi % 0
 

year? 4 

 



  

na 

t
d
 

ot
 

we
 

+} 4 

  

A 1 remember reading about it in the paper, that 

What did you read about it? 

A I just recall that the officer was killed after 

ving answered a call or in the process of making the call. 

Q All right. Would that cause you any difficulty 

sitting on this jury as a fair and impartial juror? 

don't think so. pot
 

2 

& S50 you could put out of your mind anything vou read 

heard about this? 

A 1 remember very little detail on it, just the fact 

ME. TURKER: Thank you, sir. 

HE COURT: Hr. League, don't discuss the case or 

any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may gv 

tO the Jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

THE CLERK: Hrs. Suzanne Kilgo. 

WR: I work for the Life Insurance Company of 

Georgia in the Accounting Department, 

0 How long have vou been with then, Mrs. Kilgo? bod ) o£ a 

A seventeen years, 

-i 3



  

&, LC work vou 

Avenue? 

A 16H 

5 What does Mr. Kilgo do? 

Fy He 18 a securities tra 

company is he wi 

self-employed, 

8 DO you have any 

A, HO» 

L¥ Have you served 

(Ce, 

0 Civil or 

A It Was 
a 

£3 bon't tell me how you 

n < 

decigion in that case? 

2 Mrs. Kilgo, are you 

ital punishosent? 

£ NO 

from prevent you being a fair and 

der, 

on jury duty before 

decided the 

conscientiously 

BLOCKS « 

th? 

children? 

3
 

drug case, criminal case. 

case, but did 

capital punishment, would 

impartial juror to the be $2 

ny gn 2 
nts or innocence of a particular defendan 

A I don't think so. 

HRs PARKER: Thank you. 

at the big building over here on North 

the 

that 

guilt 

 



  

6 What is your employement bagke wo 

a ¥ a fa ww wt RT a 1A a $e . vy A Ry employment background? 

S Yi wl ® 

Fig well # 

o 

Pepartment 

been with them for seventeen years. I have 

work before that, 

{J Have you read or heard 

the officer who 

the paper, the 

that cause you to form any 

about this particular cage? 

] we 1 to A well, be truthful, 

I don't know that I would say it did. 

F
o
i
 Well, do you feel you can sit as a 

§ 

juror in this case based on what you have read 

from the news media? 

A I think 1 could. 

YOU 

EA EE a gp wi oe ” - PRAT 0, J AR Wa | PT 
MR. PARKERS May I ask one additional 

Fes v2 tg EY Fn wi 4 
FUE LOURY: Yes F J 51Y¥ ® 

En BR ER 

se  PRARAERNS 

00 you know Mrs, A, + Savini that 

Life Insurance Company of Ceorglia? 

Yes. 

~140= 

jround, ma 

been in 

tam? 

Ceorgia and 

Ee 

fair and 

Na or heard 

worksg for 

cler 

have 

ical 

about the Dixie 

have 

impartial 

guestion? 

the 

 



   

{ Are you good friends with her? 

A {3 

Q Do you both work in the same department? 

a
 

P
o
 

a
t
 

O oF
 

in the same department, but I have known her 

since I have been there. 

MR. PARKER: ‘Thank you. 

THE COURT: Mrs. Kilgo, don't discuss this case 

Or any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you 

may go to the jury room. Thank vou, malan, 

(Whereupon, the juror wae excused from the court- 

rOOB,. ) 

CLERK: Joseph Dane. 

“HE JUROR: 1 work ss an in-take counselor in a 

laboratory for Psychological Services at Georgia State, 

and I am & student in psvechology. 

B2Y HE. PARKER: 

i PO you have a degree, siv? 

A Fo, I don't, Well, I have a Master's at this time; 

I am working on a Doctorate. 

B, Master's in psychology? 

A Correct, 

& Is that from Ceorgia State? 

A That's correct, 

§ And are you married, Mr. Dane? 

 



  

A Yes, 1 am. 

0 0 you have children? 

A Ko, 1 don't. 

0 Does your wife 

A Yas, 

Where does she work? 

A Ghe is a teacher at Ri 

Q Which one? 

A Riverwood High School, 

0 What does ghe teach? 

A Latin and French. 

{J Are you from the Atlanta area, Mr, 

A Yes, grew up here since about age 

0 Where are you from originally? 

A I was born in Mississippi but lived 

time prior to age eBix in California, 

®; Have 

A Ro, sir; I haven't, 

8) MY» Dane, are 

A Yes, sir, I am, 

Q If you were serving on 

alternatives, that 

least consider the possibility of 

work outside the 

> 

verwood High Bchool 

ha 

a jury and 

a penalty of life or death, 

imposing the 

=142m= 

in Sandy 

Dane? 

I] 

BiXe 

most of the 

you served on jury duty before? 

vou conscientiously opposed to capital 

you were given two 

could you at 

death penalty? 

 



  

A I would consider it on the individual circumstances, 

yes, sir. 

G On what, sir? 

A Cn the individual circumstances of the 

fie PARKER: Thank you, 

MR. TURNER: Bo questions. 

THE COURT: Mr. Dane, don't discuss this 

aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may 

the jury room, please. 

(Whereupon, the juror wag excused from the 

EOOH  } 

SHE CLERK: William A. Lane, 

“HE JUROR: 1 am retired, United States Air 

BY HMR, PARKER: 

|®, Mr. Lane, how long were vou in the U.8. air 

A Twenty-seven years, 

{ And were you a pllot, sir? 

Nav igator ? B=4¢7'a 8 

® DO you have any children, sir? 

A NG  ; Bi1L & 

& Are you married, sir? 

Fa IGE, BAL » 

$, Have you served on jury duty before? 

x Gi 3 ~ 

FY ACE Sik * 

  

situation. 

G0 CO 

Court=- 

FOUQCe



  

{2 Have you served on civil? 

A Civil right here, yes, sir, in Fulton County. 

0 Have you served on any eriminal cases? 

A Ho, Bir. 

# Are you from the Atlanta area originally? 

A HO, Bir. 

8 Are you from Savannah? 

A I lived in Savannah nine years, but I am not from 

Savannah either. 

0 Where are you from originally? 

A I wag born in Pennsvivania but I left there in 1934. 

MR. PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

HRs TURNER: Ho questions, 

THE COURT: Mr. Lane, don't discuss this case or 

any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may go 

to the jury room. Thank you. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- or
 

TOOm. ) 

THE CLERK: Johnson PB. Hason, 

THE JUROR: Occupation, motion picture projectionist 

with Eastern Pederal, part of Eastern Federal, 

SET SEEN GY LF EY 
BY Ris PARKLXS 

QO How long have you been in that line of work, sir? 

 



    

a ygdegls 

£5 

{ 

but dig 

B 
£5 

Do you have to work some odd hours? 

Sir? 

Do you have to work at night a lot? 

That's right. 

Are you married? 

Yes, 

Does your wife work? 

vhat does she Go? 

ha 

A. Gs Rhodes Hone. 

Do you have children? 

No, they are all grown and married. 

Have you served on jury duty before? 

1 have, 

Have you ever merved o© ariminal case oa
d 

a]
 

& 

I have. 

pont tell me 

They were kind of mumbo jumbo. 

Don't teli me if they went to 

they reach a decision? 

Yes, 

[2 Ey pip I: TREN 3 MR. PARKER: Thank you. 

HRe TURNERS HO questions. 

Mr. Mason, let ne 

i 
pr
ed
 

Pv 
£9
 

Ln
 { 

did, but did 

before? 

i they reach 

guilt or innocence, 

ASK vou one question.  



  

Bo you have any health reason or any personal reasons, 

including the fact that vou might work odd hours, that 

vould be particularly bothersome to you if this jury were 

sequestered, staved in a hotel? 

THE JURCRs:s It wouldn't bother me at all, 

THE COURT: Thank you, sir. You can go to the jury 

room, and don't discuss the case in any respect with your 

fellow jurors, 

Whereupon, the juror wag excused from the court- 

roQm, ) 

THE COURT: Gentlemen, after we have selected forty- 

nine qualified jurors, I intend to ask that or a similar 

question to the panels, and cone other question. bon't 

let me forget to do that so we won't nave a problem, a 

health problem or something like that after we get the 

jurors, but I asked that one because of that one particular 

answer he had given earlier, 

All right, call the next juror. 

THE CLERK: Mrs. H., H. Hickey. 

THE JURORS I am a cook for Melonald's for three 

Years. 

. 5 IR IIT ET . 
Ae A 54 ius 8 

¥) What did you do before that? 

A Just a mother, I have never worked before, I had 

 



  

no training 

you helping 

extra money, 

what she wan 

¥ 

A 

a
 

8 

prevent you 

Or innocence 

A 

have to welg 

Rr TE) gel ryyEy 
OY HMR eo AIRES 

at anything else, 

What does Mr. Hickey do? 

He is a maintenance puray-painter for General 

At the Doraville plant? 

Ho, the Lakewood plant. 

And are your children grown now? 

Yes, my last child is in her fourth year of college, 

Is that child working its way through school or are 

sone? 

Both. She works through the summer so she has 

and then we pay, you know, what we can, and she pays 

ts to. 

Have you served on jury duty before? 

HO o 

Are you conscientiously opposed to capital punish- 

NO, nO. 

Your attitude towards capital punishment, would that 

from being a fair and impartial juror on the guilt 

cf a particular defendant? 

I don't think s0, I really don't. I think I would 

h everything, 

MR. PARKER: Thank you, ma'am. 

 



  

4 Ha'am have you read or heard anything about the 

robbery at the Dixie Furniture Store and the officer who was 

shot? 

A Well, I guess everybody that has a TV has heard 

about it, but not nothing other than just that it happened. 

# As a result of hearing or reading about that, did 

you form any opinions or attitudes about the guilt or innocence 

of anyone involved in the case? 

A Well, I don't think I have read that nuch. I just 

read about it, and as I say, I work and then 1 come home and 

I have ny housework to do, so I don't have time to do a lot of 

reading, you know, other than just what I hear while we are 

eating supper on the six o'clock news. 

¥ would you have any problem in sitting on this case? 

Do you know of any reason why you can't sit on it as a falr and 

imparial juror? 

Wo, No, I have no deadlines to meet anywhere, Hy 

Loss says, Okay, you are on jury duty, vou are off, so that 

he Lh 3 PERRY E55 Pe (7 Pe Wk An 

AR PTUREBERS Hank na tlan ® VOU 

mE TNE fon Cl san gk 
ig 4 FS COURT : Mrs " Hickey, don't discuss this case or 

any aspect of the case with your fellow jurors, and you 

may retire to the jury room, 

(Whereupon, 

rYOCR, ) 

the juror was excused from the court- 

 



  

A 

AT ATE 
BY ig Yd & 

£3 

prevent 

A 

Tk pe Pr OF bh & Td Fo) 

THE CLERK: Bru 

Peay px 

ce E. Montgomery. 

THE JUROR: I am an engineer, recently retired {ron 

he Lockheed CGeoradla 

PARKER? 

Mr » MOntgomery, 

Do vou have chi ot
 

TWO 

you parrvied, sic? are 

ldren? 

Are they all grown 

Yas. 

Have you served 

Fi gn y RE | ; gi Yes, several ye 

Was it a civil 

Civil only. 

“ 

on jury duty before? 

ars back. 

oY ocriminal case or LOLLY? 

What type of englneer were you, sir? 

in electronics. 

Have you been 1 

HO 

Hy « HOntgomery, 

punishment? 

You 

i Oa 

n the military, sir? 

are vou conscientiously opposed to 

Your attitude towards capital punishment, 

from being a fa ir and lmpartial juror? 

I don't think so. 

MR. PARKER: Th ank vou, 

-149~- 

would that 

 



  

MR. TURNERS Wo questions, 

CHE COURT: Mr. Montgomery, don't discuss any 

aspect of this case with your fellow jurors or any 

aspect of it at all, and you may retire to the jury 

room, sir. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

EOOMm 

THE CLERK: Mrs, Margaret Le. Kirbo, 

RY 7 pi oh ges 
BY MR FARRER] 

£. C
i
s
 

5) J
 What does you husban 

a
 

E
o
 

A He is an attorney. 

¢ Charles EKirbo? 

A Tes. 

Py Tes 5% a 2h a iy 4 ow 13 8 = a Gn 4 sn 4 + sa 8 a BR Ky rg % 

0 Does he ever handle any Criminal cases that you 

A Ro, not in Atlanta, his law fixm doesn't. 

Q Have you ever known him to get involved in any 

A Ho. Maybe in South Georgia. 

Q Would that have been years ago or just recently? 

A lo, we have lived up here since '60. 

8 Mrs. Kirbo, are you conscientiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

 



  

HG» Pr
 

- 

o Could vou be a fair and impartial juror regardless 

of your attitude or non-attitude toward capital punishment? 

MRe PARKER: ‘Thank you. 

Fh VR PRAT RW 
BY MRes TURBEKE 

\¥ Mrs. Rirbo, do you have any friends or relatives 

P
o
 

o
n
 

we
 law enforcement Or any close associates? 

Bi Wo 

{J Have you read or heard anything about the Dixie 

Furniture Store robbery and the police cfficer who was shot? 

Fs HO. 

b) Do you know of any reason why you can't sit as a 

fair and dmpartial juror in this case? 

MA NO « 

HR TURNER: Thank you, ma'am, 

iE COURTs Mra. Kirbo, don't discuss this case 

or any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may 

go to the Jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

FOC) 

-e Yew ae 

“HE CLERK: Patricia J. Dukes, 

THE JUROR: I work at Boyle Midway, 1 am a finishing 

operator, 

 



  

St GREY Bn 
he Pid @ 

A 

g
i
 

o
h
 

PARKER: 

5% v fom 0% i YOu are a 

Chamblee, 

How long 

Going on 

And what 

what did 

What did 

I was at 

What does 

He works 

Does he a 

One of th 

po you ha 

I have tw 

fos A 

Have you 

NE o 

save you 

finishing operator? 

Midway out in Chamblee, 

located? 

Georgia. 

have you been out there? 

two 

did you do prior to that? 

I do? 

you do prior to going to work for 

home . 

Mr. Dukes do? 

for MARTA doing construction work. 

ctually work for them or one of the 

¢ contractors. 

ve any children, Mrs, Pukes? 

Ge 

served on jury duty before? 

been called before? 

then? 

CON 

 



  

A LO 

£ Mrs, Dukes, are you conscientiously opposed to 

k 

capital punishment? 

A PO » 

{Q Could you be a fair and impartial juror regardless 

of your views towards capital punishment? 

B Yau, 

MRe PARKER: Thank you, 

MB. TURNER: No questions. 

THE COURT:  #rs. Dukes, don't discuss this case or 

any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may ¢o 

to the jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

TOOK ) 

THE CLERK: Willard E. Beavers. 

THE JUROR: Willerd Beavers, Willard E. Beavers; 

I work at the Hyatt Regency here in Atlenta as a stock=- 

yoo clerk. 

BY MR, PARKER? 

& Mr. Beavers, are you married, sir? 

A Yes, 81ir. 

(2 Do you have children? 

4 oi pe 
#3 BO, Bike 

oO poes your wife work cutside the home? 

 



  

A Hot at the present. 

{ what did she do, sir? 

A She was 8&8 nurses aide, 

OQ In any. particular place? 

A In the Bast Point Nursing Home, I believe it's 

called, 

#] Have you served on jury duty before? 

A I have been called, 1 have been summoned belore, 

put I haven't been placed on a jury. 

#, Are you from the Atlanta area, sir? 

H Yes, sir, Southwest Atlanta. 

- 

{2 Were you born amd raised here? 

1 

Ko, sir, in Tennessee, Pa
y 

a=
 

0 How long have you been in Atlanta, sir? 

A About nineteen years, 

MR, PARKER: Thank you, 

HR. TURNER: Ho questions. 

THE COURT: Hr. Beavers, don't discuss this case 

or any aspects of it with your fellow jurors, and you 

} TOOm, Bir. » 
LJ 

wh 
may go to the jury 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

rOOm. ) 

MR. TURNER: Before the next juror is called, Your 

Honor, I brought to the Pistrict Attorney's attention, at 

3 i 
this point I think we might at least, on behalf of the 

 



 
 

  

5 Rob 2 CE F3 # I pA 
PU that $35 BT ar Ted 24 

»e 

¥ 
«, > 
Pa 
fon count w ie what t 

a a 
fa Ser i: 

 
 

cut hl 
# 

LS WE ” 
4 He 

a § 

 
 

 
 

4 » 
¥ 

wy gion 
o dn & Jur A 

ww 
A 2g na alte two 

 
 

3
 

oF 

oh a a 
separa 

oo 
G Ur # 

¥ 

: 
5 
we § FULT OY rernate 

4 i 
1 

 . #1 

 
 
 



  

+
 

E
y
 

nunber of 

A 

otherwise 

Yes, sir, forty-two, 

And do you bave children, sir? 

Une son, ves. 

is hie grown? 

Civil and criminal? 

Ho, civil only, 

Civil only? 

Yes, sir. 

How long ago was that, sir? % 

About == I guess maybe about six or eight 

Are you from the Atlanta area? 

Yes, Bir. 

Have you lived here all your life? 

All my life, that is, in Pulton County. 

0 4 East Wesley Road, you have lived 

years, sir? 

&2 
there for 

Yes, sir. We were in Fairburn from '31 to 

we have been on East Weslev. 

ay 5 fn ES Dds Fa Eg 3 TEETER | 
fie PARKERS PRAT R58 You ® 

~156~ 

a 

138, 

 



  

i " 
wi Hy pu BY MR 

Pax x » 

HO questions, 

Pe MY . don't discuss this Greene, 

Or any aspects of 

may go to the jury room, Bir. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused {rom the 

EOOn. ) 

THE CLERK: John HM. Abernathy, Jr. 

THE JUROR: Computer programmer. 

PARKER: 

# Are you self-employed, sir? 

A Hoy Bir. 

5 oh 30 - i 2 o£ . " I» #7 al J 

¥, WG G0 YOu WOrR L0T57% 

work Zor HCE, A 4 

0 And how long 

A A year and a half, 

Q And what did you do prior to that, sir? 

A 1 was a school teacher, 

(3 Georgia State or -- 

A with Woodward Academy, a private school in 

I taught chemistry. 

i How many years did you teach school? 

half. A Eleven and a 

¥ Does Mrs. Abernathy work outside the home? 

A IQS 8i¥. 

cage 

it with your fellow jurors, and you 

COUrtL- 

 



  

(2 Do you have children? 

A Yes, Sir, I have a daughter eleven, 

6 ie she in school? 

A Yes, sir. 

) Have you served on jury duty before? 

A be) § B i Te 

0 Have you ever been called before? 

A bever have, 

{J Are you from the Atlanta ares, sir? 

A a 

Q Where are you from originally? 

A Well, from North Carolina, and then lew Jergey, 

Hobile, and now finally here, 

8, Hr. Abernathy, are you conscientiously opposed to 

capital punishment? 

A Ho, sir. 

(& Your attitude towards capital punishment, would 

that prevent you from being a fair and impartial juror? 

A I don't believe 850, 

HRs PARKER: . Thank you. 

3k x ATTY RYE IS B 3 RTE PRG wa - MR. TURBER: No questions. 

x iscuss this case i THE COURT: Mr. Abernathy, don't d 

or any aspects of it with your fellow jurors, and you 

may go to the jury room now. 
- 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

158m 

 



  

BY MR. 

House 

roof. ) 

THE COURT: Gentlemen, I hope ny law 1s better 

than my mathematics. I believe we'll need fifty jurors, 

We'll call through juror Humber ll4, assuming no one 

further 18 excused. 

-e - A asl 

EERE BA a alte 8 LE ES Row pre LF wn we Hon 
CHE CLERAS Mrs, Mary COX. 

PELE THE JURUR: I am a sales assistant, 

PARKER: 

Q At what store, please? 

A Carper Sales Company, it's food brokerage. 

¥, Where are they located? 

A In Roswell, Georgia. 

¥ You have a Robert Drive address, ig that Atlanta? 

A That's atlanta. 

Q Whaereabouts is that? 

A It's right outside of Roswell, 

Q What does Mr. Cox do? 

A He ig a retail sales nanayer for a food brokerage 

{ But a different one from what you are with? 

A Yes, sir, Cole Brokerage. 

3 Do you have children, Mrs. COX? 

A BO, 8iF. 

QO Have vou served on jury duty before? 

-159= 

 



  

a Ho, Bite 

{J Are vou from the greater Atlanta area? 
PY J 

pa Yes, Sir. 

i Born and raised here? 

A Yet, Sir. 

¥ what about your husband 

n Sis LIE IE TO 
£5 He is from Alabana. 

¢ Are you conscientiously opposed to capital punish- 

ment? 

0 You are? 

a Yes, Sir. 

L¥ If you were given or the Court instructed you that 

you had two alternatives, to impose a sentence of life or a 

sentence of death, could you at least consider the imposition 

of the death penalty? 

A Yes, sir. 

Q You would consider it? 

A Yes, sir. 

MR. PAREER: Thank you, 

Re TURNERS No guesticns. 

THE COURT: Hrs. Cox, don't discuss this case or 

any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, and you may go 

to the jury room. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court— 

 



    

TOON. ) 

0 

A 

  

ordney Co Baldwin, 

at Ceneral 

for General 

you do with 

And could you tell me how many vears 

3OANg on two vears now. 

Are you married, nr, Baldwin? 

r served on jury duty before? 

atlanta 

Thank you, sir. 

NO questions, 

Baldwin, don't discuss 

any aspect of it with your fellow jurors, 

to the jury room



  

CR 
Lie Fl 

(Whereupon, the juror wa 

LOOM. ) 

Lakewood Plant oun | 

A 

8%O 

THE CLERK: Wiley F. Joh 

THE JUROR? I work for G 

se Donouun ot 

Hr. Jewaoue you know 

i) F = i od r y 1 don } t % 

Fo : 3 - a f " ne Wk ge oy Re EF an w § 

William Jewsowme or Harol 

Gee, I work on trucks, 

I ap on trucks. 

Are you married, Mr, Joh 

Yes, sive Lucille Johns 

And does she work outsid 

Ho, she don't work, she 

childre 

at child? 

pleven. 

g& that child in school? 

ge 

L8H, Bil. 

Have you served on jury 

it's Yeah, been 

lle 

they are on 

about tw 

5 W 
g& excused from the court- 

NEON « 

aeneral Motors out at the 

Boulevard, 

that works out at General 

4 Jewsone ? 

the passenger 

nsony 

Of) » 

&¢ the home? 

don't work now. 

vt 
ad n, Bir? 

duty before? 

© Years ago. 

 



  

with 

+ a 

SOL Ke 

ment, 

that prevent vou from being a fair and 

A 

A
 

A 

Q 

them? 

sir? 

A 

A 

Wag that a civil or ¢cininal case? 

Civil, 

How long have you been at General Hotors, sic? 

A little over ten years, 

And who did you work with prior to going to work 

ry 

Before 1 went to work there? 

CY A 
88 

I was working at a service station doing mechanic 

Porter Shell Service, done mechanic works 

Bre Johnson, are you conscientiously opposed to 

punishment? 

I didn't understand you. 

Are you conscientiously opposed to capital punishe 

HOC 

nots no, sir. 

You are not? 

No, sir, 

Your attitude towards capital punishment, would 

impartial juror? 

Well, you know, like if I worked with somebody else 

«1l63= 

 



  

I wouldn't ¢ then 

A If they 

don't knows 

Can be 4 you 

of how you might feel 

A Yeah, as fa 

MRe PARKER: 

TURNER: 

THE COURT: 

Of SHY aspects 

YOu Ray go to the 

(Whereupon, 

LOOM ) 

Ee TIL 
els JURORS 

EArt a YR WEA 
BY MH. PARKER: 

L EO Use ne F 4 

% - 
A I worn for 

worked 
at 

a 

towards 

that $ 

sane place, vou know, 1 

falr and impartial juror regardless 

the death penalty? 

Know, r' ai 

py § TE, " Thank you, 

HO guestions, 

Bry. Johnson, don't discuss 

the case with vour fellow jurors, and 

JULY TOOM. 

the juror was excused from the court- 

Clarence D. William 8 

I am a nechanic for Delta Alr Lines, 

I didn't 

Delta Alr Lines, 

have you been with them, sir? 

do with 

4, And how long 

A Twenty years, 

8 what do vou 

2 » $e TH en A HeChiahilc., 

£5 EF ach XY 109 

4 HeCRA&NICT 

  

them? 

-164-



  

work outside 

jet base? 

the home? 

sir? 

A Yes, sir. 

L¥ Do you work at the 

A Yes, I do. 

Q Does your wife 

B Ho, she doesn't. 

{3 Io you have children? 

A TGS, 

, And how old are they, 

A The 

one is thirty. 

O Ave they both out on their 

A Oh, yes, they are, 

oO Have you served on 

A Yes, wiv, 1 have, 

Civil, criminal or 

youngest one is twenty-three and the oldest 

owny 

jury duty before? 

both? 

MR. PARKER: Thank you, sir. 

MR. TUREER: No questions, 

THE COURT: Mr, Williams, don't discuss this case 

or any aspect of the case with your fellow jurors, and 

you may go into the jury room. Thenk vou, 8sir. 

(Whereupon, the juror was excused from the court- 

rOOn) 

JUrors now. 

Gentlemen, 

We have fifty lefc, 

we have called fifty~four 

I am going to have them 

-165- 

 



  

all brought into the courtroom and ask them if they have 

any reason, health reason or fawily reason, that they 

could not serve if I have to keep them together, and then 

I will let you pick your jurors one panel at a time from 

there from thoee that I don't excuse. 

I will ask them that question before you pick, if 

you want me to. 1 believe that would be the fairest way 

to do it, 

let's take about a ten minute break until the 

sheriff gets all of them up here, 

(Whereupon, a short recess was had.) 

Whereupon, the prospective jurors entered the 

courtroot, after which the following proceedings were 

THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, before we begin 

the selection ¢f a jury in this case the Court wants to 

propound this guestion to you, 

Ro any of you, because Of health reasons or family 

reasons, would it make it difficult or impossible for you 

to serve on a jury that might be sequestered, might be put 

up in a hotel, for the rest of the week? If you don't 

stand == yes, sir. 

THE JUROR: I take high blood pressure pills and 

they are at hone, 

THE COURT: Well, we can get your pills for vou, 

 



  

your blood pressure pills, £ you had your blood 

pressure pills, would you feel like you could serve? 

2 » 

iy wife is a sericus diabetic and 1 need a
 THE JUROR: 

to be at home at night with her, and also, I have an 

eighty-seven vear old father-in-law living with me. 

THE COURY I will excuse you, sir. 

THE CLERK: What is your name, sic? 

THE JUROR: Windle VW. Burd, 

THE CLERK: Gentlemen, that is juror Number &5. 

THE COURT: Yes, ma'an, 

THE JUROR: Bir, I have to have a prescription 

filled, a medical prescription. 

THE COURT: Do you have your prescription with you? 

fo 
pe 

Sr
 

E
S
S
 

Fa
t 

: 2 -~ 1
 

$ra
gen

: 
hs

 
pr

o at
 

Po
t 3 

3
 A 

La
 

42
 

©
 

-
 is
 

foo
t ™ ®v 

N 

PHE COURT: If you had that prescription filled, 

would you then be able to serve? 

JUROR: Yes, sir. 

THE COURT: All right, If vou were chosen, we Could 

handle that for you, I presume, 

is there anyone else that could not serve under these 

facts? 

ER
] 

all right, gentlemen, let's begin the selection of 

HF CLERK: Ladies and gentlemen, as I call your “4 ¢ b 4 

167 

 



  

name, please stand and rewain standing until both sides 

have all oO 

MRa 

3 

a 
portunity 

oe 

PURINE 
ww AINE EL EN o 

BE DTT 
PARKERS 

TURNER: 

0
m
 

te Lr 
4 

Morris. 

State will accept Hr. Morris, 

the defendant, 

* 

bres. Doris ¥F. Walters. 

The State will excuse Mrs, Walters. 

We Es HMarvghall, Jr. 

The State will accept Mr. Marshall. 

Excused by the defendant. 

wn 

Lucile Shively. 

The State will accept Hrs. Shively. 

by the defendant. 

feonard Larson. 

The State will accept Hr. Larson. 

defendant. 

State will excuse Mrs. Walls. 

re Ohler. w
i
 jo Marguerite 

~168- 

 



  

_ 
PIV RIN e 

i Ukk Bx . 

CLERKS 

PARKER: 

Fh - TERE TS 
PURNERS 

CLERK: 

PARKER: 

ETRE TER 
TURKERS 

TURNER; 

- TE a 

. LER a : 

PARKER: 

TURBER: 

/*% EARS 

| 5 LL aly $ 

TURHER: 

PARKER? 

inl pr 

Fobert 

Ft 
EE 

hy on 

LTE 

Acceptable to the defendant. 

hy ae 

onala OC. 

The State will aceept Mr 

Acceptable to the 

ras Mildred Clover. 

ak 

Excused by the defendan 

Paul J. 

ihe State will accept 

Acceptable to the defendant. 

SO HM. 

Excused 

Wa Y ne Ve 

FEY 

Excused 

Lie 

6G 

  

State will accept Mrs. Bohler. 

giendant, 

The State will accept Mrs. Glover. 

State will acce 

the defendant. 

State 

2 oi A aie by, 
Ge lendant. 

Hamilton. 

State



   

MR. TURHER: Acceptable to the defendant, 

LERK: Mrs. Carolyn J. Ballard, 

MRe PARKER: The State will accept Hrs. Ballard. 

PURNER: Mrs. Ballard is acceptable to the 

THE CLERK: Mra. Mildred Moore. 

MR. PARKER: The State will accept drs. Hoore., 

MRe TURNER: Excused by the defendant. 

THE CLERK: Robert E+ Bmith. 

MRe PAREER: The State will accept Mr. Smith. 

MR. TURNER: Excused by the defendant, 

| on  —-. we 

THE CLERK: Hrs. Florence R. #Hobley. 

N 

MRe PARKER: The btate will excuse Mrs. Mobley. 

Kimball. pe
. 

E 

Po
w 

ae
d 

® a
 w
r
 

oe
 

Y
o
n
 

Hin
d 

Pe
 

£3
 

Yo
p)

 
A
 

5
 8
 

po
 

w
r
 

& -
 ES
 cr
 

& Fa
 

3 

& v po
t 

Po
m 

J
t
 

43
3 § [§
 

[54]
 

a
 

1 

rT
 

ro
 4 rd
 : 

w 

MRe TURNER: Excused by the defendant, 

aad —y Aad 

THE CLERK: Robert L. Hagle. 

REER: The State will accept Mr. Nagle, 

MR TURBER: Acceptablie to the defendant. 

~170~ 

 



  

PARKERS 

CLERK: 

PR TR 

PARKERS 

    

The State will accent 

defendant. 

Robert CC. 

d Ly the defendant, 

Acceptable to 

Harianne 

Odell Watkins, Jr. 

Watkins ® 

defendant.



  

PAT TA 
FRE 

PAK 
* 

I 
ial of | 

8 018 

Pel a SE 
CLERK: 

fr, TA 3) Lr wien 
HS SER LE 

Tu i 
'S 
FIRE » 
ENE EN 

ee 
Clalh ini g 

The 

Migs Carol A. 

res 

13 

Excused by the 

1 I i 

John 

The State will 

Robert Fe Burnette. 

The State will acc 

Acceptable 

Clifford L. 

State 

Py SMR : ¥ 
ne hHtate will 

Excused by 

acceptable to 

-172- 

JANES 

fARACUBE 

Latton, 

will excu 

aceeaept 

State will accept 

by the defendant. 

state will accept Miss 

defendant. 

of § 

ept MY » 

#4 és 
a % =. 

the defendant. 

v 
Lo 

state will accept Mr. Sharpe, 

T 21 
wes, 

MeCadden, 

Burnette. 

to the defendant. 

Le 

faitton, 

o Smith. 

the defendant. 

 



  

PRET 

  

Cl Hl WE 
FF LY re 

a RAE 
TiN We 
x WIESNER ES 2 8 

Tal a 

oe SEL ECS § 

PARKER: 

PTT ATID 

EA URINEL S$ 

  

Hrs. Waldtraut 

Li} a $3 os A ge or 
3 ua state will 

(2 & rs Fad 
MEET IDS ph La XC 

££ pooh WR Eh ek 

wil Zane #3
 

Ld
 

ihe State will 

—-— hand aad 

JOGBEPH Dane, 

EX gm Py i A 2k 3 3 he State will 

  

Fon Bo we gm gin, Tu 
WHITE ON Ba 

hd — aad 

PA pmo § H 
GES se Eo Pie 

tate 

o Eh TY oR = 4 Acceptable by 

Sha Se » T in A - 
The followin: 

-173~ 

will 

t 

Gy Nr 
Gon Aw Su use 

aceept ll 
fbn 

5 Fa 

Se Lavyrofi. 

LR a 
SE 8 « 

ou, JP |! J - 3 wpe 

Geftendant. 

oA) eee ™ Kil 

Se 
34 | 3% 

Lo 

SACUSE 

acgepc 

= 

Eickey. 

accept 

he 

Mrs 

MEY 

the defendant. 

rendante. 

Jurors 

La ag {54 2 

oe NILAYO, 

Lane, 

Lavrof £ * 

+ HiCkey. 

defendant. 

will b called 

 



  

of selecting the second a 

Hrs 

 ] 
%» BR 

£24 

~x twelve 

HaRes 

alte 

jurors 

= 

Li 

a 
CLEEKS 

EM 5 Bgl Ev 
PARKER $ 

:rnate, 

next four ijuro 

Je 

a 
- 

ERY FE RIES © 
a EER 

vs ison 
COURT 3 

abd 

Yul axe 
- 

DURES 

selection of the 

The Btate will ex 

-— - ou. 

YY 11 ~ A pa " 
viddlal'dl Le. LEAVES 

That's Juror 

— Rd Rak 

William Je Greene, 

e will 

Dy 

£ irst 

Number 

6 § of" 

A CUBe 
58 ge 
C4 

accept Hr. 

alternate. 

107. 

A Le ae a 
TRIAGE o 

Lreene, 

John M. Abernathy, Jr., will be the 

Co bP 

he Btat 

Ordney Cl, 

he Stat 

z 

Acceptab 

All ‘Tight 

two alter 

sy
 3 excused u 

will be 

rnate. 

6 

Ba 1dw in ® 

e will 

le to the 

will excuse 

accept 

called for 

HES 

Mr ® 

the 

COX. 

Baldwin. 

agefendant., 

¢ gentlemen, we have our 

nates, We didn't reach vour 
Ta, ss 

ntil in the morning at 933( 

  

purpose



  

   

Report back to the jury assembly voom at 9:30 in the 

morning. Thank you very much for vour patience. 

MR. PARKER: Does Your Honor know how late we will 

proceed this evening? I have released sone witnesses 

and 1 need to start getting them back down here. 

“HE COURT: let's have the opening statements, and 

i guess so these jurors won't feel that they didn't 

aplish anything, let's plan to go until 5:00 or 2:30, Bs
 

Fr
e & 

% 5 

of
 -t
 

Et
 

Fe
te
) 

9 

either way you want to. I will let vou decide how many 

witnesses you need. 

All right, gentlemen, the Court 1s going to impose 

the rule. Are vou ready? 

Vile PARKER: Yes, Your HOROr. 

THE COURT: All right. Will all the witnesses in 

the courtroom who expect to testify in this case please 

90 with the sheriff to the witness room. If YOu expect 

to testify at all for the State or the defendant, please 

leave the courtroom. 

Gentlemen, do you object to the sheriff going in and 

finding out if anybody is going to need him to go get their J 

clothes or -- we know we have one juror that wants his 

blood pressure pills, Do you mind the sheriff going into 

the jury room and asking those questions so he ean get & 

number on how many people he will need? : 

MR. TURNER: Bo objection from us. 

-175~ 

   



  

MRe PAREER: No, Bir. 

HE COURT: They asked me that, and I don't have 

the least idea. 

Hi. TURRER: Your Honor, 1 think there is possibly 

something we can take up while we are waiting for the jury. 

THE COURT: All right. 

MR. TURNER: This involves statements after witnesses 

have testified. Mrs Parker graciously opsned up his file 

earlier fOr me, rather last week, in order for me tue go 4 ¥ 

om
g 

[15
 over some of the testimony and evidence that he had. 

asked me not to make Xerox copies of anything at that time, 

80 I made notes from what 1 read. pet
ted

 

I would request that as the witnesses testify and as 

we reguest their previous statements, that we be furnished 

those statements for purposes of crogs—-examination. 

50, I don't know what response, if any, Mr. Parker 

might have to that, but he has another file with those 

statements in it, so I don't think it should cause any 

super problem, it's just for purposes of cross-examination, 

THE COURT: I don't believe there is any provision 

of law that requires bim to produce that, but if he wants 

& statement at this tine about e
r
 

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, 

by
 

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 » ~,
 

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34
 

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Mis. PARKER: Your Honor, I attempted to write down 

on the front of this file &ll of the attorneys that have 

-176= 

 



  

gone through it. Mr. Turner hag gone through it, he 

spent Ome three hours and fifteen minutes on it, and I 

don't know what he made notes of and what he didn't, and 

I can't swear that evervihing is in there, I think it is 

a fairly complete file, but I know two documents that the 

Court made anh in camera inspection on are not in there, 

All of my personal notes are not in there, my interviews 

of the witnesses are not in there. 

THE COURT: Do you have any objection to furnishing 

a copy of a statement to counsel for the defendant after 

you have examined the witness? 

MR. PAREER: I don't mind hier looking at the file 

because I have three more defendants 1 have to worry 

about, Log. 

THE COURT: I understand that, and I don't read 

the law that says you have to furnish such a copy, and 

80 1 will leave that up to you. 

FMR, TURNER: All I am saying is that I kept my word 

to Mr. Parker in terms of not Xeroxing anything. I could 

have done that when I had the file. 

MR. PARKER: And that would have been the last time 

he would have gotten it. 

Mite TURNER: It's not going to prejudice them, but 

I wanted to bring it to your attention. 

Fv EFS EEE eT Lg) bs Np SR SO SVS Yoo, wm 3 wa "8 Ry pr i Hg THE COURYY All right, let's bring the jury in,  



  

{Whereupon the Jury returned to the Courtroom, 

after which the following proceedings were had.) 

HE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, ag you move in 

and out of tae jury box, sit wherever you want to except 

we ask that the alternate jurors sit in one seat so 1 

won't forget who the alternate jurors are. I have a 

habit of making notes during the trial and invariably 

before we get through I will bave forgotten who is the 

alternate juror and who isn't. That is the only reason 

we have special seats for the alternates, malnly as an 

when I send you out to deliberate, I won't send the 

alternates unless the need arises, of course. 

How, will vou please stand and take your second 

oath. 

(Whereupon, the trial oath was administered to the * W 

jury, ) 

THE COURT: Hr. Parker, do you care to make an 

opening statement? 

Mite PARKER: feg, Your HOnOr. 

Ladies and gentlemen, 1 af Ruse Parker, P—éa—-r-k-a-r., 

I am one of the Assistant DRistrict Attornevs. This gentle- 

3 bis
 

a
 

A
y
 

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F
d
 

ey
 

W
g
 

Po
 & 

~~ Sy gi a - Bn Fa POY ik St 3 HP g op PY 
man willl me 38 dr. Som Thirasngy ne 1s alec 

Assistant District Attorneys of Fulton County. The other 

3 eaviciy FSH bo 45 1% 4 S| Bn ph I « 5 G8 g > don 5 
gentieman Ww hs fia well Cie Te With 82, the BOAVY get fellow, 

 



  

he 18 an investigator with the District Attorney's 

Office. The other gentleman sitting there with me who 

is not there now, of course, is Detective Welcome Harris 

who will be a witness in this case. 

CL course, Mr, Lewis Blaton is the District Attorney 

of the Atlanta Judicial Circuit, which includes all of 

Fulton County. 

in a few moments 1 intend to go in and briefly out- 

line @#8 best I can what I expect the evidence to show in 

this case, but vou should bear in mind, however, that of 

course what I say is not evidence, I am not tescifving. 

“hose witnesses that will testify will testify from the 

witness stand. There will be a number of exhibits that 

z introduced into evidence, both photo- probably wild b & ~~
 

graphs and other things, and of course 1f they are 

admitted by the Court, they become evidence, and perhaps 

other exhibits will be admitted, and if they are admitted 

oy the Court, they become evidence. That is evidence 

that you can consider right along with the oral testimony 

Com the |itnosgen. e
t
l
 

Now, ag the indictment was read to you, and of 

course as you were questioned by both counsel, myself and 

Hr, Turner, 1 believe you are now aware that there was a 

‘urnliture Store at 993 Marietta r
e
 robbery at the Dixie 

Street on May the 13th, 1978. That is what I exvect the 

-179~- 

 



  

evidence to show vou, that this was a robbery that 

occurred somewhere in the middle of the afternoon, in 

the vicinity of 23115, 2:30, along in that area, and it 

involved four robbers, three who came in & rear door 

through a truck loading area, and one who came in the 

front 4GoOr. 

I expect the evidence to show that there was a 

number of people working at the Dixie Furniture Store, 

that three people at least were on the back loading dock 

where a truck was, and there was another man back there 

by the name of Mr, Nelloms, I think they will probably 

refer to him as the cardboard man, he is the one that was 

picking up cardboard. 

I expect the evidence to show that people on the 

loading dock, the first time they became aware of any~ 

thing happening was an individeal walking between the 

truck and the back part of the warehouse, in a very small 

area, coming in theve with a sawed-off shotgun and a black 

coat; and Of course at that time they became aware that 

there were some. other people coming in with guns ag well. 

I expect the evidence to show that they had a little 

difficulty with the man down at the card -- where they 

were keeping the cardboard, either to explain to him what 

was happening or getting him to come up on the loading 

platform, and one of the robbers that came in the back 

 



  

want on through the back door there into the main 

portion of the building, and 1 expect the evidence to 

show that, of course, it's like a lot of furniture stores, 

and there are a lot of exhibits. 

As you go towards the back, that is the office 

area, and one of these robbers ran through that office 

area and secured it, as far a Ft
 5 letting people know what 

wag going-on, and another man, & fourth robber, cane 

through the front door, and his responsibility was to 

handle those people at the front desk and to watch the 

front door, that was hig assigned responsibility in this 

robbery. 

They took the three people from the loading dock 

and eventually the carsboara man, and they noved then 

back behind the office area in a little room, I don't 

know what they call it, some may refer to it as a file 

room, some may refer to it as the room where the safe was, 

and that they put these five people down on the floor, face- 

down, and the fifth man being a Mr. Ronnie Dukes who was €2
 

in the office area, nd the manager of the store, that 

one robber who came through picked him up, he was the 

first man taken back to this room and laid on the floor. 

ol here were three robbers in this back room, and the 

conversation did ensue between them, and the witnesses over- 

_—
 

fe
 

jis
 

r ~
~
 

FE 
aa
d 

n ob oe
 

Fa
 

Pe
 of it, as to where is the noney, certain threats 

~181= 

 



  

were nade, "We are going to blow your heads off if you 

nove and don't tell us where the money is." 

I expect the evidénce to show there were at least 

four employees up in the general office area, but not 

guite as far back as the loading dock, and this involves 

two men and two women, and one of these men had a gun on 

- 
x him, that he was a route salesman and he sometimes fre- 

guently carried a weapon with him, and that these four 

individuals, two nales and two females, were made to lie 

down on the floor in the office area, generally facing 

the north wall. 

Wow, I don't know how many of you are familiar with 

Marietta Street, but as you go north on Marietta Btreet, 

if any of you are familiar with it, on the right as you 

40 out towards Howell Mill in that area, the Dixie 

Furniture Htore sits on the right, that is, the front 

door faces west, and so if people are facing one wall, 

then they would be facing the north wall or the south 

wall, 

I expect the evidence to show that these lying on 
A 

$ the floor in the general office area were generally facing 

the north wall, and that becomes important, because as they 

are laying on the floor then what they hear and they are 

going to tell you about was coming in their left ear. ‘ 

how, 1 expect the evidence to show that the two 

 



  

ladies that were in that front general area got a 

fairly good look at the man who came through the front 

door, and I expect that those two ladies will identify 

warren MceClesky, the defendant on trial here today. 

I espect them to testify that he hed a silver- 

looking pistol, that is important, silver, nickel 

plated, chrome plated, something shiny, that possibly one 

of the robbers in the Lack room came up to the front, I 

don't say the front, I don't mean up by the front door, 

but into the general other area where the people were on 

the floor asking, "Where is the manager," and that one of 

these ladies paid, "His name is Ronnie," and, "Where is 

i [ the money," and I think she possibly told them where the 

money was, and while this was going on, the people in the 

back room were belng taped with some hospital tape, but 

they didn't finish taping all of them, and Mr. Dukes, the 

+ 

manager, I expect the evidence $0 show that his Time: 

watch was taken off 

later recovered, 

I expect the evidence to show that it was recovered 

apartment complexes over by Techwood 

in & long bullding there, elther next door or very close 

where the sister of one of the defendants, David Burney, 

his wrist and that that Timex watch was 

iives, that is, this ig where that watch wes recovered, and 

I expect Mr. Dukes to positively identify that watch to you. 

wei 3 

 



  

1 expect he will tell you that it has been in the family, 

it was a gift to bim and he had the watch for seven years, 

and he may not have any exact marks on it, but he knows it 

ig his watch. Of course, that is for you to decide, how 

well he knows his watch. 

1 expect the evidence to show that the people lying 

in the general office area, not in the file room or the 

safe room, facing the wall, heard someone say, "The police 

L] LY 

are coming,” or words to that effect, and that this 

individual then stepped on some of those people, the legs 

on the floor, getting over them, 

I expect the evidence to show that as in most stores 

there was a counter there, and as they ave listening to 

what is going on, coming into the left ear, they hear 

this man who has now stepped over them going up towards 

the front of the store, not all the way, but in the 

general vicinity of the north wall, that is, the wall 

that they are facing, and that shortly thereafter two 

shots are heard, some people seem tO think maybe they 

heard more shots, one may testify that he heard three, 

I think one in the back room may testify that he heard 

five, 

Now, what he was hearing, I can't say, whether it 

was the echoes or what, put 1 expect the evidence to show 

then that following the shooting these people who were 

-184=- 

 



  

laying on the floor then heard running, and the man and 

his wife who were sitting at the traffic light outside, 

i 

i expect them to testify, by the name of New, Mr. and 

Mrs. Hew, that they actually saw the police car drive 

up to the Dixie Purniture Store as they were waiting 

there at that trafilc light, The car was coming down 

Marietta and pulled in to the front of the Dixie Purniture 

Store, and the officer got out, and his blue light was 

golng and no siren, and he went inside the store, and very 

shortly thereafter they heard what they thought was a gun- 

hot, and then very shortly there duain they heard what 

they thought wag another gunshot, and following that they 

roung black male running out of the Dixie 

urniture Store, turning right, which would put hin 

& generally going north, and proceeding down to the corner, 

which would be. Eighth Street, and turning that corner, 

and that is the last they saw of that individual. 

I expect the evidence Lo show that they observed 

him apparently cupping some type of a pistol, silver, 

nickel, chrome plated, in his hand as he went running 

down the street. 

They then proceeded on down to a pay station and 

attempted to call the police, and I believe they did -~ 

actually call the police. 

| : 5 : 3 i, WE . Pow 23 SR ae, $i om ‘a » ka he . Pos Fp a # I expect the evidence to show that one of the young 

5 
- 1 1 -— 

NF 

 



  

girls who was working in the office who actually saw the 

man come through the front door hit the burglar alsrm, or 

the alarm systen, immediately as she saw that, and that is 

what triggered the police, Officer Schlatt, being sent to 

the store to begin with. 

After the police arrived, I expect the evidence to 

show that Officer Schlatt was hit, once in the right eve, 

and once in the chest, and that shell apparently hitting a 

cigarette lighter or sume object and bouncing off into a 

vellow=green, chartreuse, some type of a sofa, and that 

was located within a few feet of his head after he was hit. 

He hit on his back with his gun in his hand, and one of 

the employees came down and took the gun off and put it 

aver on the side over here, and then turned Officer 

Sechlatt on his left side so thet he wouldn't choke on his 

blood, and then they apparently tried to secure the 

n
d
 

building until the other police officers could arrive an: x3 & 

medical help could arrive. 

expect the evidence to show that, of course, po
i 

Cfficer Schlatt died shortly thereafter. 

The evidence will show that there was a& black leather 

coat that was left in this file room, safe room, or whatever 

you want to call it, that was back behind this general 

office area. 

I expect the evidence to show that that coat was 

-l86~ 

 



  

traced and to an individual through a company that had 

dyed that coat, ami that in turn led to the name Of an 

individual by the name of Ben Wright, Jr. I believe there 

was another item that was found in that room, also a glove. 

I expect the evidence will show that the officers 

investigating it, of course, made what they would maybe 

term a neighborhood investigation, walking around the 

building, and located in the dumpster behind the Dixie 

Furniture Store was some type of a black knit pullover 

hat with a stocking cep in it, and that they photographed 

this and the location of this where this was found, 

I expect the evidence to show that the one slug that 

was recovered out of this yellow or green or chartreuse 

couch next to the officer's head was taken to the crime 

iab, along with some fragments removed from his body, and 

1 expect the testimony to indicate that those shots were 

fired from a Rossi, R-O-8-s=-i, pistol, that the people from 

the crime lab, due to the lands and grooves apparently can 

pinpoint ag to what type of weapon that was. 

The State expects to introduce testimony, which I 

will not go into at this time, as to where that weapon 

possibly cane from and who acquired that weapon. 

I expect the evidence to show that the gird friend 

ef one of the defendants, Ben Wright, was at house the 

morning of the 13th, that she knows all of the individuals, 

 



   

Ben Wright, David Burney, Bernard Depree, and the defen- 

dant on trial, Warren lHcClesky, 

I expect the evidence to show that they came by her 

house that morning in Warren McClesky's black-colored 

Pontiac two-door Grand Prix, and three of them staved in 

the car, and Warren HeClesky came into her house to pick 

up a sawed-off shotgun, possibly a paper sack that con- 

tained, and I will let her use the expression that she 

v8 and gloves, and also he obtained some uses, but nas 

shotgun shells from her house and took those with him, 

and that as he was walking out of the house with the 

black leather coat that was later found, as well as the 

shotgun, she made the comment to him, "Cover the shotgun 

with the coat 80 people won't see what is going on," and 

that he went on up the street where the car was, and 

shortly thereafter the car came down the street and she 

observed all four people in it, including McClesky, who 

had been inaide her house to pick up the shotgun and the 

eguipment, David Burney, Bernard Depree, and Ben Wright. 

1 expect the evidence to show that officers in 

Powder Springs, Georgla, will probably be witnesses in 

this cage, who obtained arrest warrants and search warrants 

for Warren HeClesky, which were served at a residence early 

ope morning on May the 306th of 1978, that he was living with 

his sister who had married a gentleman by the name of 

w]e 

 



  

Mr. Myers, that present at that house at the time 

Mr. MceClesky was arrested wap a& brenda lee Hardy, 

allegedly a girl friend, that a wallet was found of 

Depree's containing some, I believe, approximately 

$410, that approximately $665 was found under a pillow 

in the bed that was being occupied by Warren MoClesky, 

y 

and some other money, pessibly 58660, wag found in 

Brenda Lee Hardy's purse, 

How, a weapon was also recovered, a .38 pistol, but 

not a Rossi, that following that David -- I mean Warren 

MceClesky was taken to the Cobb County Sheriff's Depart- 

gent where he was advised of his rights and was inter- 

viewed by Cobb County officers, as well as officers from 

the City of Atlanta. 

I expect the evidence to show that he gave a state~ 

ment there denying any involvement in this robbery of the 

Dixie Furniture Store on May the 13th, 1978. 

I expect the evidence to show that that same day 

bavid Burney had been arrested in Atlanta at the Techwood 

Apartments, and was in custody on Hay the 3lst, 1978, when 

Atlanta officers, after having interviewed McClesky in 

Cobb County, cane back to Atlanta, took out an arrest 

warrant for HeClesky, charged him with murder, went to 

Cobb County and arrested him and brought him back to 

Atlanta. 

-] 80 

 



    

1 expect the evidence to show that Hellesky made 

certain statements to the officers, a2 Lieutenant Percy 

and a Sergeant MeConnell, ag they were transporting him 

from Cobb County to Atlanta, that they got him to Atlanta 

and interviewed him further, and I expect the evidence 

to show that he gave a right lengthy statement, the con= 

tents of which I will not go into as I am sure there will 

be an objection, 

Thoge of you who are familiy with the case have 

indicated that you had read or heard something about it 
3 

w- 4 

and may be familiar with one of the fourth individuals in 

the case by the name of Ben Wright, who became a fugitive 

A Justice and pe
 

re
 C fled the state of Georgia and was subge= 

guently arrested in Arkansas, Pine Bluff, for an armed 

robbery there, who pled guilty to that charge and was 

subsequently extradited to the state of Ceorgla, 

1 expect Ben Wright to testify as a State's witness 

in this case. 1 expect Mr. Wright to tell you what the 

State has indicated to him that we will recommend to the 

Court as to a matter of punishment in this case, 

I expect Ben Wright to tell vou, though, the ingide 

information that was not given by pMelClegsky. wt
 

gw 
1 p oy Ki HO on SR a 3 wy Pu An oy pn gn Bm J Bn Sv ai FT Fon woe Toes o foo Foi on I expect Ben Wright to testify that HoClesxy had the 

PR a | P i a To oR we RE EEE ; a Pe 4 gy Be Pn 3 ae © tata 8 ru Py $e ht es ¥ 3 3 Ph 
HliVver-i00king pistol, and I expeCt Ben wright to Telli you 

Bor ave i i THEE gon 8 . . iE wt BT ap ge tis PRA ” ” Ry i 2 PE AREER Jy DUREE VG, Sa Fr 
where that plgtol came Lrom, and I expect Ben Wr ight to 

 



  

tell you that there was 

the robbery took place, 

rear apparently ran out 

game in, ran around tie 

ran out the front, down 

they met back over here 

“ MeClesky had parked hi 

oe iid ARAL ou xX fa 

aI mace & Sil 

argument ensued in the 

happened. 

5 

gunaliots he looked out 

file room or safe room, 

was, didn't see anvihin 

the front door, that he 

been shot, that when 

left-hand 

#%% & 
St 

Ben Wright to testify 

ow { bs + GB oi 

g but HMellesky 

they 

an argument that ensued after 

5 

that the three people 

the rear door the same way they 

of the store, and McClesky RT 
MEaOR 

gr, WS ar ha wh PETE T a 4 ou bx PE, gtreet and turned right, and the 

Off Street where 

car, and they &ll got in that 

turn and headed cut and an 

¥ wanting to know what had 

when he heard the 

there where the 

Or whatever you want to call it, 

sunning out towards 

didn't know whethey 

ot in the car 4 

oH 

a5 4 a oh Lp £34 be ps ha mh 23 Eh A 20 1 gn i i a: % wo f™ FOR TER WI, ani was asked what had happened, and McClesky told them 

Fy in § iG: gn i Sa ty - ER Lap Sr er go | SN i sui ion : i" oF. GRR w wn as Bor 
that he saw the officer coming, he saw the officer park 

get out, come 

told Ben Wrigh 

freeze, and when the 

Wright, "I shot him twill 

and an argument ensued 

on and they went to the 

officer 

with hig gun pulled, that 40] 

£, that he told the officer to 

McClegky told Ben 

him once in the head,” 

apout that, but the car proceeded 

OTE BT SE ee 4 ia 4% residence, or at least 

out on Richland Avenue in the 

191m 

 



  

&
 

Southwest section of Atanta, and there they changed 

clothes and attempted to divvy up the money, and at 

that point Burney caught a cab coming home, or at 

least that is what he told Ben Wright, that Depree 

apparently stayed there for a little while, and that 

MeClesky and Ben Wright then left together and in 

MecClesky's black Grand Prix car, and that they made 

several visits or stops that late afternoon, and 

-
.
 = pot
 

—~
 

8 aventually ended up over at Burney's house or 

sister's house over on Techwood where they watched the 

news later that evening. 

Burney was not there, but David Burney's two 

sisters were there, and following that then, after hearing 

the news and that the officer had died, McClesky and Ben 

Wright and one of the sisters then left in McClesky's 

gar and drove to the south area of Atlanta with Ben Wright, 

eventually ending up at the Old South Motel there on the 

South Expressway, and MeClesky rented a room for them, 

Now, 1 expect that to generally be the evidence as 

to what transpired on May the 13th, 1978, as far as this 

murder and robbery goes, 

There will De some other evidence the State will 

attempt to put in concerning this incident, but this is 

not the proper time because I am sure that there will be 

some objections made, 

tt BE 

 



  

Thank you. 

SORE oo BRE Sl i % 6 Bog ad ¥ EM yom oy an Bo 
ig 8 LOUK Te 5 ag LA Der. 

id Ta FRIAS ki Tosa pa a Ro ¢ on vs 3 1 EW ai TN TT 5 oe 
Mie TURNER: ladies and gentl Cle, my nama 18 

- 

Turner and 1 represent the defendant in this case. 

As the able prosecutor pointed out to you, this is 
Sy 

John 

. 

the pericd of the trial known as the opening statement, 

and what we say to you is what we think the evidence is 

going to show. As the prosecutor pointed out, what wa 

say is not evidence, the only evidence is going to come 

from the witness stand. 

Row, once that happens, I think you are going 

se@ a totally different picture from what the able 

prosecutor pointed out. 

Humber one, .no ladies involved in any robbery 

ever ldentified Mr. CClesky, admittedly, Hatter of 

the evidence will show you one of the ladies who was 

the furniture store that day who gave a detailed desc 

tion of the individual and who was standing next to 

Mr. FMoeClesky at the time of the preliminary hearing 

Phils is not the man.” 

3 

to 

nave 

fact, 

BHI, 

The evidence is also going to show you that they 

have had several people arrested, 1 can't savy several, 

one or two people arrested and charged with the same 

st alan te been Hay Is mans ane rn BA bon Yoh aa Tix 
murder peilore Cay GOT tO Mr. HeClesky. 

“he evidence is going to show you, in short, 

 



    

don't know what happened in the case, The evidence is 

going to show you that Mr. Ben Wright had a lot to talk 

about, after he ran away from the state of Georgla, got 

caught robbing a ‘jewelry store and was brought back. 

I£ not for the generous deal Mr. Parker made to 

Mr. Ben Wright, he wouldn't be testifving at all. The 

evidence will show that he would probably be sitting 

over there in that same chair. 

“he evidence will show you when it gets down to what 

Mr. Ben Wright has to say, he has lied several times, and 

we are going to make him eat each one of those lies. In 

fact, the evidence will prove that for you. 

in fact, I think the evidence will strongly sug 

that he pulled the trigger, but he has everything else 

for the evidence not to show that. 

What else will the evidence show in this case, 

ladies and gentlemen? The evidence will show the way 

Mr. HeClesky originally got arrested was because the 

Atlanta Police Department had targeted him for that. 

The evidence is going to show prior to the day of 

his arrest Mr. HeClesky wasn't suspected of any involve- 

ment in the Dixie Furniture Btore robbery. As a matter 

Of fact, the evidence will show you that Atlanta police 

officers called Marietta, got the Marietta police to 

execute a warrant on Mr, McClesky and went with then 

-194~ 

 



  

while they did execute the warrant, 

The evidence will further show that once they got 

Mr. MeClesky in Marietta they did everything except put 

the thumbscrews on him to get a statement out of him. 

ihe evidence will show you just what happened in 

terns of any statements he made, but if you compare any 

statements that he made with any of the other evidence 

in this cease, you will see, ladies and gentlemen, I am 

gure, that the statements that were made were nade under 

duress, but that i8 for another time, 

The basic thing, ladies and gentlemen, is that the 

case boils down to two elements. The only thing the 

State has against my client is, number one, what they 

consider to be his statement. You will see that no 

witness from the furniture store is going to be able to 

identify my <¢lient, and they have not done it up until 

today, it has not been done, 

Number two, Ben Wright, as 1 told you, #r. Wright 

has evervihing to gain, 

Munbey three, ladies and gentlemen, I think the 

evidence is going to show you that the reason Mr. HcClesky 

1s here today is because he wouldn't plead guilty to a 

deal offered by the learned prosecutor, 

I think at the end of this you will see Mr, HeClesky 

is not guilty Of any offense, the evidence will show that 

a BB Be 

 



  

bevond a reasonable doubt, and nuaber two, this case is 

nothing but a fabrication. 

Now, true, in terms Of the basic facts uf the 

robbery, a8 the prosecutor told you, that is what happened, 

but when vou examine those facts vou are qouing to find out 

that even now they don't know who pulled the trigger, 

nothing but speculation, nothing but guessing, and they 

chose Fr. Ben Wright's words. 

Now, when you look at Mr. Wright, the evidence is 

going to show you that he has a record as long as both 

my arms. 

Ladies and gentlemen, what this case bolls down to 

ig a simple fact that a police officer was killed, that 

is very unfortunate, but the police department had to do 

something about it, they had to get somebody. The somebody 

they got is sitting over there, 

This case doesn't represent justice, ladies and 

gentlemen, as you will see, it represents an attempt at 

revenge because the police officer was shot, which was a 

very unfortunate circumstance, but the State has decided 

to elect Mr. MeClesky as the one, and they » 

w- 
want a pound 

of flesh, except in this cage you will find what they 

want, ladies and gentlemen, is 160 pounds of flesh. 

At the end of ths cage I think the evidence will 

be clear and your duty will be c¢lear, and we'll ask you 

RAY bof T= 8 Rua 

 



  

How, be cautious, ladies and gentlemen, this is one 

cage that is going to be very important to all of us, 

vecause you hold the verdict of life or death in your 

shank you. 

Se So TY Tare | PR AE 0 $0 yu PY gu an Tak ie wen " 3 wa PLR aw gon 
FRG Ew CO AEE 1 All 4 ignt y EL 8 Yarser Fi call your dl 1X St 

0 pe BF, SRO BF RN uy 4 TN pe gen * E% Ror gin pil 

fiRe PARKER: Call Ronald Dukes. 

THE JUROR: Excuse me, Judge, I have the keys to 

my car. My wife is here and in the State Court. She 

have to get the keys to her, J
e
w
 

4 F
a
!
 

5
 

pod
 

can't leave ar 

THE COURT: If you will give it to the sheriff -- 

is she in the courtroom now? 

THE JUROR: 1 don't know where she was at. | she was 

in the State Court downstairs somewhere. Let me see if I 

have a plece of paper and =-- 

an
t PLY PS ¢ “* bY 38 3 - on a oo vs i a ATT A - on - 

wil COURT: vill you confer with the juror just a 

minute, Nr. Bherifil, and see 1f he can give you some idea 

th aa a Cre 81 Pn Gh Bo = § ue vy y TERE where you can find his wife. 

“ BY 

first duly sworn, wag examined and testified as follows: 

(J Bir, would you give us your name, please? 

- 5 Foo- 

 



    

> ) ronald warren Dukes. 

py, | oo pr 

WLR | ey are you en loyed at the 

a TYE EAR NO a a A Levite Furniture Company. 

And how long have vou been with 
Pes 

About & month. 

And what was your previous emplo 

A Dixie Furniture Company. 

LS) 
Nt 5; And could you tell us where you 

A I was working at 993 Marietta 8t 

All right, sir. And is that loc 

4 # 3 3 

A Yes, Blr, it is, 

8; How, when did you work there, sir 

I worked from August of '67 to A 

; 4 A 3 4 ~ % 

Gia have & An ££
 

You 

worked there, sir? 

A I was the manager. 

Q All right, sir. Can you tell us 

tiie Dixie Furniture Store there on Marietta, 

it faces and so forth? 

A We face south. 

How about Harietta Street, where 

relation to the store? 

Marietta Street would be running 

198 - 

present time, sir 

yisent , Mr. Dukes? 

worked for them, 

ow Re 6% ™ 
iN ® Wi » reet, 

ated in Fulton 

Fd 

ugust of 178, 

position there when vou last 

something about 

which direction 

goes it run in 

east and west. 

“> 

. 

 



  

| ¥ How, is there another street in the immediate 

vicinity of you there? 

A Howell Mill koad branches off to the right, right 

at the store. We are Kind of in a fork. 

Q All right, sir. And what is the next street if 

yOu are going north that you would run into ‘after you pass the 

store, if you know? 

pe Let's see, Horthaide Drive, Ho, goinuy north, it 

would be Eighth Street, 

2 All right, sir. Bow, is there also a street behind 

Dixie Purniture Stove? 

A Well, that is Eighth Street which runs behind 

Dixie Furniture Company. 

% Now, were vou working there on May the 13th, 15782 

A Ye, siv, I was, 

ht, sir. and do you recall what day that 

might have been? 

A It was on a Saturday. 

{ All right, sir. UFow, did anything unusual happen 

to you that day? 

A At approximately two o'clock I was walking back 

towards the back of the store, I wag in the office area and 

I turned to the right and a man was standing there, and he had 

S
e
e
 

a stocking on his face, 1 glanced down and he had & pistol. 1 

turned and continued walking towards the back 9©f the store 
* 

 



  

to walk back into a little storeroom area where the safe was 

located. The safe door was open amd he stopped and put on 

gome gloves and he looked at the safe, and he could see that 

there was nothing in it. I told him at that time the cash was 

in my desk in the right-hand drawer, I told him my desk was 

in the glass enclosure, He told me to lay down on the floor, 

which 1 did. 

} What is the next thing that you are aware of then, 

sir? 

A He came back and he said, "Where is the rest of the 

noney?® He put something in my back. 1 told him, I said ~~ 1 

assumed he had gotten the noney out of the cash register and I 

sald that there wasn't any more. He seen my watch on my arm and 

he sald, "Cive me your watch," which I did. Then he shoved his 

hand down in my pocket and I had six dollars in it of my own 

money and he took it. fe left, and just a few minutes later he 

came back. I assumed there was more than one in there at that 

time, because they was talking about tving us up, and then he 

put another object in my back and started demanding money again, 

and a few minutes later -- a few minutes later we heard gunshots 

and we waited a few minutes and got up. 

¥ Now, were vou threatened while you were lying on the 

floor, sir? 

& Yes. I mean, as far as somebody putting a gun in 
oF 

your back and demanding money, vou are threatened, 

 



  

L
y
 

a
 a Pr
t 

Fr
t 

o
r
 

right, sir. Was there wr 

room with you , Bir? 

There were four other people 

LO Know who they were? |
 Yau 

A There O1d man 

cardboard ng right a vv. ~ getting ¢ hie was 

there wag w- 

8, LO 

A I believe it's Henry Hel 

I didn't know him before. I have heard 

All right, 4 5 

Fe aay Fi a ap ov 5 88 a truck a4 RN LYB0N, WOO WaE a LIrugk 

Grier, he was a helper on the truck; Dan 

ile id 8 Q All right, 

there that day other than those you were 

¥ 

& Mamie Thomas, she 1s a clerk 

18 a clerk; Darrell Malcom, he is a sale 

after 

A 

{ And where did you see then, 

A They were on the left~hand 

that got 

ir 3! 

lson or something, 

driver for us; 

Now, were there any oth 

sHan ; 

in that 

cardboard, was 

front of me, and 

Henry =—- 

name since, 

James 

Oliver, worked in 

Lr 
ha 

9 empl ovees 

just naming? 

Classlie Barnwell, she 

and George Malcom, 

lo Kes ag a wy Bow fon pan wow the rovbery 

them after the robbery was over? 

the office area in 

 



  

on the left-hand side of the store. We have a place where we 

have got some salesmen's desks and they were on the left-hand 

g1de of the store in the office area, which is in the rear of 

the store. 

¥, All right, sir. How, where is your office in 

relation to where their offices are and thig safe room? 

A Hy office would be on the right. It wag in the 

center of the store. 

{J Can you describe your cffice to the jury as to 

what it consisted of? 

A Okay, On the back wall was a panel wall; it had 

a glass enclosure which -- well, it was penelled up to about 

four foot, and then there wag about a two foot glass around it, 

and inside my office, when you walked in there, in there was a 

loveseat and my desk and chair, and behind my desk and chalr was 

a £ile cabinet and a == 

J All right, sir, Now, after the robbery wag over == 

were you ever taped, sir? 

8 HNO. 

g Were any of the other people, to your Knowledge, 

in the back room taped? 

A Yes, 

8 Do vou recall who might have been taped, sir? 

A I believe Ben and Dan end James were taped. 

oY
 0 All right, sir. Now, did vou notice anything 

{3 

 



  

unusual after the shots vere fired? What did you do then? 

A We laid there for & few minutes and then we got 

up and we walked -= we walked out front and I got outside of 

thie office area and 1 seen the officer laying there. 

8 Where was He laying exactly, sir, if you recall? 

A It would have been about fifteen feet inside the 

gtore. He was laying on his back. His head was towards our 

front door and his feet wag towards the office area. 

How, was this in an alsle or what would you call 

A It was in an elsle, Ve had actually three aisles, 

we had & center aisle going in the front door all the way back 

to tne counter, and then we had two aisles that branched off, 

one to the right and one to the left, 

% And how far approximately are they from the center 

aisle? 

A How, he was in the center aisle. 

oO Mow, what did you do at that time, if anything? 

A Well, I walked out front of the store and then 

turned around and walked in and told somebody to call the 

police and an ambulance, walked over there and Dan was at the 

- 

policeman, and I picked up his head and laid it over, you know, 

80 the blood would go out of his mouth, and he was like that 

until the first police got there. 

1 And can you give us an idea how long it took for 

 



  

another officer to arrive? 

A It was only minutes. Actually it seemed like 

lots longer than that. I think it was only three or four 

minutes, maybe five minutes, 

; All right. Now, you said the man that robbed 

got your watch, sir? 

b Right, that's correct. 

iv Bow, would you look at the watch on the desk i 

front of vou which is marked as State's Exhibit Bumber 1, 

would you examine that for me, please, sir? Have vou seen 

watch before, sir? 

A Yes, it's my watch. 

{ All right, sir. And how can you be 80 positiv 

is your watch? 

A I have got a scratched crystal, plus the band 

changing colors, 

{J Can you give us some ldea of how long you have 

that watch before it was taken? 

A Approximately seven years. 

0) And did you more or less wear it constantly? 

A Yes, I did. 

8 On a scale of one to one hundred, how positive 

you that that is your watch? 

A One hundred. 

(d There is no doubt in your mind? 

-204= 

& 

you 

i 

and 

that 

that 

ig 

had 

 



  

see, 1 

robbevy 

Liiere 

CER 
8 « 2d 

there 

  

A MO doubt whatsoever, 

0 was 1t just recently that you saw the watch again 

@ first tine? 

# 
£3 

believe it 

y? 

{ * 

-“_ 

with 

A 

That's correct. 

And when did you see it, if vou recall, sir? 

Cetective Walker brought it out to Levitz, let's 

was a week ago last Friday, around six o'clock 

And that is the firet time you had seen it since the 

That's 

How, the man at was taking that, you say, was back 

you when the shots were fire 

Wo == I don't know. 1 mean, the watch 

the first time he came back there. 

x 

DO you know who that man is who took your watch? 

Bo, I don't, 

Now, how many of the robbers did vou actually see y ¥ 3 ’ 

UNE » 

One? 

%, E+
 

DO you actually know of your own knowledge how many 

From my own Knowledge, 1 know that there were three. i 

Know 8iv? | $1 & F 

-205=



  

They vere talking back and forth back there, and 

when they started talking about tying us up or taping us up, 

orders. 

one was in command and the other two wag following 

All right, sir. How, did you make an inventory 

at the Dixie Furniture Store following the robbery? 

Yes, we did. 

And can you tell us how that was conducted? 

Chay. After everything was checked in, that night 

all the money and took what we started the wéek with, 

what we took in for the week, and deducted what we 

BY
 Fo
rd
 

4 
ol
 

% And approximately what did you come up with, sir? 

Approximately $2204 Te
n 

Was missing. 

Is that a shortage? 

Right. 

How, could you tell us anything about that money? 

It was in checks and cash. 

LO you know which was which, sir? 

No, I don't. 

Do. you have any way ©0f making an educated guess? 

Approximately probably $1500 would have been cash, 

Just == 

hE 
~206- 

 



  

¥ How would you arrive at a figure like that? 

A Really, there is no way, because really ~- 

0 is this based on past experience generally? 

A Right, 

{ were the checks also taken? 

A Right. 

Q Were any other checks or money taken that you know 

of? 

A Hot that I know of, 

0 and six dollars of vour personal money was taken? 

A That's correct, 

0 Sir, did you go to a preliminary hearing concerning 

this matter? 

A Yes, I did. 

QJ And do you recall where that was? 

A It was the Atlanta City Court. 

iJ DG you recall how many defendants there were at the 

time? 

A ree. 

Q And were you asked to determine if vou could identify 

anyone? 

A Yes, I was. 

& What was your response to that, sir? 

A I could not identify anybody. 

& All right, sir, Have you been able to identify 

 



  

anybody subsequently? 

8; Can you describe in any more detail the stocking 

mask that was on this one individual that you definitely saw? 

¥
 2 Ho, I can't, The main thing that stuck out was 

the fact that he had a mask on, I knew what was happening, and 

i glanced down and seen the pistol. 

HR, PARKER: I believe that is all I have at this 

time, Your Honor. 

"ys 6 Td oy RE ply we se 

CROLE-EXAMINACION 

4 Hre Dukes, I believe you sald that this started at 

two o'clock, is that right? 

A Approximately. 

{ flow do you approximate that time? 

A Let's see, I might have glanced at the clock or == 

I don't know, it's -- well, later on, I mean, you know, after 

it was all over with, I did call up and find cut when the alarm 

was pushed which wag 2:12 or 2:10. 

b
e
 

4 

Q All right. Very good, iow, you say that the indi- 

vidual who approached vou had a gun, is that correct? gl o or I 

2 That's correct, 

# What type of gun did he have? 

A it was 8 black revolver. 

& a black revolver? 

i FAB -— 3 Ps Bn 

 



  

Black 

being 

£2 Now, how do you remember that particular fact? 

& It 8tands out, 

8 It couldn't have been anything else other than a 

revolver? 

A Ho, 1 mean, that stands out pretty well, vou know. 

8 All right, Then it wouldn't have been a shotgun, 

A Pefinitely not, 

iBs TURNER: OKay. Thank you. 

REDIRECT EXAMIKATION 

* gir, can you tell us whether or not the man that 

giving directions is the one that took your watch? 

A Bo, I-¢can't, 

MR. PARKER: Thank vou, sir. 

THE CQURT: Any reason why this witness shouldn't 

be excused? 

MRe TURMER: © 1 have no reason. 

THE COURT: You may be excused. Call your next 

witness, 

MR. PARKE? ® Cail Cla Hele i arnvelil. 

CLASS IE 8B SAR Li WELL, 

first duly sworn, was examined testified as follows: 

RE x 

Suds IN AL ‘TON 

3 ol Ta Wa ¥ 

i2lndke a IG 

 



  

YOu, 

pit 

{J 

her, 

# 

BRONDLhs 

+5 

Cd
l 

A 

about the 

Would vou give us vour name, piesase? 

My name is Classle Barnwell. 

You will have to come forward so everybody can hear 

My nane is Classie Barnwell. 

Ail right, And where are vou working now? 

I work for Legal Finance. 

wiHE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, if you can't hear 

let me knows I heve an instrument panel here that 

supposed to work the microphones, but it doesn't do a 

good job. Let me know, and we'll try to do better, 

(By Mr. Parker) - How long have vou worked there? 

i have been working for Legal Pinance almost three 

And where were you employed prior to that? 

« Dixie Purniture Company. 

And where was that located? 

$93 Marietta Street. 

Can you tell us how long you worked there? 

Can you tell us what you did there? 

1 was sales, secretary, clerk, everything, 

All right. Can you tell us & little something > 

inside of that store theve? 

 



  

oi
s 

So
 1 the back, 

What particular? 

Can you ; 3 oe 8 te 1 ilu 

As you come in, it 

and there is a co 

nerally how it was arranged? 

's like a hallway, and you come 

unter sitting there and my desk 

is in the front, and some more desks ig in the front, and on 

also? 

Pa
g 

o 

A 

£% 

ide ig the routemen 

Could you tell us 

It's in 

All right. 

Can you tell us wh 

AS you come in the 

ind can you tell u 

Not exactly. 1 ca 

In relation to the 

It's right next to 

out we had some doors that you 

GOCKk anc 

Fd 
b* 4 

) » 

  

next to 

How, do you recall 

the back behind 

's desks that are on the other 

safe in that store? 

where that is located? 

the manager's office. 

Now, do you have a loading dock there 

are that ig located? 

front duor it's to the right. 

8g how far back it is? 

n't tell you the distance, but 

office area, where is it? 

the office. It's blocked off, 

could come in from the loading 

the office. 

84 
Ek lay the iA3th, 19782



  

i Can you tell us why you vecall that? 

A A police got killed down there, 

\¥ LO you remember what day Of the week that was? 

A It was On a Baturday. 

Q Can you tell us what time of day, approximately? 

A About == it was about two or 2:30. 

0 in the afternoon? 

afternoon. 

, All right. What were you doing there 

A 1 was typing up some contracts. 

G Pardon? 

A I was typing up some contracts. 

& {J All right. How, do you have an alarm 

store? 

) Yes, sir. 

Q Can you tell us a little bit about that? 

A One of them is up on my desk and the other one 

to the counter. 

G All right. UNow, what is the first thing that 

saw that made you realize something might be amiss? 

A I saw ~~ 1s it okay if 1 point him out? 

8, Just don't point to anybody vet, just tell me 

yOu Saw, 

A This man come running in the door and 1 saw a 

system a 

at that tine? 

t that 

16 

Yau 

gun 

 



  

§; what 

step by step, 

A He can 

and I saw the gun 

alarm and I turned 

I wag afrald to 

geen me hit it. 

% Fo Fd IBS 

Li Could 

Bl os som oh gr 

Mamie 

LW Mamie 

A Manlie 

{J All ri 

* % 
A and Da 

gide in 

running in the 

A He 

the 

gun off of Alvis 

Alvis 

and he around 

  

door did 

@ in the 

sove 

right. 

routem 

£ Akl right, 

LTO 

can 

~ . oo aid go a 4 LAF om 
routement's side 

tell 

snatched 

he come in? 

front 

- 

in hig hand, a silver gun, a: 

around and, you know, 1 was 

again, wut I d 

who they were? 

office on the si 

wii? 

Thomas. 

) ht. 

rrell Malcom and his brother 

en's section. 

nt dooy? 

@ running in the front door 

x 

about Alvis and 

Bom 3 RC al ay . me a Be id 
Fiale hig nals turned, and nen 

the Off and he said, gun 

slow down 

door and he came running 

and 

alarm 

Were any emplovees in that 

Wall 

this 

and he 

3 PEPE TN Se po pre uw gn You . 5 A an By gn and he grabbed Darrell and he snatched 

and tell us 

in, 

to nove F 

before he 

On the other 

man Caine 

GU. 

Alvis turned 

"You ‘thought



  

& 

You were going to be a hero; didn't you?" Darrell said, "The 

money is in my front pocket and ny wallet,” and he sald, "Shut 

up,” and Darvell said, "The money is in my front pocket and 

3 

wallet,” and he said; "You are a smart so and so and ~=-* 

Pon't say so and 56, tell us what he said, 

A He sald, "You are & smart ass," and hé hit Darrell 

upside the head and told Darrell to get over there, and he told 

me to get over there and the other girl, and he told us to lay down 

on the floor and close our eyes, and so another guy, he said =- 

he Kept asking questions about where the money was and where the 

manager was, s0 didn't nobody say nothing, and he said, "1 will 

shoot &ll of you all," or something, 

GO He said what? 

A He said, "I will shoot all of you a&ll,® and then I 

said, "Hig name is FHonnie Dukes," and I tried to describe him, 

but I described him wrong, and so he said, "Cet Ronnie Dukes," 

80 they got him, and the guy said, "Who told you to open your 

  

eyes,” and 80 I closed my eves back, but he kept asking quesg- 

tions and I couldn't help but open pny eves, and then at one time ¥ b Y ¥ 

one said, "The cops, and then it got silent and I heard two 

shots and w= 

# All right. How, how were you lying on the floor at 

a
 

¥ bes
 

w
e
 

Wo
 as lying flat on the floor, you know, like this 

ear was towards the door. 

-214- 

 



  

{J PG what now? 

A My left ear wag towards. the door. 

{J Towards the door? 

A he front door, because he had us laying on the 

side where the routemen was, and I heard two shots, and I 

footsteps, and they was running, and I heard somebody 

breathing, and it sounded like somebody saving, "Help me," 

but I couldn't nove, I was scared, 1 couldn't move. 

, RF pon gn ne 7d Pa ¥ Na GT ps svg he ox You say vou neard two shotg? 

A WO BhOLS., 

8, All right, low, what car did those two shots cone 

A “hey come {rom the left, the way I was laying, they 

was from the left. 

8 Which 18 towardg what? 

A Towards the front door, 

® All right. How, while vou were laying on the floor 

4B po
 i anyone step On you? 

A Somebody run over ny feet, but I didn't know which 

one it was, because there vas one standing behind me, but I 

didn't know which one of the guys run over my feet, but one did 

trip over my feet, 

\ Could you tell nme from how you were stepped on how 

 



  

that person was head 

5 Yes ’ fie 

& Towards 

a5 

wail, the side of th 

side of the aisle wo 

,) On the a 

¥ I real ia 

bhaen which si 

A Talking 

6 Jou are 

wall? 

A There is 

and it's a counter h 

-= he had us laying 

of where the front 4 

“ 

4 WF
 

will ¢ 

All righ 

was headed towards the front doors 

the front door? 

you were laying on the floor facing the 

€ central aisle that came back there, what 

uld vou have beeén on? 

¥ $8 
Yao Fit} 3 ia gio Ie geno 

hi. 0 6 116 3 I vas laving 

not there, had 

de would have been VOU 
wb 

adout the aisle &s you come in the door? 

laying on the floor, and were you facing a 

A ri TY oa nd Ae Ns a a Cac RPE TENE 
[53 wad d nex gp AGE LTR & GOOY L934] that aide 

ere, 80 he had us slanted -- he had us laving 

On the routermen's side 

draw me just a rough diagram could 

oor is? 

EY oe 

Lo ahead. 
te Just indicate where 

the front door is briefly? 

A What do you mean? 

Ha
, 

a BE a FA AT 
ashy AOLALHIS 

    

{ i tAagram, 

not a good drawing, it's hard. 

4: Mr. Sheriff, will you take the 2 

~216-



  

microphone over there so the jury can hear the witne rile. Pod 

SH 

a seat back 

poe ro fn Jo gh & oi os 3 Doin J PIR PH 3 
winile she is at the blackboard. 

Ther Nias o Tov in ge T3140 br a 5 {8B Mle YATURKAL ) JUSE have 

gtand. 

LOOKIng at what has been 

Nunber 2 

#4 Yes * 

0 Ang is that the 

Furniture Store? 

a 

Yes, it is. 

0 Looking at State's Exhibit 

store? < SR ITN EN 
S cline? 

£ Xe 

front view of the 

on the 

State's Exhibit 

¢ GO you recognize that store there? 

store at the 

Humber 3, do you recog=- 

% 

GO Do you know where that might have been, where you 

are looking frow as you look on State's Exhibit Number 3 

there? 

A This 18 as you come in the door. 

{} The {front door? 

dO you recogr 

A Yes, this is almost going back to the back. 

(3 All right, Now, do you see your office or your 

general area in that State's Exhibit Rumber 47? 

bs I | 

-ad T= 

 



  

¥) And where 18 it, in the back there? 

A It's in the back. 

Q Mow, have you seen those photographs before, that 

you Know OI? Have you seen State's Exhibit Humber 4 before or 

does that look familiar to vou? 

A it looks familiar to me, 

# Can you positively state that that is the inside of 

the Dixie Purniture Store looking towards your office area? ~ 

A ies, BLL. 

¥ All right. Can you positively state that that is 

the way it looked on May the 13th, 197872 

A Yas, sir. 

mR. PARKER: Your Honor, the State would move into 

evidence State's Exhibit Number 4 at this tine. 

36 3 we) SLE F) A § 2 on 3% X THE COURT: Any objection? 

MBe TURNER WE O0T ection. 

TRE. COURT: State's Exhibit MNupber 4 ig admitted 

without objection. 

Q (By Mr. Parker) Could you come down before the 

jury and Kind of point out on State's Exhibit Number 4 where 

your office is and where you were lying on the floor. Cone 

right down here with me. 

A it's in the back back there. 

Q Talk up s0 everybody can hear you. 

in the back. > Jd
 

re
 an
 

[£4
 

-218~ 

 



  

etl ed 

™
 
A
 

o
y
 

Fie 

where is the front door? 

“he front door is back this wavy, 

Is this the center aisle? 

Yes, 

The front door is back this wavy? 

You. 

And where were vou laying on the floor? 

Cn this side in the office. 

in the picture, where is that facing? 

This wall on the side -- this one on the side over 

B30 your leit ear would be facing which direction? 

My left ear would be facing the door, 

which is coming down this center aisle? 

The door being down here? 

you heard both shots, did they sound the 4 Now, when 

3 
x ihey was the same. I.don't know very much about 

it was a high powerful gun. 

I: 

Did it sound the same intensity? 

Xe. 

How about the direction that the shots came from? 

It was in the same direction. 

~219=- 

 



  

[ All right. How, what did you hear in your left 

aay as far as directions were concerned? 

st heard the gunshots, 

Q 1 right. Are you able to tell us or to give us 

an opinion as to where those shots came from? 

MRe TURNER: Your Bonor, deiore we get into that, 

going to object. Ho foundation has been 

¢itness to give any opinion, Only experts 

an opinion, as I understand the law, If there 

foundation, I will withdraw my objection. 1 do 

pm de XA Dik oh : 3 Ee an pi i 8 ome Bona il is tine 1t has established. 

COURT: Anybody can give an opinion, 

x 

give her opinion you have to give the 

base the opinion, 

Parker) Do you understand 

4 Bayo 
whit Repeat 

A8 you heard the 

came Irom ag you were laying on the floor. 

A They was from my left ear. There was 

sitting there. 

J You had a what, a counter? 

A Yes, there was a counter gitting there. 

crossed my feet he had to go around on the other side 

counter. 

right? You are saying counter, 

laid for 

can give 

is a proper 

n't know ig 

For & non- 

basis on 

the question? 

which direction they 

a counter 

When he 

of the 

 



  

5 PR 
fat LOS we 

{) REY ed * ™ 

A Okay. There is also an alsle on that side, tou, 

and 80 he had to go that way, and that is where the shots cane 

from. 

{ All right. How, so the shots then came £rom near 

one end of the building, one side of the bullding? 

A One side, you know, inside the store. 

Q And would it have been the same side that you were 

facing while you were laying on the floor? 

FR. TURNER: Your Honor, before we go any further 

I am going to have to object again. Counsel is leading 

the witness. The proper way is just to ask the question 

and let her explain in her own testimony what happened 

rather than to suggest with his words the situation. 

WRT: Try not to lead the witness. 

# (By My. Parker) Do you understand the question? 

A Kepeat that again. 

0 All right. Can you tell ug from what vou heard as 

8 you were lying on the floor? FE
 tO where the shots came {rom é& 

A Yes; sir. 

0 All right, Wow, tell us. Be very explicit about 

what you heard and where the shots came fron. 

A I am laying on the floor and I heard two shots fron 

the left side, two shots, and then after the two shots they 

-221= 

 



  

started running. 

its 

I want 

left. 

() Tell me about the two shots before you go One 

direction == 

A The left, from my left ear. 

A That is as you are coming in the front door and 

over in the corner. 

#) How, what corner are you telking about, that is what 

to know? 

# When you come in, the corner, it would be to the 

%] Would that be another aisle over there? 

& Yes, there is another aisle over there. 

MR TURNER: Well, once again I am doing to object 

for the same reason, he is leading the witness. The 

proper way to do it lg simply ask the witness; ctherwise, 

he should get up and testiiy himself. 

MR. PARKERY I know that counsel is just trying to 

harass and I object to his trying to get into that, 

MR. TURMNER: He says harass, but there are rules of 

evidence to be followed, He well knows about that. 

THE COURT: I will overrule the objection. Proceed. 

# (By Hr. Parker) All rights Now, tell us about the 

aisle and the shots that you heard. 

All right, It's an aisle to your left, Okay: 1 

 



  

heard 

shots, 

to 

be 

& All right. low, where is that a 

where you were laying on the floor? 

A Viell, where I was laying on the 

on my leit, 

THE JUROR: Judge, we have a sic 

POLE EY PINT 
onl COURT: Ladies and gentlemen 

short TQCaBE, 

(Whereupon, the jury retired 

after which the following proceedings 

Gentlemen, before I 

sheriff wants to know if you all have 

his letting each. juror make one phone 

make arvangements about clothes? 

MRe TURNER: Ho objection from u 

ME, PARKER: Your Honor, this is 

witness I have here this evening, 

THE COURT: I am geling to adjour 

the lady juror gets to feeling better, 

five ninutes and I will come back and 

doing. 

(Whereupon, a short recess was h 

THE COURT: Gentlemen, the lady 

“ ws 

sheriii that she was highly nervous, 

frou 

3 

isle in relation 

floor, it would 

K Juror. 

bo rd yr let's take & 

the courtroom, 

were had, 

forget it, the 

any objection to 

call so they can 

oe 

the only other 

n about 5:30 

let's walt ab 

see how she 

ad LJ ) 

juror told the 

two shots on == in == from the left side, there was two 

that is all 1 heard, two shots, and == 

She got to thinking 

 



  

% 
Ae n the spring, and she has to 

an automobile 

be him, 

gald when she was questioned, she didn't think 

she saves she can 

4 ~y pn a soy 3 3 excuse hey and 1 

How, do 

rig ht r 

grouse 

£8 3% 
hb 

FAT 5 
a UR 3 oh 

i PARKER 

DEPUTY 

5, 1 believe, 

second witness, 

would {eel 

do you suggest that 

the Court? 

THE DEPUTY 

get the clerk. 

TIT: Ew) TE S81 nL THE COURT: 

LH BELVE I gues 
- 

8 I will go on 

mpanel the first alternate, 

you 

eq 
# 

hatter 

all want to que 

1f you want to, before I 

Rev. 

SHERIFF: 

ana 

§ : 
oy 

wt 

We don't, Your 

Which juror is 

i3 MUS 

notes show w 

JE So 
i A 

tomorrow if we 

Do you want pe 

—e— GOCE MES. 

HERIFP: 1 don! 

Just go back in 

tell her I will adjourn now until 

she feels like 

welll a FA & 3 husband, 

she 

exXJU 

has to go home 

ge her. 

ve no objection. 

stion her? Yo 

o« 
28 EX ous her 

Honor. 

it? 

allard, 

the @ gtarted 

1 

went ahead and 

to ask her tha 

Ballard 

sir I 

Ki de GAN ow. Tie to 

NG. SBA BiB 

in the pornin: 

and take care 

want to 

fell on 

and ahe 

of that. 

ancl 

ue have 

PRR ¢ } As | 

trial at 

she got sick between the first and 

£7? How 

talk to 

went Io 

” 
Bi llard r 

3, but 1f 

QL nex 

 



  

« 

{Whereupon, the juror entered the courtroom, 

after which the following proceedings ware had,) 

iE COURT: Hrs. Ballard, 1 am willing to adjourn 

ior the night and see 1f you feel better in the morning. 

if you feel like you cannot serve, 1 will take that into 

consideration and act right now, if that is what you are 

2 I would appreciate it, 

THE COURT: Bee, I only have two extra jurors. If 

vou nad told ne before we finished the selection or let 

the other jurors go, I could have acted then. If you 

feel like you cannot serve, 1 will excuse you. 

THE JURGR: 1 would certainly appreciate it, Judge, 

and thank you very much. 

HE COURT: All right, bring the other jurors back 

(Whereupon, the jury returned to the courtroom, 

after which the following proceedings were had.) 

Se
nt
 

PAE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, 1 have handled 

the matter for the other jurors We now have one alternate 

juror because I have lunpanelled the first alternate to 

serve in her place, 80 that leaves ug with one alternate 

j Uuror., 

2, (By Mr. Parker) I believe I had asked you about the 

 



  

direction of 

were laying on the 

larry 

Bi 

F5
24
 

= 

the 

£1i00Y, 

It was on the 

left aisl he 

3 left aisle. & 

Can you 

left, 

er 

shot from the aisle, the direction that you 

tell ug apout that? 

iow, what did you do after the shots were fired? 

3 4 I ww 1 308t 

Yor how long? 

I'm not for s 

And who was 

Larry Beard. 

Vas that his 

you go 

Yas, I did, 

up 

aid there, 

ure. The 

Larry? 

£3 
er Was 

beat? 

tO where 

was that Larry? 

Ho, sir. 

) WAS SE fa All right. W 

Aftey 1 

Well, after 

You got hyste 

got uj 

hat is 

you went up 

yy 
* 
- ricai 

we police 

manager came and told us 

that come by. Ww 

the officer was? 

thing you did after 

BNC saw who it was. 

that 

 



  

£5 

what did you do then after you got hysterical? 

Well + they calwed me down and we went down to the 

police station, 

4 All right, Did anyone ever show you any photographs? 

A i seen gone, Lut I didn't recognize anv. 

J Wag that the same day? 

A Salle day. 

since then? 

FZ 

9, 

some other p 

A 

BUYE « 

J 

you tell us 

Know, just k 

Atlanta 

Has anyone ever showed you any other photographs 

I've seen some, but I just didn't recognize them. ' o 5] 

All right. Do you recall when it was that YOU 

hotographs? 

it's been two ~~ two or three months, I'm not 

All right. In relation to May the 13th, 1978, 

when you might have seen any other photographs 

ind of an estimate as best you can do? 

ApDOut two weeks afterwards. i'm not for sure. 

Could it have been shorter or longer? 

it could have been. 

All Tight. Did you recognize anyone? 

Noy; 1 dldn't. 

Did you yo to any preliminary hearing at the 

Ce Department? 

Baw 

for 

can 

 



  

Have 1 been out and talked to vou? 

LELGG  ] 

wy 
rd 
- 

TE 1 IE a NT PRRETE SH Ci NE DA Pn gn 3a by Ky Bich 1 s8hiow You any photographs 

” ‘ n FEE | a. Fa ng A . ae furniture -- & picture of Lhe store. 

1 showed you a picture ©f the store? 

is that the only one I showed you that you recall? 

That 1 recall, that is the only thing I remember. 

Did I show you any pictures of any individuals? 

ALL Ylght. HOw, have you obgerved any photographs 

paper? 

Yes, sir. 

And what did you think about those photographs you 

nevspaper? 

It waan't too good. 

What do you mean, it wasn't too good? 

I could recognize Lim in person, but in the news-— 

it was vague, 

>
 

well, did anyone in the newspaper appear to look 

Fy 3 Ok 

hal J Ra 

 



  

eve oe 
on 
& ince the robbery, that you saw a picture that look 

ih familiar to you concerning that robbery? 

Y Cd 

Angi that was the one in the newspaper? 

Has anyone else shown you any photographs, th 

recall, other than what you saw in the newspaper? 

morning 

were t 

Fy id 
i 152 Yr oh 

Flash 

Fo 

BO, Sir. 

pA S| PA. EE | LY on w Po ¥ sph Es ons aoe 3 Bu op am rT TS A, CERN 
"nil x 14h ™ 2aW you Were gre this _Ox ning? 

Yor s Fp BAT. 

And did you see anyone in the courtroom this 
o % 
“- 

Ww
 

that you recognized: 

Three, 

All rights And where were they geherally ~- 

hey in the gourtroom? 

4 

“he one with the beige suit on, 1 recognized 

been in the store before. 

The one with the beige suit on? 

where was he sitting in the courtroom this morning? 

He was sitting on this side. 

inn the jury BOE? 

Yes FR ir ® 

Lid you see him the day of the ronbhery? 

Ho, sir, I bad seéen him before, come in there 

-229- 

ed 

at 

So oye 
bid pg 

+ 

before, 

 



  

you be 

1 Know he 

had be 

store? 

All right. Now, vou say he came in before. Can 

a little more specific? 

Fi 

4
a
 

en ir 

It's been a long time. I'm not for sure when, but 

hat been in there before. 

DO you know his name? 

No, sir. 

All right. low, you say vou recognized another 

And where was he sitting this morning? 

He was sitting on this side in the jury box, 

All right. And where did you see him before? 

fle had been in there before, 

Did you see him on the day of the robbery? 

Ho, sir. 

Do. you know his name? 

1 recognize him. I'm not for sure, but somebody 

his pname wag Beh, 

all right. Did you gee him the day of the robbery? 

I didn't see him the day of the robbery, but he 

Do you remember when he might have been in the 

 



  

£3
 

other 

recognized? 

o
N
 

| L
oe

 
[
L
e
g
 

P
e
t
 

Wr
 

& been a while, 

not for sure when. 

Oh Poa XR a Fa be ge ” 
OW py GLU YOU Bee 

at you recognized? 

Len wit a & 
IRB, S1F. 

And when had : YOu 

“he day I came down, today. 

Today? 

Ra ats imi 
53 Ln, bh AE SE 

anyone 

individual 

I remember taking an appli- 

else this 

before? 

When had you seen him prior to today? 

The day of the robbery. 

Ig that the only time you have 

Have you ever gone to any 

I went to one lineup, but he 

And which one 

seen 

lineup, that vou know of Xr > | 

wasn't in 

was that that you, 

him since? 
0g
 

IT. 

the 

one that you identified this morning that you say you 

You are talking about the third one I recognized? 

one that has the white 

which one wag he? 

in the robbery? 

 



  

A de was the ohne that cane in the fxont door with 

the gun in his hand, 

» 

you positive of that? 

A I guarantee that. 

£3 You guarantee that? 

je ow that you have seen him in person today, are vou 

A Yes, air, I'm positive, 

(* That 1s the man that came through the front door? 

i AF ¢ 4 
Fs ABE, Bl 

fo BH Ha DRYD J ~ dy 
£18» FPRANKAD 3 FES IES» witness @ 

CROBE-EXAN INATION 

E74 

2 Okay. You 

J
o
i
e
 

ust sald you were positive that you L
a
.
 

could identify my client, Now, you say that you have == you 

saw three people sitting over there, is that correct? 

a BL, Bir. 

f™ on § Tar ud By oa 3 3 ¥ “N 3 % vs 1 who 5 3 3 AN Tad Fy 90s of \# All x AGNTe wnat Gia you think when you saw those 

three people sitting over there in the box? 

3 I 5 31 SF 1 » 4 FETS fe gr ga gh tun oy ww 3 ge A JTUBL recOgnized three people. 

{ In terns OF what? 

A I recognized two ©f them from being in the store 
4 

and I recognized one of them from coming in the front door. 

 



  

& All right. HNow, on the day of the robbery, did 

you give a description to the police? 

A I == what 1 could remember of him, yes, I dia. 

» Okay. Now, when you were going through that 

experience, tell me, how long did you get a chance to see the 

person's face? 

A i was sitting right there looking right in his face 

and he had the gun at me, 

G flow long was that? 

A Oh, about five, ten minutes. 

O All right, For ten minutes you weére sitting at 

your desk, is that right? 

A Yes, 

# And he vas just holding the gun on you? 

A He was messing with the other two men. 

{ All right. What was he doing to then? 

FN He grabbed the gun off of Alvis and then he 

grabbed Darrell, and he sald -- Darrell kept telling him, 

"The money is in my front pocket and in my back pocket,” and 

he sald, "You are a smart ==" 

{J GO aliead. 

A He said, "You are a smart ass, aren't you," and he 

hit Darrell upside the head, 

Q I thought you said you had your eyes closed? 

A HO, you misunderstood me. 

=233~ 

 



  

8, Straighten me out. 

A All right, 1 had my eves closed after he told 

to lay on the floor, 

0 All right, How, how long was it between the 

that he came in and sald to you all to lay on the floor and he 

first entered the door? 

A i'm not {or sure. 

|& Wasn't it just a few seconds or minutes? 

Fa 1'm not for sure, 

0 Isn't it a fact that whoever came in, came inte the 

store running? 

A He came in running to the back. 

LW Okay. How, how long did that take? 

A I'm not fOr sure. 

&] Okay. You are not for sure how long you had a 

chance to observe anyone, are you? 

A I Know I got a good look &t him, 

'y Okay. Did you tell that to the police when they 

interviewed you? 

B es, I £133 

U Okay. What description did you give them? 

A I told them he bad & moustache, he was light- 

skinned, and he looked =-- and he had on some shades, they 

prescription, I'm not for sure whether they were prescription 

glasses or not, 

~234~ 

 



    

Ny IR FT THEO SC 
Bone gshadew? 

A I'm not for sure if they were prescr 

& were they dark? 

A Ho, they wasn't dark. 

§ why did you call them ghades? 

é, wall, I just said shades. 

pe
 

5
 

3 Wd a Eo 5 re LAT Ft Ton as A Ee AR VIER 
Flite SHMALAS HOW, Hae 18 argu 

gbject Lo that. 

COURT: Don't argue wit 
¥ 14% 3 

& L440 

Iam trying out 

TRS a AE OR " gn wo oH Lon gon di i 4 a ot PR | TA 3 Es ri Pe | difference ig between shades and clear gla 

¥ £9 ya gos f A Ze $x ot Sm F hi IR Wg, A 
wasn CULKYS ABK her in her mind what 

5 &£ v EY ag Ggirierence, 

§ FEO TI Ti ERNE sou dw x Sn " - A IE 
fide a AIASaRISIR 3 ANE 18 what LL was asx 

THE CUURTS | suppose you ask your « 

want to. 

Turner) What is the differe £
 (iy Mr. 

you say they were shades, 18 that correct? 

a i Okay. You can that they 

and different colors. 

{ Ckay. Shey weren't clear, though? 

: Beg your pardon 

were not clear glasses, 

Well ag little pink looking. 

RELE 

wnat ti 

$34) 

nee petween 

can be pink 

 



  

Okay. How, you say that Mr. Parker came out and 

ghowed you some pictures, is that correct? 

A Yes, 

(J Do vou remember seeing Mr. HeClesky's picture in 

the bunch that he brought you out to look at? 

Fa! HO 

MR. TURNER: Do you have those pictures here? 

Miike PARKER: That is not what she testified, Ehe 

testified 1 showed her a picture of the store, not 

individuals. 

{) (By Mr. Turner) Did he ever show you any pictures 

of individuals? 

A No, he just only showed me the picture of the furni- 

ture store. 

os
 8 Okay. We'll get back to that later, 

low, the picture you saw in the paper, Can. you 

describe that? 

That was a while back, 

() well, when vou saw it, what did you think? 

A I didn't think anything. 

® Well, when you saw Mr. McClesky today, did you think 

back to that picture that you saw in the paper? 

A No, I thought back to the day of the robbery, 

Q Hever thought back to the picture you saw in the 

-246= 

 



  

the pi 

you 

look at the 

Gee IC. I did 

rs TT “Br TRE PRR I ai Or oo 
wien You say you didn’ co 

fr $15 E wife 8 on | a Lhe articie? 

$ TL A 5 2 FEN. Sl. wen PROP 1 So y because a friend of mine 

you look at the ". Why did picture at all? i 

They was reading it and so I just looked. 

well, when you looked at that plcture, weren't you 

one of the people who 

Didn't cross your mind then Le 

Mo, I wasn't thinking about that. 

ey 

Any particular reason? 

1 wasn't concerned about what was in the paver. 

How long would you estimate you looked at QKay 

gianced and Kept going where T was going. 

YT a yw Tod go 1 £9531 § AR NF PE Y fw ge wy 3 N pa % ¥ = 3 Laay « Well, FOU SaY ==. 0Ka¥. let's back Pe WERE 

Bon f™ Yoon ga teen ¥ pu a Re 5% Se & pan on BT MCliesky's picture vou he paper? 

I didn't look at the pi that close, 

pe
 

En
 

41
 

a TL he " b> 3 As Is Rag ar a 3 Fo pm At pr won ars Boy SW - Wa LL I thought I understood YE3l me We 4X that 7 4 P 7 

237 

 



  

all 

PE. § oo 
“ii dB 

OF a 

what 

that, 
Re I Wee right, S8Irika 

How, when you went to the lineup, did you 

But 

rec 

you 

Was 

sure? 

A Ho, 1.didn't. 

6 PO you Know if he 

A I'm not for sure, 

0 You are not for 

A HO « 

fd Who 

A You mean the fi 

. How many lineups aid 

gid 

See 

P
e
t
 

. 

oy
 

RS
 the lineup? 

byought you to that lineup? 

so EX %¥ Fy 

o 

you see? 

A I Just only saw one lineup, 

§ and 

A ine pext day, I 

8 Chay. You mean 

happened on the == 

A HO, it couldn't 

sunday. 

9 All right. Jou 

A monday, then, 

Gay. 

& Okay. CO ax 

an aa 1 ku TE SO ey voeks alte Cw 

within 
Ti . a 

F a Se Wot 5 <a 

# PE LTR 
% Fry | Ait & 

e you fo 

what day was that, 

Chink 

on th 

have 

Monday 

yo 

WOCHK 

~238 

if you can recall? 

& 

2 wm on the 14th? 

been on the l4th, the 14th 

the next day, right? 

ww 

or Tuesday, 1'm not for sure 

Was within sure =-- well, 

r the original occurrence? 

A 

  

was



  

A 

¢ 
kd 

It was within a week. 

Have you been 

BO, 4 ir. 

What did you and Hr. 

out to see you? 

A 

furniture 

pictures? 

A 

(J 

punch? 

interviewed 

Parker talk 

aout the 

£3 

All he was talking about was the 

store, 

UKay 

Alter =-- yes, 

Do you recall if 

Are 

which? 

Did any other detectives show 

case otherwise? 

avout when he came 

pletures of the 

some plctures. 

Mr. HcClesky's picture wag in that 

you saying no, it wasn't, or no, you don't 

A 1 don't recall. 

£2 Okay. Bow, when you stepped in and you saw those 

three individuals sitting in that jury box, did you know then 

that they were the defendants in this case? 

A No, 1 just knew -- it was more than -- it was five 

up there, 

{ Five up there? 

A IC8 

Q Okay. What did you think they were there for? 

A They was up there for something, for trial, 

-d39m 

 



  

0 Did you see deputies sitting around them? 

A Yes, sir, 

2 50 you knew they were here for some reason, right? 

A Yes, sir. 

0 Now, you say you had seen one person identified as 

Ben Wright, you took an application on him, is that right? 

Fa I sald I remember taking an application on him, it 

had been a while, 

{d All right. 

A I recognized three, 

0 All right. How many people were involved in the 

robbery? 

A What you mean? 

Q How many people, if you know, were involved in the 

robbery?
 

A In the robbery? 

%) Yes. 

A That took place at Dixie? 

J fen. 

A Well, it's ~- well, some came in the back door. 

®, Were you in the back? 

A HO. 

9, HOW dO you Know that? 

A HOw Go YI know that? 

Lo es, 

*% 2 Fy 

 



  

Ef A ney told me, 

£d Isn't it a fact you have been told about every 

aspect of this case, haven't you, you have discussed it with 

your friends and other people who work at the store as well as 

Mr. Parker? 

A What you mean? 

¥, Haven't you discussed this case on more than one 

A We talk about it. 

A he employees, 

& £ bo you all still talk about it? 

A No, because I don't work down there any more, 

# All right. How many times have vou talked to the 

police about this? 

A since it happened, about twice, 

oy '®, Jugt twice? 

0 Ckay, Prior to today vou have never ddentified 

| BE ove wie ow Ton a Ts an SF ge wr v : 3 sin » Li gta B00 gem § on $o w : + 
Hrs MeClesky as being present belore, 18 that right? 

A in the robbery, is that what you mean? 

8 Yes, in the robbery. 

A fie was in the robbery. 

ne 

& I aw saving, prior to today, though, you have never 

identified him as being involved in that robbery, have vou? 

3 
£ 

 



  

A 

1 seen 

A 

have not 

L
o
 

ev
 

& Eh
 a
 

48
 

robberysy i 

hysterical, or was that your 

- 

He 

in that 

9 
1% 

A 

i 

tell UE, 

hime 

He was in the robbery, 

Five og £ Foe ge ART CAEN SLs FY yi re Liye EBL Gay YOU Bell Olbiy 

L285 

a, Agalh, your response to 

dentified him prior to today? 

I identified hin when 

Point hin out if == 

MRe PARKER: I object, he is 

can answer, and I object to that. 

EY i pA Td F4% gy por wn “ ™ Ak Aw Pe én pony age 

{By Mr « Turner) Please answer. 

YVR EN SF BYE EFT ie) Vi wh SAR aie py TE a | 
dak QOH bo BAH angerstand you 

Mr. Turner) Please 

THE COURT: All right, 

Li EOD 

know it was him, 

(By Hr + Turner) Okay. 

That was after 

%) 10 £381 o 

Okay. Were you nervous when 

in your face? 

I wasn't that nervous. 

gail that nervouss 

answer, 

I recognize him a 

the 

but this is the first day 

that you 

cutting her off before 

the ww 

CO ahead. 

& being in the 

I just know it was him, 

that were VOU - 

I saw the police laying in the floor 

gun was first 

how did you feel, 

 



  

A I wag ~~ 1 was Just caln. 

8) You were calm? 

(3 URaYe 50 vou weren't afraid? 
wh 

A I was cain and I was afraid. 

A i am nervous, but I am not afraid. 

¥ Okay Were you nervous like this on the day of pa
 

A I wouldn't say I was nervous, I was calm, 

o UKaY. NOW, can you hear out of both ears? 

EE Sir. oY
 - 5
 t - 

dal COURT: I didn't hear the guestion, 

Mie TURNER: 1 asked her if she could hear out of 

both ears. 

%, {By Hr. Turner) fou say vou heard sounds out of 

your left waar, is that correct? 

A eg, Sir. 

* what was happening with vour right ear? Wi «vill Wales 310 pple 44% WwW Lil 2 E¥ A EER hom g 

the ey
 

pe
e A Well, I heard the sounds, but it was louder 

ear because 1 was laying to that side, 

¥ Okays How cen you tell it was louder in that ear; 

makes you think it was? 

A because it was on the leit side of ny ear and it 

louder. 

s XK 

iad © 

 



  

store, if you know, in terms of while the robbery was goinc 

On? 

2% Okay. ilow many people were in the front of that 

wnat you mean, in front of the store? 

gegiden the employees? HOW many 

- 

nd 
the Lront of the store, if vou know? 

in the back 

door? 

robbers were in 

Just only one came in the front door, the rest came 

GOOT « 

Ukaye Do you know if any others came in the. front 

Ho, 1 just saw one come in the front door and I just 

and hit the alarm. 

* what I am saving to vou is this. 

WEE NC : - ism [TRAE SP SU WL the Lloor at one point, right? 

FODRers cone 

he had cane in there i: * 

while you were on the floor, did 

into the front of the bui a Jo
st

 
>
 

f
r
i
e
 

or
 

.
 

Ve
. 

-
 

HO not as I Know of, 

all right. Now, you were laying 

your eyes closed, is that right? 

You state that vou heard someone 

You all were on 

on the floor with 

A NO VaR i a gs | At a JF 2 Te EL ad So ge Bos ge ew " agro 40 be € 6g ow _ $e Ba come Lhe cops +t or "The COPE are here, something to that 

affect? 

A Yes. I don't know which guy said 

moog A 
had’ BL. Gay 

 



  

them did say it. 

® Okay. Where was that person when you heard that 

sound? 

Ya
y A ie was behind me. 

8 Okay. And behind you would have put him in what 

the route=— or
d A All right. One side is a door there ir 

men's side, he was standing in the doorway. 

0 Okay. If that person was standing in the doorway, ’ &£ + & 

gould h — e have shot the policeman? 

MR. PARKER: I object. 

THE WITHESS: I couldn't answer that, 

Q By Mr. Turney) Well, let's put it like this. 

Would there have been any obstructions in terms of someone 

standing in that doorway and firing at someone walking in the 

front of the door? 

¥ shoot somebody coming ob
 

oy
 

—
—
 

A Standing in that doorway at 

in the front door? 

£2 Or someone coming up the aisle? 

A Hot standing right there, 

{2 why do you say that? 

Because there was furniture there and the counter 

was there and be was standing just a little ways. 

# Okay. Whoever it was saw the officer, didn't ne? 

2 y. ; Boe, wen in . PRU 4 Ri ite MED Ee 4% dn QE gw SS md 

You can see, it has all of them blg ylagsses there, 

 



  

you can gee {rom the back to the outside. 

8 bo you know where the officer was when the person 

said, "Here cone the cops," or, “Bere comes the policeman™? 

A Fe must have been driving up. 

0 DO you Know that for a fact? 

A He had to have been driving ap. 

A His car, they saw hls car. 

0 How do you Know they saw his car? % 
¥ 
A 

A Because it was parked -- he had to drive up in 

officer wasn't walking into the building when the comment was 

A No, it couldn't have happened that wav. 

A secause, where he was shot from, they was waiting 

on him when he coma in the door. 

{3 vhere he was shot from? Where was he shot from? 

A fle was halfway in the aisle coming to the back, 

or Of course, now, vou didn't see any of this, other 

than where the body fell, you didn't see which way he came in 

or how he came in, did you? 

PN 1 know he had to come through the front and come 
wt 

: " fl an PE bi ai te RX T Yee J 
Own the aisle because I Enow ne 

&.3 H a A ah - Yop dy tS 
un't go to the other side. 

 



  

(J r 

don't know 

store, do 

aisle. 

Via ® $0 ong pa 

Hea ne & Da
l Se
g 

so
f B® ©
 

FN 

0 

before he 

* 

regard, do 

How do you know that? 

Because his body was laying in the middle of the 

Okay. What you saw is where the body fell, but vou 

what steps, if any, he took when he came into the 

yours 

He cane == well == well == 

DQ you? 

TO get from the door you have to come down the middle 

Okay. Now, in terms of coming down that middle aisle, 

it inconsistent that -- how many shots did you hear? 

WHO. 

Do you know whether or not the officer staggered back 

S80 once again, you don't know what happened in that 

you? 

I know how he come in the door. 

Did you gee him come in the door? 

IG. 

Then how do you Know? 

I just Know that when you come in the door you have 

to come dowh the middle aisle, and he wouldn't go to the left or 

ne woulidn!? t go to the right, he would come down the middle aisle, 

voll] - 

 



  

Normally a pe would 

middle ai that right? 

#4 LE. 

Fa £s % : JORies | LE yo TG u RAL a 5% ¢ But you don't Know what a policem 

gating a robbery would do, do vou? 

A I don't think he would have wen 

{2 You hit the burglar alarm, didn't 

5 ies. 

¥ SO once again, what you said is 

A I am telling you what 1 know. 

(: Based on your conclusions, right? 

A Un the truth, 

TE TT 
". wh Re RE 

Dey FR PW BNE gy 4 a9 
RERIRECT EXA 

0 This morning when came in the 

+ Bs 2a wn 
FELCH say were five people 

& Y€2, Bir. 

{ -m LO Lhe Jury LOX? 

oy RF & Pr 

&% xd, sir. 

3 oN * 4 NF A ath AE FREE Fa F, 3 8 57% ¥ 3 a Bay pn TES W ANG yOu recognized what you thoug 

bg) 75 ~ 

te xXaeg ¢ 8 i Loe 

P Bova ota wa Pa me gt PO TO I Te Po Ea § ws  § bh ARG were there other people in th 

  

COIBG Py PE Lr OWH 

. 

eI 1.0 an wi investi- 

your 

gpeculation, 

COUrtroni, you 

ht were three 

courtroom?



  

4 Yeo op Ble 

& On both sides of the courtroom? 

A ig nn Bb be aor be Yo Sean tS EL ana Be 0 nix 2a hs $e an Fi 185, Blr, and then the Lalllfif moved them to the 

other ‘side. 

Q Was this courtroom full of people? 

A The seats wasn't quite filled, though. 

# But there was more people than there are right now, 

wasn't there? 

{J And two or three times as many people as there are 

right now? 

H Yeah, 

HR. TURNERS: Once again, he is leading the withess. 

I don't mind, other than just to make the formal objection. 

THE COURT: Don't lead the witness. 

(By Mr. Parker} You say you went to a lineup. Was a
 

there anybody that you actually observed in a lineup? 

Observed one. poh
 

# I don't follow you, Tell me what you saw on the 

A I saw some guys and they looked familiar. 

Py Se rd ph 

td Pardon? 

4 AE I a ra LL ERR Py BN TED em arn Ed Fagin vr Foy pines gin a3 
A I just saw some guys in the lineup-and they Looked 

os Nie’ 2a TP TO mT TR wane a 
¥, AaY looked familiar to what? 

 



  

A I had seen them before. 

& Now, are you talking about the 

cver here this morning == 

A Which lineup? 

J -= OF are you talking about at 

I am talking about at the poli 

1 Were any of those people invol 

May the 13th, 192787? 

A The lineup I saw, no. 

{J Have you ever == do you know t 

here on trial? 

A NO, Sire 

{J Have you ever, seen him in the 

know of, other than May the 13th? 

54 Alp Sir. 

& And how positive were vou when 

the white shirt this morning as being the 

front door? 

A iI was positive. 1 &m sure. 1 

stake ny life on it. 

FR. PARKER: “Thank you. 

MR. TURKER: I have a few more 

RECROS5~-EXAMIBATIOR 

BY MR. TURNER: 

8, Vere you on duty all that day? 

be” 44 

the people 

the police station? 

ce station, 

ved in the robbery on 

his name over 

store before that you 

you saw the man in 

PS LY that came through Hear 

am positive. I would 

questions. 

 



  

A 

= OF Ba £0 Bt en 
BRE HI 

earlier thet day? 

& ST XN 34 i oe 

¥ If he had come i 

& es, 8ir. 

od 
» Tha 

PTY ISR IRR Es 
Ls avi ky 

Fy 

REC RED 

£33
 

w 

Fi es, Bir. 

file TURHERZ 1 & 

again. 

£4 [ I wi 

£3 (By Parker) 

nthe store? Fo
n ft
 

i ihe majority of 

applications on them, 1 also 

0 How about Mamie 

A She takes applic 

something else. 

5 Doeg she wait on 

FI you r 8B i Le 

® Loess she sometim 

  

walted on him, 

HeClesky come into the store 

ly, Would you have see 

TP . ” 

ne YOU. 

He WY AEE TIIAINY OAR 
w BAAN LHATL 1 6) 

you m n ight have see 

te object to that as leading 

ll overrule that objection. 

PO You walt on everyone that cones 

the people, I wait on them, take 

approve 

what Tho Nas ? 

go wh a Sh wy gk * 2 oe wR $ wy ations, tou, if I am busy doing 

people? 

it on people when you are busy? 7% 
oF CA 

~251-



  

that 

GUY o 

walted 

she 

while 

FL 

m, is 

& % 

on n 

Fd ph 

*» 

po 

nade 

Could she have walted on 

PAL [61 

she Gia vait 

MR. PARKER: Thank you. 

eS Bk ow TT rdl WT, TL Eh el 3 Jee BOE ER ee wi HB Wd ad 
anls PRR Pow Be ut Ela il Fo 

That 18 a busy store, 1 

All right, Prior to the 

you pay attention to 

x Ro ata iy » rl He looked just =- 

: ea 
Malan? 

didn't look LOO == 

Didn't look too what? 

He didn't look right, so 

What does not 100k right 

Peoples look suspicious. 

because 

right? 

you have got it 

Did you se 

walted on a lot 

Pole Pl 

dd 

C18 
E o
a
 pa
 

# fa
te

 
©
 
a
 o-
 

Bo
t 2 -
 

wrong, i was 

someone on May the l3th, 

COME. in there. 

1 po! 3 5 TEAR 
RW 

did you see her wait on that day? 

fdn't count the peoples 

robbery vou mentioned a 

that particular guy? 
-r 

ashe walted 

to you? 

didn't wait you 

QUBY ana she 

os 3° Sa Fou are i pn HD 8 Re 
I anYoooy else? 

 



  

% UKaye Did she discuss waiting on Mr. HeClesky, you 

all sald you have discussed this case. Did she ever tell vou 

that he came into the store on that day? 

A I don't recall, 

£ Okay. Where is your desk in connection with hers? 

A Her desk is sitting on the side of mine. 

9, so If she was walting on == go ahead. 

A Well, mine is & little further up than hers. 

t
a
d
 

by 

he was waiting on somebody at her desk, would 

you have seen them? 

A They don't come behind the counter. 

Lo Where would she normally walt on someone? 

A Gut in front. We have a desk out in front where 

we take applications. If they want to walk around, we walk 

around with them, 

HRs TURNER: Okay. Ko further questions. 

MR. PARKER: May this witness be excused? 

2HE COURT: You may be excused, 

All right, ladies and gentlemen, we are going to 

recess {or the evenings tow, there is only one time and 

one place that it is proper for a jury to deliberate, and 

the place is in the jury room and the time is after all 

the evidence has been Introduced and the lawvers have 

had & chance to make thelr closing srgunents and the 

Court has charged vou as to the law, 

 



  

How, until that time comes, and I will make it 

clear to you when vou are to begin vour deliberations, 

don't discuss the case with anyone, don't let anvone 

discuss it with vou, and don't discuss it among your- 

selves, either tonight or in the courtroom or in the 

Vy roon tomorrow. Forget about it and think about Jur 

other matters, and we'll resume the trial Of this case 

at 8:30 o'clock in the morning, 

(Whereupon, the jury retired from the courtroom, 

ail the proceedings were adjourned, to be reconvened at 

2:30 o'clock, AJM., on the following dav.) 

THE COURT: All right, bring the jury in. 

(Whereupon, the jury returned to the courtroom, alter 

proceedings were had.) which the following i (S 

THE COURT: Cood morning, ladies and gentlemen. 

Ail right, Hr. Parker, call your next witness. 

MRe PARKER: Call Dr. Anderson, please, 

SvE 
Biy WILLIAN Be AVDERSOK, 

being first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows: 

BY HMR. PARKER: 

\ would you give us your name, siy? 

A William RR. ARderson. 

J Ang what 18 your prolession, sir? 

A I am a physician, pathologist, and specially trained 

“254 

 



  

in laboratory medicine and forensic or medical~legal pathology. 

¥ And where are vou working at the present time? 

B 1 am presently enployéd at the Brunswick Hemorial 

Hospital in Brunswick, Ceorgia. 

{ And when did you come up to Atlanta, sir? 

A I'm sorry? 

+ 

LF when did you arrive in Atlanta? 

A This morning. 

{3 And 1s the State paying your way here, sir? 

i% Yee, 

he
 G And where were you prior to moving to Brunswick 

A Prior to moving, 1 was the Hedical Examiner for 

Cobb and DeKalb Counties, In that capacity I exchanged week- 

end call with the Fulton County Medical Examiner's personnel, 

physicians there. 

Q All right, sir. Could vou give us a brief rundown 

on your educational background? 

A i went to medical school at the Univergity of Miami 

in Florida. 1 did ny residency in pathology or laboratory 

medicine at the University of Rochester, Duke University, and 

> 

the University of North Carolina. I trained in the sub=- 

specialty of forensic or medical-legal pathology with the 

State Medical Examiner in North Carolina, and prior to coring 

to Atlanta I was with the Office of the Medical Examiner in 

los Angeles County, Californias. 

i 

 



  

o All right, sir, 

were 

Fulton County on that weekend 

# ¥& “oe 

os CRT, SCR Sh a fi - on 4° 1b 4  £S 
a ANU wWhare vere you gtationed 

pe well, 1 at the Sur hu ach 
WO 

morgue at Pulton County, the Medical 
4 

wu 

gir. Did k 

FRR. YAN a : 4 5 me ny PO % 
body identified to you as Robert 

» ¥ - 

FL YE: 85 o 

RT | ri Eh BIE ge RBA gE fx 8 pg 9 And approximately wnat tine 

approxinately 

2 sm | PR PE am nae ele Rpt 
conducted that autopsy, Bir? 

A The autopsy was carried out 

The body was first viewed externally for any 

or injury, any 

internal examination 

chest and axanination of 

Officer Bchlatte? 

A Yes, 1 did, 

§ would you describe those 

A I will refer to the report 

He had a single entrance d¢ 

Bow, calling your EH] w i" 

you - on weekend 

-- in the 

Examiner's 

vou perform an autopsy 

y- processes ocourring. 

You 

wounds, 

on that weekend? 

* 

ROTHnINYG 

5 shilatt, HSE? 

we 

was that? 

10:30 in the morning. 

tell us how you 

in a procedure 

signs of violence 

ar 

5 

was then performed, including an 

abdominal cavities, 

find wounds on any 

" & in 

sir? 

ot or 
HELE at the Line. 

og et £ oe TET 
wound of the 

 



  

NRE a a WP Ph es Re iy a ; PR a ar Ql Bou darirs 27 gn wn Bu AE oh 
NE DEEN severely JdaRaded, Giee Wah OeliOL riiayYe 

  

FREER Cele T oly TL Nah pi Ry 
in ang around the eYe al'2d. 

¢ o Boi mw A ara ww Wy i A Be You 15 Fouope an A 34 4 
Lis gubstance QL The oYash, it 

  

, 4p hi: Aes ne 5} ne a 1 Fa de s Wate won Bh EF WEN AY % an bi “gp Fu de ox ThE vg Rh I It entered the right eve, passing left Lo right, and Struck 

after creating a great deal ~
N
 

L
J
 

b
d
 

fo
u 

oy
 

p
o
 ot
 

w
o
 7%
 

cr
 

£5
 

S
F
 

a
 

- [0
 

wi
 

% 
1 

rs
 

A a
 

u
l
 

ha
i 

| 
-
 

Jo
e 

“ Pe
 

ot
a 

~ ET
 

a
 

*~ s 4 39
 

Fa
 

betwaen here 

  

ind nere, struc this portion OL » 

  

Tou anh ana nome his Bon wo en ’ By Wand ETT BY % + hemorrhage and mulliple pau 

3 

could not be detarmnineds. 

3 3% SP a “i ue wo TR enn I RINE SE TC Tan nT 
Ls Bai Xai 1810 Bl» I Yau Say POA cove rea EO 

A Yeg, I vecovered several frat 

i) I show you what has been marXed as State's Exhibd 

Bi Yes, these are the fragments 1 removed Yom toe 

p x . 4 i“ 2 a Rn po on fs ike i I 8 J bl on “ = 

brain substance and the inner portion of the siudl ©L the 

victim. hese were labeled with the autopsy nunoer, the nan 

  

t i . : is mt errand vr omrasal Fooane isco in ope Piove 
and the date, and then signed by myself and placed in the Day 

i pid you seal that bag, Bix? 

aint that 3It struck Sack he 

1d 

® 

 



    

8, Were vou here this morning when that bag was 

opened? 

L¥ And doeg that appear to be the same fragments that 

you removed from Officer Schlatt? 

\ Yes, 1t does, There were two lead fragments and a 

portion of copper material representing jaecketing or the material 

around the slug to prevent it from disintegrating sarly. 

of Officer Bc¢hlatt? Was he in good health generally? 

A Yes, he was, Other than the gunshot wound there 

were no other -- and, of courge, the brain damage, the injuries 

associated with the gunshot wound were the only real pathologic 

findings on the bod 

td Now, do you have an opinion as to his general age 

and height and weight, sir? 

A Yes, he was a white male, approximately thirty years 

of age. 1 messured him to be around sixty-eight inches. This is 

somewhat variable in a postmortem measurement, 

*) All right, sir. And approximately how much did he 

welaht? 

A Approximately 125 pounds, 

4; gir, would it have been possible if Officer Schlatt 

had lived, would he have ever had use of his mind, in your 

opinion? 

3 
aI 

 



  

A Ho, I believe with those injuries, it would have 

been doubtful if he could have survived, and had he, there 

would have been severe brain damage. 

# How, Dr. anderson, you said the tract was slightly 

right to left. Could you elaborate on that a little bit, sir? 

A It was slightly left to right. 

4 Lefr to right? 

A In other words, placing the body in a normal anatomic 

position, which is hands out, facing at a point forward, the 

bullet when it entered was passing slightly to the right, 890, 

in other words, it entered here and it ended up back in here, 

go it's a slight angle coming into the victim's right, indica- 

ting that there was some positioning of aither the assailant or 

the vfficer to put the point of firing slightly to the officer's 

left, therefore, making a straight tract back in this way which 

would put it from his left to his right, 

¥ Now, Dr. Anderson, have you observed those State's 

Exhibits 6 and 7 in front of you before, sir? 

ou
 ves. I first saw the pictures this morning. 1 

cannot recall if I examined the shirt at the time, The shirt 

did not come with the body and I don't remember if it was 

brought over at the time or not. Frequently if the clothing 

is available, I will take a brief look at it before sending it 

on to the crime lab, but the pictures 1 saw first this morning. 

Gi all right, sir, Wow, you have periormed autopsies 

 



  

on a number of. gunshot wounds, have you not, sir? 

Hh Tes ™ 

Examined a number of gunshot wounds? 

A Yes. 

sasume for a sonent Dy Pry a gl YT SR ERT ETN (Ifficar Aut SESUINE LOY a LOnentc, . ANGerson, LOaL LELIACeY 

schlett was walking down a center aisle of the Dixie Furniture 

Store, and that someone to his: left said something to him, and 

he turned in that direction to his left, would that be consistent 

with the gunshot wound and the tract to his eye? 

FA Yes. Well, whether he turned or whether he didn't 

turn, I don't know, but it would be consistent in that it -- that 

would place, unless he had turned -- okay, It would place the 

gun on the left had he not -- or the assailant in a position 

slightly to the left of him had he not completely turned around. 

Had he been shot from the right, obviously the bullet would have 

had to go the other way, so we know in sone way tnere was a 

position where that gun was to the left of his midline that was 

fo ~ 59 
fired. 

0 Yo the officer's midline? 

A Yeu, to the officer's left. 

{J Now, Dr. Anderson, You are examining two photo- ¢ 2 | + 

aravhs of the officer's shirt, 1s that correct? ¥ 

£4 NEE, 

L® Assuming for a moment that those two photograpns, 

”y 

State's Exhibits -- what is it, 6 and 77 

-260~- 

 



  

A Six and seven. 

i Do they show a tear on that shirt, six? 

A Yes, they do. 

¥ In what general area? 

A In the area of the left pocket, shirt pocket. 

CG All right, sir. Now, looking at State's Exhibit 

Number 8, assuming for a moment that the officer was walking 

down the center aisle of the store and that two shots were 

fired, one entering his eye and the other hitting his chest and 

bouncing off and going into the sofa there in State's Exhibit 

Number 8, would that be consistent with someone firing from the 

officer's left? 

A All rights Well, there are several -- there are 

geveral Btoblons. Pirst, a +38 -- assuming that it's .38, or 

at least assuming it is a high, relatively high velocity projec- 

Sa
w 

tile, «32, J38, .45, it will penetrate the skin, it will not 

bounce off, Bo if it hits something in there, it will penetrate 

almost any reasonable amount of metal, 80 I would assume that 

it was at an angle if it glanced off, and, indeed, there are 

two holes guite close together here, probably indicating that 

it was a ricochet and did hit something in the pocket. 

How, Af this was fired from the -- the officer was 

standing with his right to the chair, 18 that your nypothetical 

question? 

4 No, sir, das he is walking down the aisle towards the 

 



  

chair. 

A And he has his right side next to the chair? 

Q Yes, sir, the chair is on the officer's right and 

the shots are fired from the left, would that be consistent? 

A Yes, because it hits the left pocket and bounces 

to his right, and that would be consistent then with the general 

configuration of the shot that we know where it went, coming in 

here and going back that way, I would say it would be most con- 

sistent that both shots were fired {rom the left, 

} From the officer's left? 

A Yess, 

Re PARKER: Your witness. 

CROSE=-EXAMINATIOR 

{ Would it make a difference, Doctor, ag to which 

pr 
i bullet struck the officer first in terms of the positioning 

that you just told us about? 

Fil Ho. It doesn't make any difference whether he was 

spinning around. %he fact is, at the instant the gun was fired, 

he had to be in & position that put the gun over here, that is 

all I can say. Now, he might have been spinning around in a 

circle for all I know, but at the exact second that that bullet 

went in there, he had to have had that gun on his left side 

because it was going left to right. 

{3 £0 vou are saying based on the two bullet holes, then 

NE" 
hie” $7 J hd 

 



  

it had to be from the left side, 18 that correct? 

A well, as I sald, this would be consistent with it 

coming from the left, certainly. 

A I guess from the one on the shirt. 

8 Well, everything you said 1s just a guess, right? 

You used the word consistent, but what you mean is, I think? 

4 On the shirt, I think. On the wounds from the =-- 

that went through his eye, bullets travel in straight lines and 

it didn't hit much until it got in back here and hit that bone. 

1% What 1 am getting at is this, 

THE COURT Let him finish his answer. 

THE WITNESS: At this point we know it was in a 

gtraight line, we know it didn't deflect immediately, 

and we Know the tract at this point was going slightly 

to the right, so, ves, I know the projectile had to have 

been couing slightly left of hig midline, 

Q (By Mr. Turner) All right. But at the same tine, 

vou don't know what position the officer was in when he walked 

in or what he was doing when that projectile struck him, do 

you? 

ho 

but what we can say is, at the point which that projectile entered * 

x 

the eve, in other words, whatever he 18 doing, everything stop 

at that second, at that secon that gun had to be left of his 

* When vou say consistent, you mean you guess, right? 

3 
“ 

£4 
L 

A No. That is what 1 say, he could have been spinning, 

& 

 



  

midline 

g
l
 A 

Foy 

& 

ee being 

EN
 
-
 

because the bullet was going the othe 

the 

first 

PARKET 

Is it consi 

c¢hest area first and 

Sure, guite. 

stent that the officer 

then the 

rT ad 

Lo 

eve 1 

Way « 

& Fy ter 

3 ay might have beer 

With the perpetrator changing positions for each 

Certainly. 

MR, TURBER: Thank you. 

Mike PARKER: May this witness £3 ne ax 

shoul THE COURT: Any reason why he 

HRs TURKER: He may be excused, 

COURT: BOctor, you may 

BE eo Call your next witne 

The bLtate calls 

CAN OLIVER, 

duly sworn, vas examined and 

DIRECT EXAMIRBRATION 

Po
e 

o
o
 

0
 

Would you give us your name, 

Dan Oliver. 

And wheére do you work now, 

Dixie Furniture Company. 

And. how long have you worked 

months. Apout ten 

All right, sir. 

be 

i | 

fais of ® 

Were you working 

Dan O01 

testif 

please, 

there, 

there 

cused? 

gd. not? 

excused. 

iver » 

ied as 

sir? 

Cliver? 

follows: 

 



  

a
 

at Dixie? 

microphone, 

F-
 

there at approximately 

13th, 

{J 

Bp
. 

w
v
 

just finished loading a 

ami there was a man picking up 

19782 

Yes. 

Do you remember what day of the week that was, sir? 

Saturday. 

And could you tell us what your duties are there 

I supervise shipping and receiving. 

And wnat does that consist of? 

Well, sending out deliveries, receiving freight. +a 
po 

THE COURT: Can you move up a little closer to the 

Bir. 

Parker) All right, sir. How, were you 

two o'clock in the afternoon on May the 

y £2 & % 

Could you tell us where were? you 

1 wag on the dock in the back of the store. We had 

LUCK . 

4 ota £2 And was there a truck in there, sir? 

* 

Yes, we had just finished loading it. 

Could vou tell us who nay have been with you? 

Ben Tyson and James Grier were back there with me, 

cardboard back there. 

And where was he at, 

He was down by the dumpster, 

ad 12 

 



  

¥, All right, sir. Did anything unusual happen to 

you then? 

A Yes, that's when the robbery started. 

¥ What is the first thing you observed concerning 

that robbery, sir? 

& I noticed a man coming between the truck and the 

or 

wall out of the corner of my eve, but I didn't pay any atten- 

tion to it until he was behind me. 

Q All right, sir. And when ig the first time you 

realized that something was wrong? 

A Someone behind me says, "Don't put your hands up,” 

or something like that, 

(5 &11 right, sir. Can you describe that individual? 

A 1 turned around and looked and he had a black jacket 

one hand and what looked like a shotgun in the other hand. : a
a
 

-
 

pd
 

O Could you tell anvthing about the shotgun, sir? 

A It was wrapped with white tape like adhesive tape, 

that is about ali I can remember. 

§ Can you kind of estimate what the size of it might 

have been? 

A It was short, that's all. 

G Could you estimate it with your hands, what length 

you are talking about? 

A About that long [indicating]. 

0 Are you indicating about two feet? 

 



  

A Uh=nuh [positive]. 

& All right, sir. Did you se¢ anyone else at that 

tine? 

A Yes, then I saw -- there was another man with a 

pistol on the dock and then 1 saw another man come around the 

front of the truck and get the cardboard man out there. 

ir? t=
 8, And what were these other two people wearing, 

A All I know is that they had a stocking over their 

face. 

{J Did all three of them have stocking masks? 

Le pt
e 

& Yes ¢ & 

%) Mow, what was done at that point? 

A They == the two on the dock held guns on us and the 

eT
 one down there got the gavdboard man and brought him up on the 

dock. 

9 All right, What happened next, sir? 

A Then they brought us inside the building, the one 

wg 

with the shotgun took Ben Tyson to the back looking around for 

somebody else, I guess, and then came back and they took us all 

into the back room. 

8) which back room is that, sir? 

A Right directly behind the office, 

¥ Can you describe that room to us? 

A It's just a small storage room about, 1 would guess, 

about fifteen feet long and about five -- five or six feet wide, 

-267= 

 



  

| And what did they make -- what did they do with 

you in there, six? 

&, The » made us all lie down on our stomach, face- 

GOWN. 

7 Fix ou 2 4% Jo map - za ¥ gir $ a UPR Woy. SIs TIL SR Se CR 
A Yes, and they begah to tie our hands behind Our 

£2 And how many people were in this room, Sir? 

3 pad TEN rl : “i ) Bi 2 hrs #3 b wl 3 Ye Cl ae ¥ o ET ¥ (eo : 9 ba J 3 

A There was me and ben Tyson and Janes Grier, xonnie 

x PN I WT | % mom anal Ne ALE wR 5% 
Dukes and the cardboard mal. 

{J 211 five of you were on the floor? 

(J all right, sir. Now, how many masked men were in 

there with you at thet point? 

A 1 couldn't see who was behind ne, I believe there 

was three because there was one in front Of me. At one time 

there were three because the two behind me were arguing about 

the tape, 

[&) Ail right, sir. low, were you taped, sir? 

A Just my hands. 

2 Were any threats divected at you, six? 

A HOt at me personally. 

A They threatened to kill anybody that tried to get 

up or anything. 

 



  

Fh 

wl 

hicard the 

Ld 

gr P 
> s the Bhot 

A 

across the 

was nobody 

DACK YOUN 

untaped me and we 

8 2 
FE RHE 5 on one 

ight, sir. did you hear any 

Yeu I believe I heard two shots. 

ahots? 

I wan 

Could 

HO 7 i 

All right, sir. 

the shots we heard pl 

we walted a few minutes to make 

wat dig then? Y¥$ 

Then the Ci man was the first to 

Do you know his name, sir? 

HO FJ 

All 

And Grier broke out of 

left and went out through 

r 1 didn't. 

$F > iv. 3 x EINE a gp 5 3 Pug - ge Were there Other people out there? 

The people who worked in the e8. 

ving facedown © 1a H AN 8! py Qo xr * 

- ow 

shots? 

footsteps 

the oifice 

office 

hea 

VOU 

rd 

running 

sure 

leave 

and 

were 

there 

the 

he 

Did you notice anything out there? 

over 

 



  

4 You gay on one side, What side are you talking 

5 It was on the north side, 

north side? > i
 

F i
th
. 

2 at
 

Fao
 

©
 

| a
e
d
 

> fe 

& All right, sir. What general direction does Dixie, 

the front of Dixie Furniture Store face? 

A It faces west, 

& And these employees on the floor you saw were facing 
~~ 

the north wall? 

All right. Could you give an estimate of how close 

or how far they were {rom the north wall? 

A i would estimate about five feet, because there are 

desks along the north wall. 

QO Now, did you walk out into the main portion of the 

store? 

A Yes, First 1 looked at the people that were on the 

floor to see if they were the ones that were shot, and then as 

I started to go up to the front of the store, Ronnie Dukes came 

running ‘back saying that they shot Larry Besrd, they thought, He 

thought it wes barry Beard that was shot, 

€ PO you know Larry? 

Fis Yaa, 

5 fs i wx or go | SN Th 
[8 ARC WHO 18 ers 

270= 

 



  

A He is the officer that 

¥ All right, sir, Did vo 

on the floor was? 

A Yes, 1 d id. 

¥ And how did == how was 

there? 

FN 

right hand on stomach. 

his feet were 

best way to describe it, would be a 

laying diagonally in the aisle. 

0 All richt, How, what d 

Biv? 

3 At that time I asked if 

and Ronnie Dukes told me the number 

FY Oh department, vou know, the emergency 

Of the vifice and called the fire do 

an officer had been shot in the hes 

Pid you do anything 

WF ny 

+05. A When I went back 

he could only breath through his mo 

witli 

is on the beat, usually. 

B go up to where this 

he positioned at the 

o
y
 

ne
 

fr
on
 

pack, had 5 in a 
&
4
 

direction were his feet pointed? 

pointing, I guess the 

bout northeast. He was 

id = w you do at that point, 

anybody called an ambulance, 

of the emeryency, fire 

unit, 0 I went to the back 

epartment at ~“ and reported ti 

h- the weapon? 

to the front I noticed that 

uth and his mouth was filled 

with blood, so I moved the weapon off his body and ne and 

Ronnie Dukes turned him on his side 

esf 3 
SF Le H Gut 

  

80 the blood would Tun



  

2 All right, sir. Then what is the next thing that oo
, 

vou did, 1{ you recall? 

A The next thing I recall is the police arrived. 

{J Were they very long in getting there, sir? 

pose 50. It seemed like a iong time, 

but I guess it was just a matter of & couple uf minutes, pa
 

pe
s 5 

(¥ Sir, were you present when any photographs were 

taken out there that afternoon? 

A Yes 

i& I show you what hag been marked ag btate's Exhibit 

Humber 9%. Can you tell us what part of the Dixie Furniture 

store that revresents? 

A This is the =-- this is on the loading dock where 

we Jdoaded the truck at, It's about where the truck was when —~=- 

& when 1s the first time =~ the individual you saw, 

you say, came between the truck and the building? 

A Yes, Sir. 

% DO you sée anyone standing in that picture there 

representing that position? 

A Well, the detective was -=- ig on the side where 

they came up. I couldn't see then -- I couldn't see back 

that far because I didn't notice them until they actually got 

LO the dock. 

iJ But is that the side that he came up? 

 



  

Q The first one that you saw? 

A Yes, 

8, How about btate's Exhibit Humber 10, sir, 

does that depict of Dixie Purniture Company? 

A This is another picture of the loading 

% And Can you enter the furniture store 

that area? 

Bm %. 
GOCK 

throuan 

A Yes, through the door on the left, 

(3 All right, sire Are there some other doors 

that photograph? 

Fe There is another door there, but that's closed, 

it's never been open as lony ag I have been there. 

{3 Where does that lead to, Bir? 

there. 

be | 

A That leads to the back of the store. 

Q “0 another storage area there? 

A Yes, that's a large storage area back in 

# Now, did you observe anything on the floor in 

this room where you were 

loose? 

Hot right away. After while we noticed 

robbers had left his jacket, 

I show you what Deen as State! 

and ask you wt means to you, sic? 

A des, that looks like the jacket that was 

* Is that the general position that it was 

  

that 

laying down after you got up and got 

One 

8 Exhibit 

left. 

Iving in



  

that you recall on the floor? 

Ed RR ga 

Fie hf og PY 

¢h r a Fix rip 0 Le a bo ed Ton ata on 4H ais. po Tie es 3 PW EX 4 20 den Vo 00a TOE Oy TH 

L i SHOW YOu Wiha £ hag heen marked as state's EXxhiolt 

Number 13. Does that mean anything to you? State's Exhibit 
& 

pe 4 

Humber 13, are you fami h that area? f
t
 

Sa
ks
 

oe
 

Lie
 

x a 4
 

és Yes, sir, that is in the back, the little storage 

room behind the store, 

All tight, sir. 1s that the =-- $
F
 

Pa
 

A Behind the office, I mean, 

& 16 that the same room you were speaking OL? 

# Yes, that is the same room that we were == 

i pid you notice any other objects that had been 

¥ 

left behind, Bix: 

¥ 

NO, 8ir, hy 

8 Now, Btate's Exhibit Humber 12, what does that 

& This is another picture of the storage room behind 

the office. 

0 Does that room contain a safe, six? 

where you all were on the floor? 

=
 Po
 

- ox
 

va
d 

3s
 

£
7
 

D
a
 

we
 

{
 

Tr
 

a
 

& 

¢ i show you what has been marked as State's Exhibit 

Number 15. Can you identify that area of the store, sir? 

A Yeg, this is the —-=- this is the front of the store. 

oy a 
oe fg 

 



  

oo Looking from standing where, sir? 

A {t's from the office == well, right in front of 

the office on the north side. 

( Would that be where the salemen's desks are located? 

Q Looking out towards the front? 

Q I show you what has been marked as State's Exhibit 

Humber 17. Can you identify that for us, sir? 

A Yes, that is the center aisle in the store where 

the policeman was shot. 

o And do you recognize that area where ne was laying? 

B XE, 

Ls All right, sir. I show you State's Exhibit Number 

18. What does that depict to you? 

A That is the place where he was laying when I first 

came On him. 

DO you See a weapon in that picture, sir? 

& Yes, 

{ and do you know how that weapon got there? 

A Yes, 1 put 1t over there. 

Gi You put it over there? 

A os, 

& Did vou do anything with the weapon other than 

placing it on the == 

~275= 

 



  

A No, I just put it over to the side. 

0 Did you go to a preliminary hearing, sir? 

Were you able to identify anvone? 3
 

H HNO 

0 Have you, as far as you know, ever been able to 

identify anyone? 

A No, I haven't, 

MR. PARKER: Your witness. 

CROBS=-EXAMINATION 

& Now, you say that when vou first saw the robber 

Or robbers, they were approaching vou from the side of the 

truck, is that correct? 

saw them out of the corner of ny eve, 

0 All right, How many did you see at that time? 

A Right at that time I only gaw one, 

0 Can you give any kind of physical description of 

the one that you saw? 

A All I saw is that he had a gun in one hand and a 

black jacket in the. other. 

{2 A blackjack? 

  

& As I was standing directly behind the truck I only



  

LGN 2 ¥ 

was six foot tall? 

i 

#0) But de you recall 

Ps They were shorter 

ix foot tall? 

A NG, don't. 

right. 

nary hearing, I 

correct? 

ies, 

$ DO vow recall being 

Yes «
 

- 

{2 All right. Do you 

question, "Can vou estinate 

I would guess about 

bi Th x SIE 
the PARKERS Hay 1 

transcript to the witness 

Mr. Turner) 

All right. Does 

A Yes, I quess. 

(¥ SO you sald before 

tall, right? 

do you recall making 

HO you recall appearing 

think you testified 

racall the 

a we 

Just 

that refresh 

Po you recall saying that the man with the shotgun 

I could only guess at the height. 

me, that ls all I Know. 

the statement that he was 

in a prelimi- 

that you did already, 

placed under oath then? 

po 
18 
£40 recall vou 

much shorter than you he was? 

1" 

ask that counsel show the 

pe et 
5G 41€ Can 

look at that page, please. 

youx 

that the approximately fan was 

-277= 

 



  

" Pix 

£5 Xen M 

$ All right. How, what did this man with the shot- 

3 

gun do when he took you in the back; how long did he stay with 

you? 

A fie didn't take me in the back, he took Ben Tyson 

{i All right. The wale with the shotgun approached 

A In the beginning he approached Ben Tyson first. 

We pen Tyson first? 

Q What did he do with Hr. Tyson, if you Know? 

that was who he said == not to raise his hands. 

O All right. What did be do next? 

A As best I can remember, that's when the other 

fellow down by the dumpster was trying to get the cardboard 

man up there. 

3 All richt, The other fellow at the dumpster had 

a «22 caliber pistol, I believe you stated before, is that 

ki} 

{3 Now, you say the man with the shotgun had some~ 

thing that looked like a blackjack, is that right? { 

A es. 

 



  

with it? 

in the 

Vihen the 

C 

the 

A 

G 

Exibibit 

é 

  

other hand the 

Pld you get a good look at tha 

holding it in his what was he doing 

= He was holding it in his 

tig was holdi a blackjack in hand and a ghotgun 

other? 

YOos, 

wire was the goat 

Pardon? 

Where was the coat that you told ug about? Okay. 

man with the first approached vou all, didn't 

coat over the shotgun, or did he, I don't know? 

Yes 

Ckay. You gay he had i hand a blackjack and 

was the coat then? shotgun. 

I don't understand what coat you are talking about, 

You testified before that in State's All right. 

is that correct? 

ne black jacket or coat, whichever. 

All rights Was that the black jacket he had when 

saw him with the shotgun? 

Now, was he wearing the jacket or what was he doing 

~279~-



  

held the 

5 

covering 

aX 

jacket, 

fied before, 

microphone arcund this way? 

Ko, he had it over the shotgun. 

Okay. 

and after dock he took it off 

jacket in one hand and the shotgun in the other, 

Where was the blackjack? 

That was what he had in his hand. 

What I am trying to understand ig, was the coat 

the a
 blackjack or was the coat in another hand? 

No, I was saying jacket, not blackjack, black 

I didn't understand, Black jacket in one hand? 

Yes, sir. 

Now, when you heard the gunshots, I think you testi=- 

that you heard some footsteps. 

THE COURT: Mr. turn that Turner, Jo you want to 

1 believe we can hear you 

without it. 

  

Mr. Turner) How, you say you heard some foot=- 

after the shots? 9 & ps
 orrect, 

How many sets of footsteps d0 you recall hearing? 

I couldn't tell. 

saving that you heard two sets of fq Do you recall 

running away? 

gone recall saving Ho, 1



  

now? 

it 

Correct? 

One person, 

hear then? 

behind the 

{2 pt 

fivard the 

were in 

  

that room 

All right. Would you look at 

please. 

ro. 
1Q85 

» 3 

All right. Does that refresh your recollection 

I didn't say there were two sets, I said 

like there was more than one, at least two, 

Well, isn't that the same thing? 

Bo, it's not, 

ou thought you heard two footsteps, is that 3 ® & 

i heard footsteps and it sounded like more than 

All right, Tell us about that, Where did you 

I was laying on the floor in the storage room 

office. 

All right. How, was this prior to or after you 

Shots 

Shots. 

All right. How, at that time, how many people 

with you, if you know? 

Five. 

Pardon? 

Ek i VE 

—-l Bl



  

¢ What five people? 

# There was ne, Ben Tyson, James Crier, Roanle 

Dukes and the cardboard tan. 
— 

L . * All right. How many of the robbers were in the 

rom? 

A idon't know, I was laying facedown, 

did you hear those footsteps proceeding from, if you know? 

3 

A I couldn't tell the direction, 

J Were they in the front of the store or in the rear 

of the store, 1L you know? 

B I don't know, 

{ 80 1t could have been either way, right? 

1 

Fi YB, 

Q All right, How, what direction -- what directi 

# All right. How, were == do you Know for a fact 

whether or not the three robuers were ever in the room with 

you ali at the same time? 

& Yes. 

% All right. At what point was that? 3 

A When the one, vou know, with the shotgun was ug 

2 ’ 

with Ronnie Dukes in front -=- in front of me, and the two 

behind me were arguing about the tape that they were using 

tie up me and James. 

0 I'm sorry, did you finish? 

& 188 

“ 
7 

  

On



  

{d Ckay. after that, how many robbers were in that 

room, if you know? 

A I don't know. 

{J All right. How, you stated before that vou heard 

some footsteps running across the tile. What tile were you 

referring to? 

A The aisles are tile in the store. 

%, Qf the who? 

A here is tile in the aisles of the store. 

02 $0 would these be the aisies going up to the front? 

A There's three alsles going up to the front, and 

there is an aisle going around the office. 

p
o
 5 or
 -
 

n put 1t like this. The tile that you were 

talking about was in the front of the store, 1s that correct? 

& There's tile that goes around to the back of the 

store, too. 

& All right. The two sets of footsteps or what you 

thought might have been two sets of footsteps == 

Qr 

  

HR. PAREER: I will object to that. He hasn't 

sald two. He sald more than one, 

8, (By Mr. Turner) All right. The more than one set 

footsteps that you thought you . heard, was this on the tile 

what? 

Fo) It had to be on the tile. 

) Again, you don't know whether it was the front or



  

the back of the store, is that right? 

A Ho, I couldn't tell which direction it was coming 

£ En » 

8, You say vou saw three nen, Do you vecall making 

the statement that two of them had on masks but you couldn't 

remember about the third? 

A I don't recall making thet statement. 

Q You don't? You do or you don't? 

wr 

A I don't recall the statement. 

All right. Would vou look at Page 35 of the 

transcript and gee if that refreshes your recollection. Does 

that refresh your recollection? 

A I still don't. remember, but if it's in there 1 

{2 Well, do you recall making the statement that two 

had on masks but you couldn't renenmber about the third one? 

A Ho, I don't remenber making it. 

OQ well, do you recall making the statenents 

transcript? 

Fi) Ho, I don't remember it. 

O That is not your testimony? 

A Well, I guess it ig, but 1 don't remember 

making the statement. 

W; But the statement is there, right? 

A Uh=huh [positive]. 

284 

in that 

actually 

 



    

RE A IT GR ROR a ge - gh 3 fe 
: HOW, lL 0€ Wahid TO introdu 

@vidence, 1 have no cbijection. 

Pie KURSK we Can move On ITom that point, 

boy um he ah UA RE go TL NEO I RIG a Soe 
He 04h. GH8welred Lhe GQuestliciv. 

wlthess? £5
 

[3 (By Mr. Turner) let me ask you this question, wh 

atmosphere like at the store while all of this & 

excitement, wasn't it? 

we Be vn ¥ be 0% Bl i Cov i had de PRL oy SRT CY wv ie ae I don't understand what you want. 

what I am saying, while all of this was 

PER DN BA Li avi nw Fd {GIT TPP Mor NR -& NE ~ iho) I don't Know if I would call it excited 

. 3 
4 

ey a v. ERR TA i Ae w Py Bp atm a ps 

Can you describe the atmosphere there 

Silke FARKERYD. HOW 18 he going to describe 

Sa fn pi eon ou won Ty gy mee pon {ey “% I & FRE a EN rs TY Ys atmosphere’ He can't describe other PROPILL 8 

13 pe
t * F
e
 

| 5 a : s 

5 

™
 { } ba
 

pa:
 

Cy “ (4
 

~~
 

! 

  

feelings, dO 80, but be gure and let the 

OU. are describing. The atmosphere, if 

it in the vernacular, it neans one thing 7 

its pn 2 wh a Ea a . Fe J gna 
mean the conditions of the air yg UO YOU? 

Hike TURKER NC 

  

cribe what ne saw, 

if you can describe the atmosphere or



  

Fe (By Br, Turner) I mean the reactions of all of 

thie people aiter all of this occurred after the shots were 

fired. 

A I was afraid and I imagine everybody elge was, 

¢ After you all got up off the floor and went to the 

front of the store, what was going on then? 

A I don't know. I have already explained what I did. 

¥ All right. Wasn't there excitement and confusion 

when it was discovered that an officer had been shot? 

A There wag quite a bit ot confusion, 1 guess, 

(&] Excitement, too, right? 

A I don't know if I would use that word. 

J Well, you all didn't even know who the identify of 

the officer was who got shot, right? 

8 You all saw the individual laying on the floor but 

you thought it was someone else, right? 

MR. TURNER: 1 have no further guestions. 

Hite PARKER: 1 have no further questions, 

THE COURT: All right. Wr. Oliver, you nay be 

excuged., 

ir. Parker, call your next witness. 

w £4 13 5 Ph BE a A Se SB ou gn A oa op Fri an 
HRe PARRER 4 , al 1 MAMLEe Je ik horas * 

 



  

oe 2 

ie 
fy 4 & 

duly sworn, was exanined and testified as follows: 

DIRECT EXAMINATION 

PARKER 3 

Would you give the Court and jury your name, please? 

BY swan Fe 2 EFF gis 0 pov 
MEA E we AHONAE. 

Can you come just a little closer te the microphone 

80 everybody can hear you. Hove your chair up closer and that 

will help you. 

&% 

Bo
os
 

w
e
 

Mamie J. Thomas. 

And where are you employed, Mra. Thomas? 

Dixie Furniture Company. 

you tell us how long you have been there? 

TWO years, 

And what do you do there Lor them? 

SeCre lary. 

where is your store located? 

8993 Marietta Street. 

Were you working there on May the 13th, 18787? 

Be vou know what day that was? 

Saturdays. 

Saturday? 

Yes, 

pid anything unusual happen that day? 

Vii 
L28 

-287- 

 



  

£3 

unusual? 

0 

counter? 

pi 
£3 

Could you tell us what time 0f day? 

About two o'clock. 

In the afternoon? 

vhat 1s the first thing you noticed that was 

Where were you in the store at two o'elock? 

And where is vour desk located? 

Cn the left-hand side. 

The left-hand side of what? 

Uf the store. 

Towards the back or the front or what? 

It's more at the back. 

Was there a counter back there? 

were you in front of the counter or behind the 

Behind. 

All right. What were you doing at two o'clock? 

Posting payments, 

Standing or sitting? 

Sitting. 

Can you tell us what direction you were pointed in? 

* 
Towards the front door. 

All right, And what is the first thing vou noticed 

 



  

then 

A 

» 

wearing? 

ig handg? 

£ 

& 

40
, 

  

that was 

through the 

unusual? 

A nan running through the front door. 

All right, When did you first notice that man 

front door? 

When I looked up for a second or two. 

And where was he at that time? 

Hal Eway ™ 

Hal fway down the aisle? 

you describe that individual that you saw? 

ALGCut six feet. 

right. bean Do you remember what he might have 

and a blue and rust shire. 

Pardon? 

Blue shirt, different colors. 

All right, Did you notice anything else about wk 

I noticed that I had talked to him earlier that 

All right, Row, did vou notice anvthing else about Re i 4 ¥ os J 

He had a gun. 

Can vou tell me about that? 

all I know, it was a silver gun, 

& Bilver gun?



  

space we had 

{) 

coming down 

1 

I 
od
 

come over there and lay down 

  

low, where did he come as he was coming running up 

He came to the right-hand side through the open 

there where the salesmen sit at. 

Bow, 18 that your right or his right as he was 

the aisle? 

It would be his left? 

fan, 

And what did he do when he got over in that area? 

He put a gun in one of the salemen's back. 

And do you know which one that was? 

yes, 

Who wag 1t? 

Advis Malcom. 

All right, And what 1s the next thing vou saw 

I fell under ny desk, 

You fell underneath your desk? 

Yes, 

the next thing that happened 

I came out because 1 was afraid, and he told me to



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the salesmen 

that. 

i
h
 

i 

Wel 1 r a id 

heard? 

other 

the 

SEY? 

A 

£100, 

yaa 

- 

Hills sane man? 

what is the next YOu ware 

hear any shots? 

Yes, I did. 

Al1 right, Can you tell ne 

I heard two, 

You heard two? 

Yes, 

Can you tell me which direction they 

KO 

out of Did vou hear them lighter one 

Your right ear? 

Yas, 

And you were facing which direction? 

I had my face turned this 

Your left ear, then, was on the fioor? 

PE 
ant 3 I Seu 

aware 

how many shot 

Cane 

&ar 

to be a bully, I don't know why he said 

of then? 

8 you 

from? 

Or the 

way when 1 was laying on 

 



  

A, 

A 

Li 

Fo 

was moving? 

™
 gt 

£% 

around 

Sound 

0 you couldn't hear through your left ear? 

Eom a » 5 > 0 fa 4 oud % OR ww oy a % Pe ae we ny gr NS an WA gS ap ae Could vou tell which direction the shote came from? 
ke 

Ho, I can't. 

Wed 4 LP ra » 3 4% " ig Be RL TY 2 “ Ng J ¥ - Aare you aware QL anybody moving? 

And how were you aware of that? 

Because I got stepped oh. 

All right. Can vou tell me about that? 

Gomepody came across me and stepped on my leg. 

And could you tell in which direction that person 

Yes, he was going towards the front. 

&1l1 right. Now, is there a counter there? 

And where were vou in relation to that counter? 

I was elinost middleways of the counter. You have 

the counter when you go across me, 

All right. And 1f you go aroumi the corner then 

ar, what wall would vou be near? 

The right-hand side, 

® Bc ry a a am + ata pa vd Ta sp on 
#5 YOu are LAC LANG DULWET OSB? 

T $4 TE Lon, 8 ¥ ps a de L 7% Ben ; [od 7 is "y -~ £ 4 3 #Y iv = = 1t would be what wall as vou are facing inward? 

 



  

(E18 

A 

a
 

a
7
 

YOu 

this fe
ta
 

os
 Now, d vou hear HOraon 

oA 
Or atterwards? 

many people -- how many times were you 

WNC, 

a1) right. hear any conversation before 

you were stepped on? 

£5 

and got us 

a5» 

all right, do after you heard the 

I stayed there on the floor until the manager came 

ii k EE 

Then what did » do? 

We went toward the front because we thought it was 

Larry who had got snot. 

rt
 3 apout me 

All right, Bid you Xnow the man that got shot? 

* 

£40) o 

HOW, vou say vou that individual earlier | ¥ oh 

Could you tell me about that? 

When he came in early that morning, he was talking 

thie round bed LTOnt w- 

 



  

figure nobody would be coming 

for 

a 

Q Talking ahout what now? Co a little slower. 

& He was talking about the round bed we have In the 

ont window, and he sald he was looking for a Mother's Day 

and I just didn't talk to him that much because I didn't 

in on Saturday to get a round bed 

Mother's Day at such a late hour. 

¥ Bll rights Did that individual buy anything? 

& 2» 

J? i And did he leave? 

A He walked around for a little while and asked about 

stereo, and after that I just turned py back and he soon left. ’ Y 

Q 50 you talked to him and saw him for some ninutes, 

is that correct? 

A Yes, 

W) Now, you say the man that came down the center aisle 

was the same man that had been there earlier? 

A Yes. 

* And how positive axe you of that? 

A very positive. 

8) And on a scale of one te one hundred, what does 

that mean? 

you 

A What did you say 

On a scale of one to one hundred, how positive are 

that that was the same individual? Do you understand the 

question? 

  

~295~



  

x 

one percent, 

individuals 

oy
 

£3 

A 

I don't, 

axe saying 

1 
hs number, 

nundred perce 

Bow hs ” > aa 

Bund 

ae ane 
RF m 

You 

L825» 

{ Go pn w 1 ods one days iate 

7 An 
4 LE CN 

where 1t was? 

i iE 
IN > you recall 

to 
aT F— 
OWL COW 

City Police De 

Di 

i » x 
2 Were you 

LO you recall 

would vou tell 

I said no. 

You uk wa of woe pi 5 
SUNCYed 

ti 

very positive, 1 am asking you to 

inety percent, fifty percent, zero 

ne? 

Sa ed percent 

Sura wae Te sane percent 
a
 

Ls 1 p 
Ad where you went to that hearing 

¢ city department upstairs. 

partment? 

d you testify at that hearing? 

Fr
 

vou could identify L]
 

ir
 

what your answer was? 

us? 

 



  

that man today? 

if vou see 

around? Do 

water, 

| a
n
 

i
 

-
 

gfweatey on? 

{
 

Ts
 

Lo 

Anidd was that the truth? 

80» 

was not the truth? 

d you really recognize someone that day? 

Fen oa 

JEL 

~~ And who was it that you recognized? Do 

Would wou look around the courtroom 

hat man today? Have u had a cnance to YG 

you see that man today? 

THE COURT: Wr, Sheriff, get the witness some 

will you. 

(By Mr. Parker) Hrs. Thomas =—- 

wa Lhe you saw on May the lith, Han 

the courtroom today? 

« 

k £55. 

a 5 
LJ 

h¥) 

“ 
Would you point him out, please? 

That man right there, 

Is that the man sitting there wi 

Yes, 

rFardon? 

“« 

IGE 

DG xnow his name? you 

you sec 

GO you 

 



  

him 

A 

A 

and I 

e
e
 

Se
t 

YW 

Fu 

iy 

at 

there in 

wag 

warren McClesky. 

warren McClesky? 

Yes, 

How do you know his name? 

I was told hig nam 

How, could you tell us why 

before today? 

# oo. E Po ee. 
wags afraid. I 

Afraid of what? 

Strange things would happen 

BOAT Ed. 

t ne 

Are you married? 

Yes, 

PO you have children? 

18, 

How old are vour children? b 

Six ang seven. 

Mrs. Thomas, how positive a 

gweatey 18 the man t 

I just know what I seen, I 

rFargon? 

I know that man, I don't fo 

I can't understand you. 

BE am Frit Save wr eu fy © on gdm beh vor 
a 5 ® +38 op Of La SCHLC Of 

5s 
a A 

Eo 

you hadn't identified 

around our apartments, 

re you that that man 

nat came through that 

know that wag the man. 

rget a face, 

to one one 

 



  

# 

- pd J, x 4 iw 

HC ilk. 

£3 

you that 

you that 

through the 

A 

O 

4 

at Dixie? 

are you that that man cane 

Because I recognize his 

How positive on scale 

that is the man? 

what are wr YOu 

ravdon? 

what did you say? 

On a scale of zero to 

that man =-- that Mr. 

door with a gun? 

One hunored, 

One hundred percent? 

Yes, 

Do you 

Yes, 

And what is that? 

Beauty consultant, 

Beauty consultant? 

I give facials. 

You give facials? 

one 

peCles 

through the door with the 

face, I know him when I 

Of one to one hundred are 

nundred, how positive 

Kv is the man that 

have & second occupation, other than working 

 



  

po
 

8 

then? 

i 

{3 

a moustache? 

A 

J 

5 

Yen. 

And where do you do this at, your house? 

Yas, and at the customer's house, too. 

And are you always working with people's faces 

Yes. 

5 fc
 

o
 o £3
 

o &t
 

oa
d 

4
 

po
ts
 

5 5
 

S
f
 

of
 

pos
, 

&
 rm Ni
) 

Ed 
4 

ve
s oo
 

To
r 

P
d
 

ye
 

43
) Lg
 | & & Bo
se
 

5 “w
g 

Mostly on weekends, 

3 

How, the man at the preliminary hearing, did he 

I don't know, I didn't look around, 

I don't know, I didn't look around, 

You didn't look around? 

[Hods head negatively,.] 

er
 

”~
 

LE
 6 When you were ag) 

hearing, could you identify anyone? 

[Hods head negatively.) 

Did you look around? 

I just glanced. 

Had you already made up your mind you weren't go 
“ 

to recognize anyone? 

», 

Fad Yas, 

is PAREER: IOUYr wWithess. 

CROGE-BEAMINATION 

~300= 

have 

a guegtion at the preliminary 

 



    

weren't going to recog 

A When 1 found 

% GQ You 

  

do 

o 
A 

¥ features? cial B 

red 

shooting occurred that 

Lp a wo 4 
3 10 gaia Yo 

Fenty p X * ER EX re wn @ ” DUPY, lage wag lestayred 

BEE, ig That Correct’ 

il ED uty gt PL: SR 
My festered 83% 

8 LO YOU Yec 

P
v
 

A ie Naw ¥ $e a % Bc Xan ie Sa a ape ras dn gat a fh ad 
£3 4 Gidn’i say NY Lhing aiyoutr no fesgtered 

1 ev y Ye pr: 23g Wn go oun Bay gy mw ; | & 3% A 
(BIH EN remesnnel 10 31% 1 Gills 

  

remember 

iividual 

want me 

you 

all 

    

A 

out 

to tell 

recal 

all telling 

the man 

gr 

x 

anya 

ti 

the 

WO Cane 

1 sayin 

making 

remember saying he 

saying anything about 

make up your nind that vou 

ne? 

at we had to gO to Court. 

first description you gave the 

then what I told then? 

was vy ¥s om 
Man ia oy

 i that the 

the the 

in 

al features and fage was real 

3 

£5 ¢ vn ave the % 

had SURPpE On 

 



  

had # 

Q We'll show you that in a minute, 

MR. PARKER: 1 object to the side remarks. If he 

has something to show, let hir show it. 

MRe TURNER: As soon as my investigator can pull 

it out of the file, we will, 

THE COURT: There is no provision for lawyers to 

make any side remarks, Do what you want to do and ask 

questions. 

Ladies and gentlemen, I am not commenting about what 

will happen. There is a proper way to conduct a trial and 

I intend to see that it is conducted properly. 

{2 (By Mr. Turner) Do you recall saying that the man 

scar on the left side of his face? 

& Had a bump. 

*, A bump? 

A A bump on his face like it had been == 

GQ i'm sorry, I couldn't hear vou. 

A He had a bump on his face. 

8, You doen't remember using the words == 

Fy Like == 

8 Go ahead. 

A Like it had been & sore once and had peeled off. 

¥ You don't remember using the word scar? 

A It could be called a scar. When vou have a bunny 
Ey & 

sheds Off, it leaves a scar. 

 



  

0 

that you gave the police 

AY 

Look at Mr. McClesky's 

‘facial features? 

Ko, he don't. 

All right. I ask you 

and read 

signature on the bottom of thi 

FA Yes, 

#, What date is on it? 

A 5-13-78, 

{J That was the day of the occurrence, was it not? 

A Yea, 

Q All right. Now, do you recall saying that his 

face wag real bumpy? 

A Ho, I don't, 

{J Isn't that here in the statement? 

A I said that? 

¢ is that true or false? 

A I didn't say real bumpy, 1 said he had bumps on 

his face, 

0 “he statement here says, "His face was real bumpy," 

doeg it not, period? 

A es. 

& And you signed that? 

A es. 

G You state that vou never forget & face, is that 

3 

8 

| £
8 

he has 

to look at this statement 

it, please. Is that your 

 



  

right? 

&& ie 2 

( 50 at the time vou made the statement on the date 

of the occurrence, would it be falr to say that your memory 

was better then than now? 

0 You say vou noticed his face vas veal bunpy because 

you give faclals and the bumps on his face appeared to be facial 

haly bumps that had festered up, and what appeared to be a 

blister scar on the left aide of his face. You said that, 

didn't you, in this statement? 

A Tes. 

0 I ask you again to look at Hr, McClesky and tell me 

if you see rough features or anything else? 

A HO» 

oJ Did he have them on his face when vou saw him at 

the preliminary hearing? 

A I don't know. 

O “his is the statement you gave on the day of the 

ocgeurrence, right? 

I've never been in a robbery and a =~ like that, Vi
ng
 

“
 

~304= 

 



  

J All right, Well, is the information that vou gave i: 4 § 

the police here true or false? 

A Yes, it's true. 

{J Okay. Now, didn't you have an occasion to view 

‘ 

some photograpns with Mr. MeClesky's picture in it on 6-2~78, 

a Detective Jowers brought them by for you to lcok at? 

A b=~2~782 What day was that, I don't know? 

0 well, June 2nd, '78. 

Well, let's put it like this. Did any detectives 

ever bring you any pictures to look at? 

#, ies. 

(J Do you recall that particular day -- how many times 

were pictures brought for you to review? 

A I had pictures every day. 

| Bvery day? 

A it seemed like every day. Every time I looked 

around, I was looking at pictures, 

OQ well, how many times did you view pictures? 

A I don't know how many tines, 

{ You don't know how many times? 

A [Bods head negatively.) 

8 bo you recall if any of those pictures you have ever 

viewed had Mr, MeClesky's picture in it? 

 



    

Q You don't recall ~- 

A Ko, I don't. 

{J -= Or it didn't have it in there? 

A I don't recall, 

Q Out of all the times you were showed pictures, did 

you ever pick out anybody's picture? 

A KGa 

{2 why not? 

A because I didn't recognize any of them. 

& #o 1f Mr. MeClesky's picture was in that punch, you 

didn't recognise it, is that right? 

face? 

A Ho, I didn't. 

Q and 1 thought you sald you never forget a face, 
A 1 don't, but I don't recognize pictures. 

8 what is the difference between a picture and a 

HRe PARKER: Your Honor, that is argumentative as 

question, 17
] 

HRs TURNER: « Bo, Your Honor, I am afraid it's not. 

1f there is something == I will let the Court decide that, 

or should I rephrase it? 

WHE COURT: Madam, can you explain or put in words 

what you consider is the difference between a picture and 

a face? 

” » ig i BN BE TB fl LRT ak Pes misters 1 AN Ee ETT gine my go oi Ba dos 3 min VEE WITKELBS: Because I take plctures and they don’t 
t 

 



  

($ £ oo ne out the same as I would in person, 

G (By Mr. Turner) So you can't identify people from 

pictures, is that what you are saying? 

A MO, I can't. 

{ You can't identify anybody from a picture? 

A Unless I am standing there looking at them taking 

the pictures 

0 #lY right. How, you gave a pretty thorough descrip- 

tion of what the individual had on that particular day, do vou 

recall that? 

Fy Yi Be 

0 Lats gee, How, do you recall what you said he had 

on? 

A Blue pants. 

{ Blue pants, How do you remember that? 

A tov do 1 remember blue pants? 

Ci Yea, 

Fi I looked at them, I Knew it was blue, 

0 Just like vou looked at his face, right? 

A Yeah, 

& Al) right. What color shirt did he have on? 

A It was a different color blues and rust, 

{i But you remember that explicitly, is that correct? 

A Uh-huh [positive]. 

0 Then all of these are things that you remember 

-307~- 

 



  

geeing on the day of the occurrence, right? 
> 

A TQ. 

¥ Then would not your description that you gave to 

the police on that date be the best estimation of what the 

individual looked like who came in and robbed you? 

" Fai TOTP FIAT ge k PSG TY Wr R shire oN rT “A wh 3 a 4 {3 Once again, I ask you, does that description fit 

. 0 “5 on Xow wn? Hre BeClesky? 

Gr x » a oa a dn Eh gm won $n To THe ppg De " Fy 2 va Vs gn in bo 
UW hil x ight ® Where 18 the scar on the cheek? 

% ££ pn NE od - ] Foy i 

A Scars don't st Gave 

x bo ale vam ce 3 aay nd 
Le: RORY SE don't t stay 

pi NO. 

{3 Wives pen ay on th S ERPERIENES  uEy ti pea © ay pean PF 4 waere are Ee DUPE Qn hae Lace; 

A They don't stay either. 

J Hair bumps. In your experience as a facial -- 

op
t COURT: Mr. Turner, the sheriff is here with 

some coffee for the jury. Let's take our morning break, 

ladies and gentlemen, for about fifteen minutes. 

{Wihereupon, the jury retired from the courtroom, 

and a ghort recess was had.) 

THRE COURT: All right. Bring the jury in. 

(Whereupon, the jury returned to the courtroom, 

after which the following proceedings were had,) 

2 {2 (By Mr. Turner) Would it be fair to say that when 

 



  

vou first took the geat that you were a little nervous and 

upset just before you testified here today? 

A I still is. 

8, Why are vou upset? 

A I've never been through this before. 

Q All right. What made you decide to come forward 

with your identification at this late date? 

A What nade ne come forward? 

LQ Yes, When was it that you decided you were going 

to tell the truth? 

A I decided yesterday. 

@ All rights What persuaded you yesterday? 

A Because I was told that nothing would happen to me, 

Q Who: told you that? 

A Our ex~-manager from the store, 

J Okay. Why did he tell you that nothing would 

nappen to you? 

A I guess he felt like nothing would happen, and I 

hope it don't, 

o
o
 

Fa
 o
w
 

hs
 

a
i
d
 

Fe
: 

Ne
ds
 

r
r
 

En
d 

i
.
 2 eX—-manager tell you that you should come te 

court and identify Hr. Hc 

A de told me I could tell the truth, 

i when did you tell the ex-manager that you were 

lying; how did he know you were lying? 

A I told him before. 

we 3} ES ue su 

 



  

2) 

vO a an 
Lines 

£7 % 

84 
and 

2 

Eh, y 

AY 

© 

manageyx 

wasn't 

A 

Td 3 0 
Wako IOC 

  

when did you tell him? 

When we first came down to 

City Court? ~~ 
You mean in 

DOwnLOWH « 

“HE i an COURT: going 

Turner) 

about it when vou went to City Court, is 

1e8. 

Why didn’t you tell the police about 

I told you 1 was afraid, 

Was this before or after you went to 

Beiore 1 ever went, 

DG vou recall where Mra. NMcClesky 

were in City Court? 

Where wag he standing? 

He was second to my right. 

In fact, he was standing almost right 

he? 

LOE iN 

And you looked at him on that occasion 

the © 

the Courtroom 

sit a little closer to the microphone, 

the Other 

to turn up the microphone, 

“he Jury 

ant hear you and I can just barely hear vou here. 

HOW, you say you told your 

that right? 

it? 

court? 

standing when 

next to you, 

Gil Bald 8



  

A Yes, 

\* But you didn't tell the police you were lying on 

that date, did you? 

A HO # I didn 4 ® 

¥ Bid you tell Mr. Pa 

HA Yeu, 

Q when did you tell him € 

FN Yesterday. 

54 All right. 

rl 

How did that cone 

Bir) you had lied? 

at? 

about? 

A The manager told me to tell the truth. 

® Okay. 

A So 1 just told him yesterday. 

G Why didn't you tell him before yesterday? 

A I told you I was afraid, 

8 Okave Let me understand this. When did the 

manager tell vou to tell the truth? 

A ie told me yesterday. 

& Okay. Bow, you told the manager on the day that 

you all 

lie, is that right? 

A Yes. 

# 50 from that date, which 

until yesterday, you kept your mouth 

want to the preliminary hearing that you had teld the 

was on June Tth, 1978, 

silent and clogged shout 

 



  

store have 

Okay. 

on any glasses? 

Had on sunglasses. 

Okay. 

How, did the person who £4 a 
Ne ne into the 

low, can you describe those glasses 
ww! 

when you say sunglasses, what color were they? 

They were sort of a tinted with round frames, 

You didn't give that description to the police at 

the time, did you? 

A 

0 

statement, 

you sign the statement saying vou have 

Yes, I did, 

All rights Show me where it is. 

correct? 

I told them. 1 don't know 

theme 

them and it's not 

the best of your knowledge and belief? 

# 

0 

you signed 

A 

G 

that the de 

A 

Yes, 

How long did you have 

it? 

I don't know. 

Well, at the time you 

scription dealing with 

Wwe talked 

Who is we? 

Anytime 

~312~- 

about it all the 

I talked to somebody, 

tO read 

sunglasses 

time, 

there, 

This is your 

Well, now, didn't 

the statement 

why it's not here, but 

read it and it's true to 

hefore 

didn't you know 

wag left 

I told them 

££ 
~ 
bd 

od
y £2 

about the 

 



  

there 

A 

& 

Company? 

you? 

ru
, 

Fa
x 

N
e
 

po
 

I don't know. 

—. 

HOw many people have you talked to about thi 

Have you discussed this matter with Mrs. Carswell? 

dra, Carswell 18 the other young lady that works o< ye - 

store, Barnwell, Barnwell, I'm sorry. 

Have I talked to hex? 

How many times have you all discussed it? 

¥ 
- well, since she quit, we bs 

Are vou still working at the Dixie Furniture 

Yas, 1 am. 

80 you do what your boss tells vou to do, 

Who is that? 

Who 18 your hose? 

Hé 1s not my DOBBS any nore. 

Well, who is vour manager? 

Bud Johngon, 

What 1s his duty in relationship to you? 

he 18 manager of the store. 

Does that make him vour boss? 

hadn't been talking. 

 



  

4 S88 4 

Q Can he hire or fire you? 

A Yes, he can, 

& And he wag the one who told you to come in and 

identify Mr. HeClesky, right? 

i Ho, he didn't. 

Q He Just told vou to tell the truth? 

& It wasn't Bud Johnsen, I said our ex-nanager. 

did vou tell vour ex-manager? 

A Why did I tell him? What? 

ih Did you expect protection from your ex-imanager? ¥ 

A Well, I balieve him, 

(2 what? 

A I believe hin, 

A How, let's go back to the beginning. You say 

man came running into the store, is that correct? 

A es. 

0 Okay. He ran up the aisle and did what? 

A Came through the open space that we have that 

cone through to the back Of the counter. 

kay. How long would you estimate that took? 

the 

you 

a It don't take you but about five minutes to run 

in, 

0 It takes you five minutes to run from the front to 

the rear of the store, is that right? 

dig 

 



  

A To where we were sitting, 

Q Okay. © How long would you estimate that the front 

is to the rear? 

A 

rd 

Ul 

minutes to 

I don't know. 

But do vou think it could have been 

g& the large 

wv 

a don't know, but if I ran through it, it would 

take me apout five minutes, might not take that long. 

L$; Okay. 1 submit to you that it would take probably 

ten or twen 

A 

back. 

wvefore you 

ty seconds, wouldn't it? 

Probably would, 

When he ran up to you, what is the first thing he 

ran in the store he put the in the pan's Jun 

when you got down under your 

Yeah. 

50 how long did you have to observe this man? 

A second or two. & 
€ 

HNO ® 

= 3 
A § 0 you say you saw this man for about two seconds 

went under your desk? 

Yeah 

didn't your eyes, 

 



  

Didn't he tell you to ¢lose 

laving on 

Pa 

{3 
Fe 

a kor 
eB xX 7 

~ 

&£% 

¥ 

from 

under 

would 

& 

under 

T
i
d
 

your eves while you were 

the flooy? 

Un the floor, veah. 

Well, what could you see while you were under your 

What did I Bee? 

Yes PN 

I dicin't see anything, 

What was the next thing you saw after you came out 

the desk? 

I saw the man with the gun. 

rights and was he telling you to come out from 

he didn't, I came out on my own. 

what? Gia 

he told me tO come over there. Ang 

All right, And how long did that take? 

About a second or two, 

right. And what happened when you got there? 

He told us to lay on the floor? 

And do what? 

Close your eves, 

 
—
 

E
d
 S50 how long did you view this many how many seconds 

had a chance to see him? 

I don't Know, 

 



  

%, Well, by your own count you said about four 

seconds, so If we extended that, could we say ten, twanty 

Ha 

0 

about asked 

Say you 

store 

A 

that we had. 

©
 

the 

did minute to observe ; o
1 & it a minute, did you have a 

I don't know, 

What? 

I don't know, probably did. 

Who were you talking to when the man came in and 

a water bed? 

THE COURT: You are asking more than one guestion 

Turner) In vour statement to the police 

were talking to a lady when this individual entered 

first time to talk about the water bed, is that 

Yes. 

Who were vou talking to? 

talking to Classie and a couple of customers k 4 x ee . 

4 Was 

Where were you when this individual approached you 

the first time? 

  

i at the counter. 
C3 Lo di 
Ww 355 

Where was Krs. darnvwell? 

was at the counter. She 

he individu when he came in, $2 t seen 

gi 
be 

a i on f ! - 3 pin 
She Lave would 

Po
st



  

too? 

Bree. Darnvell saw, 

THE COURY: i 

rephrase the question. 

I¥1l ¥ {By Mr, Turner) tell you 

the board where vou were standing and Hrs. 

ing when the individual came up to the 

a I can tell vou, 
wh 

0 I think it would be 

tell us, go ahead. 

A I wags on the far left-hand 

right. 

§ Okay. 

A End I walked from Classie to 

was talking to him at, 

Q CRays what is the id Ow I's 

long distance? 

A No, it's not long, 

8 would there have been anything 

in terns of viewing this man? 

a conclusion, 

MR. TURNER: I don't think so. 

if there were obstructions any 

  

sustain the objec 

counter. 

better =-- okay. 

side and 

the 

distance 

Gbjection, she can't testify what 

tion, You can 

what, diagram it on 

Barnwell wag stand- 

Can you? 

If you want to 

on the she was 

far left where I 

Is it a there? 

to obstruct her view 

Objection. That would be a drawing 

She 

between her and Hrs. Barnwell,



  

THE COURT: If that is what you are asking, 1 

will overrule the objection, if she knows Of any obstruc- 

tions. 

i¥ (By Mr. Turner) Did you see any? 

A HG » 

(i How long did vou talk to this man on that occasion? 

FS I talked to him about five or ten minutes. 

J, Okay. Row, you say that he was wearing the same 

clothes that he had on the first time when he came back the 

second time, is that rignt? 

i Yes. 

the first J
 I F
o
e
 

¥. All right; How, what time 4ld he cone 

time? 

& It was about eleven, because I was fixing to eat 

Lreakiast, 

Okay. About eleven. bow, didn't you tell the 

police in your statement and the Judge in the preliminary hear- 

ing that the shots you heard vou thought came from the back? 

A I did what? 

8, You heard two gunshots, right? 

5% Where did you hear them, from what position? 

A I don't know, 

¥. Well, do you recall saying that you thought you 

heard them from the back? 

 



  

4 NG, I don't recall. 

C Okay. let me show you this transcript and ask you 

to read Pace 28 to see if it refreshes your pemorys. Have you 

A feab. 

, Okay, Do you recall now stating that you thought 

the shots came from the back? 

A NO, I still don't. 

i) Okav. Do vou deny saying that at the prelininary 

heaving? 

A No, I don't, because I could have. 

& Well, in reading this you say this doesn't -- do 

you remember testifying before the preliminary hearing? 

¥; Okay, In looking at this page, does this page 

represent the words or what you said, as best you can remember? 

A 1 Guess 80. 

§ Well, you were positive a little while ag0 about 

your identification when you told us you saw him for a few 

seconds. Are you positive about what you sald at the pre~ 

liminary hearing? 

E24
1 A I don't know what you are saying. 

Q 1s this the testimony you gave at the preliminary 

A I guess 80, 

“y 3 PRE 
wl Hew Om 

 



  

have read it. What do you £ {3 why do you quess? O 

doubt about it? 

Mi, PARKER: Now, he is arguing with the witness, 

Your Honor, and I object. 

THE COURT: Don't argue with the witness. 

hE > YATE ET FA = w a Sh 3 a 
Mrs TWURKERS: witetL I was say Ang wag ==—- 

2 w Bm bn T3405 ph po oP 2% EP 4 A Fon pw . PRP gE " SPs 2nd Mie PARKER: He can save it for closing argument, 

That is improper right now, =
 

THE COURT: You have a right to & thorough and 

sifting crogs—-examination and =- 

MR, TURNER: Bhe knows what she said, Your Honor. 

To 

fille  PARFEERIE bet
 

still object to him making a speech. 

MRe TURNERS He makes a motion and I try to respond 

to the motion and he objects to that, How am I going to 

be heard on the matter if he keeps objecting? 

THE COURT: You don't need to be heard. I have 

ruled on it, Proceed, 1 told you not to argue with the 

witness, but you have & right to a thorough and sifting 

cross—examination., I am affording you that right now, 

. ) {By Mr. Turner) When is the first time you decided vv
 

you heard things with your right ear? 

A That's the way I was laving. 

Oo Lid Mr. Parker discuss that with you? 

8] He didn't ask you anything about how you were 

 



  

lying? 

Fc Dis » 

3, You never talked to Mr. Parker about this case? 

A Who is Mr. Parker? 

{2 Right there, 

A I don't renenmber. 

Q You don't remember. Have you been interviewed in 

A When? 

4 You tell me, 

A I don't know. 

Q Have you been down here to talk to either the 

District Attorney's investigators or anvbody on the D.A.'s 

staff? Have they come out to see you? 

A Well, I don't know the difference between them, 

1 know a lot of people have been out to talk to me, 

4% Okay. Have you discuesed your testimony with 

anybody? | 

A I talked to a couple of mens. I don't know how 

Okay. Again I am asking you, have you ever talked 

to Mr. Parker seated there at the table? Do you remember his 

face? 

A I think I telked to him onces I went to pick up 

my little boy from school because he was hurt and somebody was 

 



  

there waiting on me, but I can't say it was hin, it was a fat 

{ You can't remember Mr. Parker's face? I thought 

aya « ou 8 5% 8% ER Y J ia on ihe iy Bin gis FT wn. A i 0 yp AA YOU 8814 YOU COULd rememner Laces that vou saw. 

8: Well, do you remember whether or not you talked to 

Mr. Parker before? 

A I don't know. 

# Lo you remember seeing hls face before? 

A [HO response.) 

MP, TURNER: Ho further guestions. 

REDIRECT EXAMINATION 

BY MHKe PARKERS 

#3 Mrs. Thomas, could you describe your attitude 

that you had at the preliminary hearing? 

THE COURT: Isn't that the matter you objected 

te while ago? 

dike TURNERS 100 are correct, Your honor. a
 @ 

RT's 1 believe you asked about the atmos-— 

phere. The Court stands corrected. CO ahead. 

{ {By Mr. Parker) Could you tell us your attitude 

that you had at the preliminary hearing’ 

A I was scared, 1 wag hervous. 

Q Was that your primary concern? 

 



  

Hh ies, 

HRs PARKER: Thank you, 

RECROBE-EXAANINATION 

8 You stated you were scared or nervous, but I don't 

think we ever got into why. You sald things had been happen=— 

ing around your apartments. Such as? 

A Someone broke in our car and stole all our cameras 

and insurance papers and somebody tried to get in our house 

while we were gone. 

Q How do you associate that with this case? 

A well, it was right after it happened. 

Q Okay. Is that the only basis you have? 

A Yas, 

¢ Okay. But nothing like that had happened the day 

you gave your description to the police initially, is that 

right? 

A NO « 

Q Isn't it a fact that another strange man came into 

that store earlier that day? 

A I don't know, 

{J You don't recall telling the police that a strange 

man came in and I believe Mr, Dukes showed his gun and he left. 

DO you recall that? 

A NO, I don't. 

5 52 
ads a Lo 

 



: 
oe Lng 

ana a 

Store 

  

Mile TURNERS HO IUrtner Guestiongs 

og hi FW wn ¥ wal | #4 - a are Bn. : » gh $9 “hk COURT: Any reason this witness 

i have no reason, Your 

Lhe DE eRCcused, TARE RS 7 
ie 

{ v3 A h'4 

Ls (4 ey - PO 4 A i Wr phe a oh - 
wih LOAURYS YOu may bea excused § GLB. 

j A SW EAE ie £2 fk ay Wg PI Eh BT OR i CPD 
Mie PREARLEKRS ine btate Calls Urticery 

SWOrn, was examined an 

EXAMINATION 

testified 

  

53g Fone » ard 

as follows: 

1? 

Reis 

Would you give us your nane? 

Officer Ls UU. Beard. 

And by whom are you employed? 

whe Atlanta Police Department, 

What do you do with them, sir? 

Patrolman, done 1, Lay Watch. 

Can vou describe the area approximately of Zone 

it's a lot of residential and apartment clexes 

of businesses located out there. 

Bir, are you familiar with the Dixie 

Harietta Streotr? 

Xia ak a 
8% yp EiX 

And is that in your zone? 

wr fee é ub 

1€8, Sir. 

~325= 

  

Furniture 

 



  

ment , 

to Ke ive 

How, how long have you been on the pelice depart=- 

Eight years. 

And how long have you been in Zone 1, sir? 

EY ny FE) £5 Gn ey gd 

SEVER Years, 

Were 

know 

How well did 

I had been 

VEALS. 

was that 

Coe 

ii
 

oy) 
vod 

zone? £2 mu ww gm 
Ry 15 8 4 £5 

Yeg, sir. 

you tell Cg 1 

AL 

1350 ¥ #3 8 

I that Khew 

How, did vou 

1978, 

Yes, Sir. 

ANG do you 

to that call? 

working wi 

know anything else about h 

he was parried, had 

you working on May the 13th, 19782 

Officer sSchlatt? 

you 

h him approximately 

in the game arvea? 

us approximately his ? age 

ORE | . UT a aL, TR NIrty=-one vears Old. 

one daughter. 

hear any radio transmissions on Hay 

concerning the Dixie Furniture Store? 

TAGio transmission who was 

ee PAL Be 

 



  

A Officer Bchlatt, Car 107, 

¥ where were vou at the time, sir? 

tu 
A 1 had received another call off of Bankhead Avenue. 

6 How far was that? 

proximately three or four miles. 

# Can you tell us what time of day that was, APProxi-~ 

A It was around -- I'm not sure about the time, - 

Q Wag it morning or afternoon? 

£ ALLernoon. 

Did vou go to the Dixie Furniture Store later? 

Ld Do vou know what time you arrived? 

© ra ws vive a 8 wis « 3 vr” {J Approximately? 

$ It was approximately ten minutes alter ne 

$) After who recelved the call? 

rece 

Sir. 

ived 

# £11 right, sir. Now, what is the first thing you 

observed when you arrived? 

® A What I observed, the front door was locked on 

bullding. 

) All right, sir. How did you get in? 

# The guy that works inside, Darrell, opened 

  

to 

the 

the 

front



  

door for 

floor. 

and 

A 

told 

Q 

HA 

A 

All right, sir. And what did you do at that point? 

I went inside and saw Officer Schlatt laying in the 

Pid you recognize him? 

Yes, sir. 

And what is the next thing you did then? 

By the time I looked at him I came over the radio 

them to send ug some Hore Cars. 

1807's beat; 

BY MR. hE £3 RT 
5 = 

Do vou recall what type of signal that was originally? 

Signal 3, holdup slam. 

Are you familiar with that store, sir? 

And have you beén in there before? 

Yes, sir. 

Po you know most Of the people in there? 

Yes, sir. 

Would vou have normally answered that call? 

Yes, sir. It's on the beat line. It's actually 

but I stay in the area post Of the tine, 

MR. PARKER: Your witness, 

CC LP YAR TRATION CROSS-EXAMIBATION 

ER3 

 



  

perpetrators 

SCLOYe &tL the 

i 

ie of the BROT 

being first 

A 

am
et
 

  

after 

PARRKLE 

hear & radio 

the occurrence describing any of the 

I gon't fullv understand your guestion. 

Gn Fe pig BA iw 3% 

tO Le on the nformation a
 any 

or a description of them? 

: ¥ 
LAE D

l
 

iry 1 

that description? was 

t know the description, 

tine. 

Okay. 

iptions glven? 

Sire 

hd ¥ SEI Tas e Lach RE Re WURKNERT  DHanx you. 

vx 4 £38 £3 TF EE Bd eu . ¢ PE NL ae TIT PY. a Hi. PARKER: May this witness be excusea? 

raw @ ¥ iy r] Fa 0 | on E oo wi - . Wr 
THE COURT: Qfficer Beard, you may be 

IR 8 ln Ed 1 ie 
9 V ba AR AA 

Sos Eer§ 
FEE F 4 

exenined and testified as 

EXARIBATION 

Be
rd

 
F
a
 

: 

us your name, please, 

do you work? 

¥ £% FS 
pe 

pere 

Lrangs 

k 

“e rators? 

you recall hearing a radio transmission 

certain 

axcused., 

Did you interview anybody or did you hear any



  

gate © 
£ 
A 

Pe
 

Can you tell us whete that is located? 

And how long have you worked there, sir? 

609 Marietta oad, 

yy 

About & year and a halt. 

Hay 

on Marietta 

it 

Ba
 

ol
 

pay a 

he. bx 3 on 
Ll ASS a 

what do you do there, sir? 

pe 

Traller mechanic. 

And are you working there today, sir? 

88, 81l¥. 

Fr
m 

—~
 

5
 $+ Biv, 1 @sk you to recall vour attention to the 

the 13th, 1978. Do you recall that date? 

x
 1086, 

& lr. We wag sitting at the red light there 

Street, right there at the junction of Howell. 

wag sitting there through the light, and a policeman drove 

fou gay "we". Who are you referring to? 

Hy wife and me, 

“ell us which direction you were headed? 

From town, whichever way that iu. 

Yeah, going towards Head, 

Head Paper? 

i s ER A Boa en om wf fe fe A ww SE Co Ep ay $e 3 or i 4 T 4% an bs i 4 Yes, We were sitting there &t the red light ana 

dues on and no siren or nothing. He hopped cut 

rn a Wels ie perl ST 3 2 a a Eg ra Be: 2s - Yi PE os a a ath PREY CAE TS Zo Bi pi 
pulled 1i6 pistol and run ap to the doors, and I guess 

Was 04% thirty seconds or something like that and I heard 

 



  

a shot, and then there was another shot, and it was about 

another thirty seconds, 

and I seen a black man running out 

run 

Street there 

Sie 

A 

you 

phone and 

we had geen 

£3 

right? 

A 

  

down the 

called 

¥, 
3 about the same distance, vou know, 

toting a pistol, and he 

front of the building and turned down Bighth 

and run down Blghth Street and that is the last 

All right, sir. And which direction did the police 

from? 

Down Howell Hill. 

Would that be from ew 

Say from the dog pound, coming that way. 

Buckhead or north? 

Right, 

%. 

Was 1t going south or what? 

I guess it would be south. 

All right, sir. How, what did you do then after 

this? 

We want on up Marietta Street and went Lo the 

the police station and alerted them to what 

and heard. 

When the man came oul running, you turned say he 

[ods head positively,] 

And which direction would that be, 

would be north. I believe that



  

driving 

was jus 

y 

wag 1t. 

Hopped 

Q 

store? 

police, 

Know, a 

  

£
£
 

Ang 

x 
A F 1g is 

and 

JO ing 

north? 

he turned t 

¥ 
4 tnat 

who was wit) 

Sir. 

was the 

ne 

$s Lene 
i Yiid p 

last time 

A A 
* 

toward Eighth Street, 

corner? 

I seen him. 

our wife? 

Do you recall any sirens at all as you were 

I 
b Cf FJ 

t there 

There 

out and 

MR A Ld 

TURMER? 

Can 

NG, 

You 

though, 

Do you recall what that description i 

All 

little 

Do 

with 

Tun 

EL you 

tt et atre - ww Pp 

his 

into the 

PARKER: 

a 3 4 
3 od CROS BRANT 

sir? 

blues on 23 a 

SLOT. 

a i 

vou ddentily the 

I can't, 

didn't you? 

I recall is 

taller than pe 

recall 

Just a 

~E 818 

saying 

3 

N 

parson 

t 

what surprised ne, 

nici 

wasn't no noise at all, 

& description © 

& 

¥ 
» hat he appeared 

you know, because he 

he hopped out and that 

he just pulled up and 

Your witness. 

Say run out of 

that person to the 

ositively.] 

bh. 87 

y 5 v phn | Ca % LTO &nd husky man, you 

little 

to be nineteen



  

vears of age? 

A My wife might have recalled that. 

» Do you recall describing the e¢lothes that he had 

Fe) I didn't notice lLils clothes, 1 seen the 

handle of a pistol and that is all I seen, 

Q All right. Well, you did give a description to 

the police. You recall that, right? 

A Ye 

MRe TURNER: Excuse me for just a minute, Your 

BONOY » 

Q (By Mr. Turner) Well, while he is looking for that, 

do you recall telling the police that the person you saw had 

dark trousers, long sleeve shirt, silk shirt, with brownish- 

gold stripes. 

A I do recall that, 

0 That is what you told them, right? 

$: And that is what he had on? 

& Any question in your mind about that? 

& E00 3 

{2 Are you positive? 

Ld 
he xy 5 185 « 

{J You saw dark trousers, a silk shirt with brownish- 

po 
Tad wd a ™ 

 



  

gold stripes, is that right? 

A As far as I recall. 

3 Sir? 

A Ye& Bg BAX e 

o It couldn't have been blue? 

A viell, I -= no, I really didn't notice the clothes, 

I noticed the pistol. That is the first thing I seen. 

Gi Which is it, you said you did notice the clothes? 

A I mean, I sort of glanced at it, you know, 

Q You gave tine police a description of the clothes, 

Q and how long after you saw the man did vou give the 

police that description? 

So
n A Long enough to turn around and come back down there, 

(2 S50 would vou say that the description vou gave the 
> + > pA 

police at that time was your lmmediate impression of what you 

a Yeah, just what I noticed. You know, I noticed 

the Drown trousers. How, I wasn't too sure about the shirt, 

but I do know he had brown trousers on. 

L& All right. What makes you remember that? 

A That's just -- I just seen it, 

{ Gut you are sure hie had on brown trousers? 

Yeah = wr
 

-334~ 

 



  

ok | TI IS IFES 

BY PARKERS MR » 

HE o o#
 

F
w
 

description 

A Yes, 

i And 

he was wearing? 

A it Ww 

T ii ke 

nes 4 w Fy 28 iri being first dul 

BY HR. PARKER; 

of the 

did 

TURNERS Thank you. 

REDIRECT EXAMINATION 

New, did vou and your wife discuss the 

man? 

she tell you what she cbserved as to 

as the same thing. 

PARKER: Thank you. Hay this witness be 

COURT: Any reason he may not? 

He may, Your HONOL. 

COURT: You may be excused. 

right, Hr. Parker, call your next 

PARKER: Call Alvis Halcoconm, 

GEORGE ALVIS MALCOM, 

sworn, was examined and testified as 

DIRECT EZARMINATION 

0 Would vou give us your name, please, sir. 

A George Alvis Halcom, 

& And where ave you employed, sir? 

A Now? 

LJ 188, 

A i am 

  

Bi « 

Pro Seeding in Lithonia. 

¢ 

od 

employed 

e
d
 

witheas 

what 

follows



  

U 

to that? 

& 

& 

happened? 

A 

How long have you been with then? 

Since July 5th, 

All right, sir. 

ou tell us how long you worked there? 

About approximately three months, 

y
e
 

pe
 

Ld
 

Po
ts
 

- » 1
 

“~
 What were your J there, sir? 

» 

Salesman and a collector. 

you recall the date of Hay the 13th, 19787 

reason why you recall that date? 

Yes, sir, we were robbed. 

DO you remember what day of the week that was? 

Saturday. 

"n
y o 

fa
s Can vou tell me what time of day that this took 

low, where were you in the store at the time 

I was standing in front of a routeman's desk, sor 

of in the back, left side, facing the store's north end, 

{ 

  

Will you describe that store for me? 

-336~ 

How, who did you work with prior 

this



  

Wall, you go straight down, the furniture was all 

door office area was straight back, delivery in the front, the 

the right and the routemen's area on the left. 

. other office about another offi A] any How Ce area; 

manager's office was bel secretary's 

2 Where did the secretaries 

would sit up front, two front desks across Beg
” The" £5 

route 

from each other. 

» general area where the 

men's 

raouvteman were sort of be 

yOu ware where? 

aw brother's desk. 
¥& ¥ 8 in front of i 

gt thing that vou 

A 1 wag in 

FE od 3 - 4% an rid TNE REE SP x 3% ain AE GGT {3 All right, sir. What is the firs 

became aware 

aware that 

A Pardon? 

$ What 1s the first thing that made you 

something was wrong? 

well, 1 saw, for instance, a man come through the 

1 

A 

door with a gun, I couldn't tell what he looked like, 

; his face, and I knew we % 

back 

could just tell he had a mask on 

getting held up. 

what did then 

=337- 

 



  

Dak 

were 

to 

A 

BEY 
on iy 

me, somebod if 
& 

brother's des 

  

Pa 

eg 
foe 54 

Su 
i’ 

brother-in-law and Pe EV 
$1 YY 

Rl 

and that is when I didn't see him 

what did he do at the store? 

the Manager. 

the next thing that vou 

Obed? 

Pardon? 

nexc the 

I just knew we were getting held 

il the police, 

vou do next? 

That is when I was caught in the 

me about that. 

motioned for the 

any more. 

prog nF ARIE Eo OR 
LPLBarvaea 

i} 

3 
Lr
 

r
e
 

back by surp 

ang I told 

that vou 

thing vou observed that vou knew 

my 

er 
2 

T1880, 

I wag just standing there, and I was looking down 

from behind, but I never saw him. 

All right. And how did he grab 

sort of bent me over and 

sk and he was ripping at ay gun 

3 Can vou describe that gun? 

It was a ,380 automatic Garcia p 

Where did you have that, sir? 

YOU » 

towards 

handle oO) 

igtol. 

5 ~ 4 i oon bs 3 2 ~ a sis eH It was sort of behind me on my back, 

»" w.5 0 an 4 rd 4 PR gee 4 STR nl ah + Ia oy $ 23 £3 FA i) $ vy And wnat did you carry that weapon 1in 

~338- 

brother, and the first thing I knew I was =~ he grab 

gir? 

t @ 

2% 
a 

my side.



  

nappening? 

Pes 

brother pr
. 

of me, and 

Pardon? 

wiiat « 

what Ji: 

d you carvy that weapon in? 

d' I carry it in? 

d you carry it in? 

A holster, 

Lan you 

It was 

HOw was 

it was 

Were there any security measure 

JE a PR hPa fs 3 an dv fa : 
Jescrinpe that to us’ 

a black Smith & Wesson holster. 

there to keep the Li
 

the pistol gotten away from you? 

ripped off ny belt, 

HOW about the holster? 

That ? LOO 8 

He laid 

told ne 

vou then? ok the next thing that happened to 

me on the floor and told me not to open 

not Lo move. 

Was anyone else on the floor with you? 

At that 

All right, What is the next thing that you remember 

Well, he was -- the man that pul me down wag telling 

time there wasn't, 

to get down, and he was trying to get down in fron 

h 

apparently he didn't want him down there, BC ny 

3 $e 2 - ¢ ot . 3 o - 4 "ee 11 2h 2% 3 1 4 a TN 3 Vers 4 “sd “l £7 3 § i § 2 3 : ¥ 3 or Drother was getting up again, ang 1 heard sQuUiliing Denlind me, 

~339~ 

 



  

and then apparently he put him on the other side, which 1 

didn't see anybody. 

# Did vou heay any talking? 

¥, what kind of talking did you hear? 

A They were just using foul language towards us, 

told us they would shoot us Lif we opened our eyes or if we 

noved,; or whatever we did. 

vi Was this directed at you particularly? 

A Well, not particularly at me, just sort of in 

general to all of us, because I couldn't tell if he wag talking 

to me personally. 

(J Did you ever see that individual? 

A Ho, sir. 

6d Do you know where he came from? 

A No, sir. He just came from behind me. 

# and which way was vou back facing, sir? 

A The front of the store. 

0 The front of the store? 

A Yes, sir. 

{J pid you have a jacket on? 

A Pardon? 

&] Did vou have a jacket on? 

iy NG, sir, I didnt. 

{O Wag vour holster and pistol exposed? 

 



  

* =
 

oy
, 

did you hear any shots, sir? 

sir, a few minutes later I heard three. 

shots? 

BHOLE . 

you tell which direction they were coming 

way I was laying catty-cornered on the floor 

facing the north wall, they were behind me, behind my ear, 

Somewhere fe» 

ight. Where would that be in relation to 

e¢ of the on
d 

{£4
 

E
d
 

center alsie? I was on the left ¢ 

facing the end of the store, 

You were facing the end of the store? 

sir, 1 wag facing the end ¢f the store, 

feet were polnted. toward the front door? 

you ever lived any weapons, sir? 

BIT e 

type of weapons have you fired? 

38. That particulsdr weapon I hadn't fired at 

sir, and I have fired rifles and shotguns. 

 



  

a 
7
 

nd
 

e
y
 

Fo
u 

we
l - =
 ad
 type of pistels have you fired? 

£3 Anything other than that? 

8] Anything less than that? 

QJ Now, did all the shots sound =- appear to have the 

game intensity? 

=“ fs 
% ieaning one after another? That is the way it 

5 i ob ~ 

A Thi sane, same sound. 

Ft 5g Brent yttel P 
Nd word in  - BHOUNKS ¢ 

A Uh-huh [positivel. 

3 Could von tell whether or not they all came from 

the same direction? 

A To me it sounded like it, that is where they were 

all coming from. 

& And that would have been behind you? 

A Yes, 81. 

{} Could vou tell by listening as to whether it was 

coming =~ from which side of the store it was coming? 

A Well, I really couldn't tell exactly, I mean; which 

po
 side it was actually on, just knew it was behind nme, 

What 414 that gun sound like to vou, sir? o
a
 

wt
 

- # ~ # [4 

 



  

ff 5 re FO TR Ys 3 Ps PE eT a Lee aT Foon BF my mee 2 5 2 3 ~ 3 PEAT Se Li YOU have heard shotguns Helore, have you not: 

A Yes, Sir. 

Q Did it sound that loud? 

o Have you heard 22's {ired? 

& Yes, 81iv. 

{J Was it louder than that? 

& b 43 F ¥ HAL» 

¥ What did you hear, if anything, after the sghotsa? 

4 What did I hear? 

0 Yer, 8ir. 

A 1 heard an ambulance or a police car go down the 

street, and I didn't bear the front door open, now, but I 

w heard somebody gay, "Here comes the police,” and then I 

heard some scuffling and running, more than one -- more than 

Po
u two footsteps, and then about that time ig when it got quiet 

arci that is when I heard the shots. 

W How long had you had that weapon, sir? 

A About two nonths,. 

¥ Where did you == how did you acquire it, sir? 

A I purchased it at Richway Department Store. 

£5 sal uu $4.3 . a 8 ; BTR, * what did you pay for it, sic? 

4 Do you know warren HoeClesky? 

~343- 

 



  

A Pid) r BIL e 

£3 Ths YN 4A ASK i 3 POA RE IE TE TED arr «sy Bn £2 ENE RE ons 3 oo ¢ TN oY val th 
8 DO you gee Loe man SliTing at COUnsaes’s ayia WW £3 

the white sweater on? 

* op 

Yes, Bi be.
 hi.
 

Q Have you ever seen him before? 

A NG, sir. 

Q Where had you been that day on day the 13th? 

A I had been on my route all morning, and we usually 

get back in around one or two. 1 was, you know, coming in to 

¥ 

turn in and 4 Ba pa ne Li 
FICONE » -~

 (#
 

# You say you saw one other man coming in the rear 

door? 

A Yes, Bl « 

& tow, had you ever seen that man before? 

& Do you know what type of weapon he had? 

A it was just a big, shiny gun, I couldn't tell from 

the distance 1 was at. 

& can vou identify anybody that came in that store 

that day and robbed you? 

po
n 

up
. « 

=
a
 

ha
 a person that grabbed you from behind, did N
N
 

be”
 Q od
 

ever see a weapon? 

BE pe ah 

£5 all op 55 ir. 

2 Py BOTY EF RS wud p> « 

He PARKERS Bans You, 

—34G4=- 

 



  

%) CROSE~EXAMINATIONR 

BY MR. TURNER: 

Q OU say you saw & big chrome gun, that is the 

statement you gave to the police, wasn't it? 

A Right. 

#; Chrome, right? 

A Right. 

J Row, wae the man coming in the front door or the 

back door with the chrome gun? 

A BACK door. 

{ You are sure of that? 

2 It could not have been the front? 

é HO, 8iv. 

¢ What makes you $0 sure he came from the back wit 

the chrome gun? 

A Becaunse I saw him come through the back door, 

# Bo did you see any other chrome guns, anybody el 

with them? 

A Wo, slr, that ig the only one I saw. 

Q All right, Now, were you ever in the front of t 

store? 

A In the front? 

S$) In the front portion? 

A Daring that day? 

  

h 

se 

he



  

Fi) Fen Fo 
RS Lei p 

Fy EY 5 

ul FALE 

Or the Dac of 

A The 

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oy Po a 
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chrome gun had 

A Yes 

* wit 

é yes 

LJ 0) 

£4 HO 

¥ Cl & 

description to 

ER 

the store? 

BOW, vou did 

an individual? 

Ll, the one 1 saw coming 

hose mask and the gun, 

you remember telling th 

the man you saw coming 

on a stocking mask, is 

yr Bir. 

ha toboggan hat? 

give 

¢ police 

about 

you lying, were vou lying 

in 

and that is 

in the 

that correc 

that? 

the back 

that he 

back with 

the in 

doer, he 

all I saw. 

had 

the 

+ 
tw 

front 

4 description to the 

had 

vv 

¥. But you don't recall giving the police any 

the effect that the man bad on glasses? 

 



  

A Ho, sir, not as I recall. 

8 Ckay. How, you stated to the police that you 

heard someone say something to the effect of, "Here come the 

cops," is that correct? 

A ies, sir, 

0 Tell us about that, when and how was that said? 

A it was after we were on the floor. 

§ All right. You were in the back, right? 

{ 80 it would ~~ well, did that come from the front 

or the back of the store? 

A It was coming from behind ne, 

{ So -~ well, when you say behind you, what was 

behind you? 

A “he front of the store. 

LQ Chay. Wow 1 understand. So someone in the front 

of the store said, "Here comes the cops," is that what =—- 

A Yes, sir. 

Q Ckaye. What happened then? 

A I heard gcuffling, like running fast, 

(3 Okay. Could you tell which direction the running 

was? 

A I couldn't tell you which way they were going. 

it was hard to tell on the floor which way they were running, 

it was behind me. 

~347- 

 



  

\& S50 the running would have been toward the front 

f the store, is that right? 

A Ho, sir, I wouldn't say it would be toward the 

front of the store because of the way I was laving., The way I 

was laying, that is why I say I don't know exactly where it 

Q Did it sound like more than one person was running, 

Or do you know? 

2) It sounded like pore than one, 

oF Wag this before you heard any gunshots or after? 

A Yes, sir, before, 

G3 How soon before you heard gunshots was that state~ 

ment wade, if you can tell? 

62 Yes. In other words, the statement was made, and 

then vou heard gunshots, What was the time interval? 

A It was close, a couple of minutes, 

OQ Ukay, S50 there was a brief pause before you heard 

someone say, or between the time -- let's say vou heard someone 

say, "Here come the cope,” then there wag a brief pause and 

then you heard gunshots, is that correct? 

bY a 4 ” 

#4 108, Bil. 

bay FTE Eps ees PVE fa 1a I TN 
HE AIRES Ai NEK YOU, 

$b Ba AF 4 a Ey RSE sn 3 | VR i 4 gi 8 Fg po on he 
Fiiie PABREKEH: May this withess De excused? 

THE COURT: Hr, Turner, any reason this withess 

 



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A The warrants were to be served at 1064 James 

Btreet, Marietta, Ceorgia,; Cobb County. 

G All right. And what time of day or night -- were 

those warrants served? 

A Yes, air, they were. 

QO When were they served? 

A At 5300 AJM., approximately, on March the 30th ~~ 

correction, May the 30th, 1978. 

0) All right, and who was with you; if vou recall? 

Le A We had guite a number of people involved in the 

warrants, With me from my police department was Chief Waters 

and Detective We B, Holmes, Also Atlanta PD, several of their 

officers were present, Sergeant McClure, and the County Sheriff's 

Department had several officers, including Cificer Hudson, and 

Plarietta PD also was present. 

$d How, what part did you play at the time those warrants 

were being executed? 

A At the time the warrant was executed, I was at the 

front door and went in with Chief Waters, and a representative 

from the Cobb County Sheriff's Department, We went inside and 

I was the inventory officer and kept records of all items 

seized during the process of the gearch warrant. 

8, All rights Did you take part in the search at some 

point as well? 

Yes, sir, I did. Fo
ra
 

oF
 

a 
350 

 



  

{4 Was anyone arrested during that time? 

A Yes, giv. In addition to the suspect, Warren 

? was also arrested by the Cobb County 

Sheriff's Department, 

Wag she in the residence? a
 

& Yes, 81ir, shit was, 

: Sink Bu gn any oy By i = WD x Ba ge” whereabouts was she? 

A Lhe was in == at the tine the warrent was executed 

i Ti a £ ia En te I = be Fy gn pes on FR dE s 4B ba EY pe whe ho wh an nh 
Bh was in Lhe LHedroon of the residence with sarren Meliaghvy. 

2, And wag theyre nore than one bedroom in that house? 

# Foi ori a. SRT Foy ah on Be Bei, om ge abe TR J Ll oor 
£ 8, BIT, THY wale THXef LHEUEOUHIS 

8 i % EEN TN LTR Beam 252 J atl Na gh RP Bao 2 pi ao i A am Ee ak ay : ~5 
3 ANG WHICH DHYPGTOOE wad Harren Mo Cleaky arrested in? 

P49 It was in the northeast bedroom, northeast corner 

¥ Is there nove than one floor to that residence? 

FY Yes, 8ir, it was upstairs, it was a tri-level 

8 hig wag the northeast bedroom upstairs? 

9 Now, what, if any, property did you selge and 

audit? 

A Okay. The property that I seized was 5600 in 

Ea kn eurrency located in the purse of Brenda Hardy. The purse was 

Foi £0 gh Ps iE 

 



  

57
% 

Fu
r 

A 

suspected as marijuana was also 

ticClesky and Brenda Hardy were sleeping, there was approximately 

$260 

upstalrs., 

~
 

A 

tiiat room. 

underneath 

“ | & SE 
211 Uae 

Aigo 

her pregence. 

all ri ir! hte 

Yes, 8ir, 

anything else? 

Also less than one ounce of 

located 

Brenda Lee Hardy's purse? 

How apout 

A i. i fe LE ¥ p- - n "Y ™ tray. In the same 

currency, also in 

that taken from? 

was the northeast 

in the northeagt == 

the bedroom? What part of 

It was taken 

5665 in ny " 
Weis ALBO there 

any other objects? 

northeast 

Fy Ea gr a TES 
- 4 ah Lo $1 8 GE 

bedroom 

Ueda 

you inventory that money? 

substance 

in ha read in her purse. 

bedroom where Warren 

aii TOON 

of the residence 

from the top drawer of the bureau in 

gurrency taken from 

the piliow on the bed in the northeast upper corner 

£% bedroom occupled by Warren HMeClesky, also a .38 caliber gun, 

  

Bo you know the serial famber ?



  

That was also located in the residence in the Lo
 

or
 

goutheast corner bedroom in the nightstand drawer, 

¥ Whose bedroom was that? 

A ‘hat was the bedroom of the residence of the == 

let me see. This was the bedroom of Raymond L. Myers who was 

a resident at this particular house, 

W low, the money that was recovered from the top 

bureau drawer, was that in any particular object? 

A From the bureau drawer, what, sir? & 

3 You sald $260, was that laying in there loose? 

A Yes, sir, it was; it was just in the drawer loose. 

& How long did this search take, approximately? 

A The search took approximately three hours. 

4 And you inventoried all the items? 

A Yes, sir, I did. 

¥; And what did you do with those items after the 

search? 

A Okay. All the currency and the suspected marijuana 

were turned over to the Cobb County Sheriff's Uffice. The mari- 

Juana was booked into the property area pending the crime lab 

analysis, 

£2 Do you recall a vehicle being on the premises there 

that norning? 

A Yes, sir, it was a 1971 Pontiac Crand Prix, black J 4 4 

in celor., That was alse impounded by me as a suspected vehicle 

 



  

the 

4 

A 

time the 

warrant that vou 

Department? 

mation? 

A 

  

warrant wag 

0 any further. 

vehicle rE 
oF de 

rontiac Grand Prix. 

where was that? 

It was in the driveway of the residence at the 

served. 

And where that taken to? Wall 

It was taken to the impound lot of the Cobb County 

Department, 

Did you go with Warren McClesky to the Cobb County 

Department? 

Mo, 8lr, I 4id not, 

there later? 

did not, 

Your witness. 

y 2 Fn "TON Esa 4d LAE YY pa 
CR PE Pociuat #9. FORGE LRA A 

Isn't it a fact that the arrest and 

took out was initiated by the Atlanta Police 

Didn't they call you all and yi infor= a
]
 

& % be
 C 4.4
 

pe
 

Ye
w = & 

Re 2 Ap pt ah ets owas 308 ar ut 2 they responded Lo me, 

They responded to you? 

sketch 
» 

CORBoOsiLte 7 

: # 
own og ig we



  

and a description of the ocourrences 

ment and 

they wanted to 

A At that time they 

A NO 
LY; VERY » 

all executed the warvant? 

B I don't know 

88K tham, ave to 

Q Is it normal 

Powder Springs police to 

that happened in the 

¥ 3 RW 4 A In my 

4 0 Didn't that 

HO 7 5 i A 

do you? Is that what vou are 

A I don't 

WALLET « 

A I would 

involved. 

a) 

$d How officers “is . 
many 

in the past? 

  

yy . 2 

yg i % § FE 5 oh 84 
gh ve | bi) Si S$ p SE 3 ied = Fé 
Ro § 61 3) i i} ] ¥ 4 one oi be 

they went with 

for Atlanta police 

execute warrants? 

in 

it 

strike vou 

it didn't 

( Well, you don't know what 

to 

they responded to me, 

also 

4 oa a Bi ERC | PF a ff ped PE Tal 
3 ag HeClesky? 

ne F 

HOw 

your experience? 

nasn't happened As 

a we J ro “ 

strike 

went to search 

: v NH Ay 4 oo wy kin 5 a 

Was approx imately 

have 

tell 

officers 

th 

thelr interest was 

that 

thelr police depart 

you that 

when you 

te go with 

£ . PET 

times has MAny 

before. 

is tine? 

me as strange. 

with me on the



  

on 

A I don't understand the question, 

QO Have you ever gearched a house with fifteen 

officers before? 

A Bir, the fifteen vificers were not involved in 

the actual search, They were involved in the serving of the 

arrest warrant itself. 

4 All right, How many times have you served an 

arrest warrant with fifteen officers before? 

A in my experience, I have never served one with 

that many people before. 

(J Okay. Now, the money that you found, didn't 

Hr. McClesky tell you that he has just gotten an income. tax 

check back? 

A MO, sir. 

o He didn't talk to vou about that? 

A No, sir. 

La Po you know if he had a job? 

A HO, 8iv, I don't, 

8 Do you know if he had a bank account anywhere? 

Py
, 

ow
 oO -

 a
 

~ ® 

Q Do you know if it was his normal practice to keep 

this money in the house like that? 

& NO, Bir 

Q How, the gun that you found, that was soneone 

else's, wasn't it? That wasn't ¥Mr, McClesky's gun, was it? 

-350- 

 



  

Qe 

Fl A 

him? 

WER Ponh 

HeClesky 

all searching for three hours? 

three hours? 

c Yn Now 5 % Wt : oo Tp 4 Yes, What were you looking for? 

9 32 To oy 4 pore y XR wn : q . : £ We were looking for a diamond ying, a wedding 

# . of UE 

diamonds, we 

the wvict for weapons. 

vou didn't find any of that, 4id you? 

on that particular warrant. We 

4 WN checked, 

Pe ed Bh OF AE » a RG Ta A pe Bg hn oR. 

Okay. How, did you &ll take a picture of 

arrested hin t 

It's common procedure to take photographs, ye 

po. you have that picture with you today? 

gbtain that picture? 

rail £ Hf ob a “ DEEY Bhat was 

about his on that Can you tell me appearance 

found 

that day, when vou booked 

" 
Hg [ oe By HiT 

Gate? 

 



  

ne 

attend 

ment, 

That wa 

intends 

have Qn 

  

RELY 

naver got ap ¢ 

semen & 

custody 

wethi § 

bt coo Bn poy Fo 
cus tod Ve 

th & Er ? 

Ee 
& that 1 i 

Sat 

had 

Who would have of that picture? 

Of the photograph that was taken that day? 

Yes, ma'an, 

It would be at the Cobb County Sheriff's Depart- 

You all gave the car back, didn't vou? 

I don't know for a fact that it wag released, si 

8 held by the County Police Department, 

They don't have it now, do they? 

I don't know if they do or not, 

to IO 

MB. TURNER: Okay. Thank 

MR. PARKER: May this witn 

THE COURT: Any reason she 

Mie TURBER: Bhe may. 

THE COURT: You may be exc 

Call 

Re PAREER: 

™~ 

8 WW, 

“ % FRYE Y b? 4 3 . 

val COURT: I think after 

~358~ 

(831 2, 

131% 

POT 

id 
% wy 

ACUuBeu 

witness 

Lo 

 



  

qua ab " wir hn na take a recess for lu 

MR, PARKER: 7 

Tap 
AL 305] ® 

THE COURT: Al 

aT hen 3 vesit ha HINAW «3% py A Yid Lig 

Pr x ta PR RETR, | > on Ladies and gen 

lunch, activate 

it will turn on the 

door and the sheriff 

a when you are ready. 

Gentlemen, I w 

(Whereupon, 

and the proceedings 

THE COURT: Al 

(Whereupon, 

after which the foll 

walk COURTS Al 

EL, ™ ~ To 
Ale PRAYKSY 

a da 
HRs PARKER: 

witnesses have arriv 

Vi ® 

being first duly sworn, wa 

DIRECT 

BY MK. PARKER: 

G would you give 

  

the jury retired 

the jury returned 

We are checking to see if 

be rather 

1 right, we'll take & lunch recess 

d rather do that. 

tienen, when you ave ready to go to 

switch next to the light 

little n light over the jury room ¥ 

will take you to lunch. Let him kno 

ill excuse all of vou until 1:25. 

from the courtroom, 

were adjourned @ noon hour, ) 

1 right, bring the jury in. 

a to courtroom, 

OWlng proceedings were had,) 

% STR Ee 7 4 - ol e 'y > 3 sro rl 8 Call your next witness, 

two other 

ed before we go forward, 

a a VK Re ef Ad 
fie JOH aR Py 

en JEON TO TD 5 23 PORE. NT or ER | iE dn 2 ve 
8 examined and testified as follows: 

fh XA U8 lo Rl OW ul oF a NY 
EXAMINATION 

us your name, 

355m



  

¥ 

BH DateCtive We Ko JOWETrS. 

{J who do you work for, sir? 

A I'm employed by the City of Atlanta Bureau of S
 

Police Services ss a homicide investigator, 

{2 How long have you been with the police department, 

A I have been employed by the department for approxi- 

mately eight years. 

G And how long have you been in homicide, sir? 

BA I have been assigned to homicide for approximately 

three years. 

5, Detective Jowers, were you working on May the 13th, 

eB, 81ir. yo
y 

>
 

& And did you answer a call out to 993 Marietta 

Gtreet? 

3 
A, Yas 1 a

t
 

& Ws
 

-»
 

G Wnat 1s located there, sir? 

A At 993 Harietta Street is the Dixie Furniture 

£ ig that the northwest section? 

A Yes, sir, northwest, City of Atlanta. 

Qo Ig that lotated in Fulton County, Georgia? 

| ¥ Now, approximately what time did you arrive, sir? 

 



  

& 

energency vehicle from the 

I was 

and that he was being 

# 

ocgeurred, 

Officer Walker who originally received 

to assist him on 

later advised 

Approximately 1620 hours. 

And what did you observe when you got there? 

when I first arrived on the scene, I observed an 

fire department leaving the scene, 

that the vehicle contained Officer Schlatt 

transported to Grady demorial Hospital, 

Bir? What time was thig, 

It was about 1820, 

Are you sure of Chat? 

I'm sorry. The time that the call, the offense 

it was 1415 hours. She offense report was made by 

the call, I went there 

the call. 

All right, sir. What time then did you arrive, 

approximately? 

po 
Fi) 

aa 

vehicle 

£2 

of ime 
29486 the 

A 

  

It was approximately about 2130, somewhere in thére & o£ 

1430 hours. 

sir? what time is that, 

”y 

That's about 2:30, 

The ambulance or the fire vehicle, emergency 

was leaving at that time? 

Yes, sir. 

Row, were there any other police officers there at 

from homicide with vourself? 

At that time it was just Detective Walker and nvself.



  

The crime scene had been secured by Bergeant Paschal of the 

Robbery Sguad. 

¥, All right, sir. How, were some l.D. technicians 

A Yea LE b% _ y Sir. 

{ And do vou know who they were? 

A Begausge it was a very large area, we had been 

advised that we could call the Georgia State Crime Lab. The 

Georgia State Crime Lab was called to the scene tO assist in 

processing and checking evidence. 

And did they respond, too? 

A Yen, sir. 

Q low, what part then did you -- what is the first 

thing vou did after you got there, sir? 

A I immediately attempted to secure all the evidence 

or anything that appeared to De evidence, and to get complete 

control of the crime scene. After this was done, 1.0. 

technicians from the City of Atlanta came in and they began 

to process by taking pictures that were supervised by myself. 

J All right, six. Where was Detective Walker at this 

tine? 

OK&y Detective Walker, he was outside, he Was 

wo
 

canvassing the area on the outside. He was attempting to 

trace the route that they had been advised that the perpetra=- 

tors had fled. 

Ay 

 



  

gLore 

those 

along 

someone who was present when three 

building fro 

ments 

point 

the phtographs taken there 

there, 

Did vou talk to a number of witnesses in the 

Bir? 

Yes, sir. 

And did you later obtain statements from some of 

withegses? 

with 

% 5 
| 

taken, 

A 

£3 
- 

on nay 

control and 

Exhibit 

~e later 

b % 

umber 2 

Yes, sir, 1 did. 

Pid this include all 

Yes, sit, all of the employees that were present, 

we obtained an additional statement from 

Of the suspects entered the 

PB the loading docks 

All right, sir. How, where were all of these state~- 

down at the Atlanta Police Department? 

Tes, Sir. 

vere all of these people then transported at sone 

13th, 19782 

sir, all of the emplovees., 

How, Detective Jowers, 1 believe you said that all 

were taken under your direction, 

supervision? 

All right, sir. I call your attention 

and ask you what that represents, 

COURT: What 1s the nuunber? LS 50 Wl 2 
a a x 

Pg i -  P 4 bs Bc ag 

BXniplt Bumber <y 
ES Pap TA ERTIES a cao oon § me 

Hie PARKER: state's 

 



  

Furniture Company 

in front of the 

ME» o { By 

accurate photograph 

9 «9 1] 

1 Y 38 FB LT 

MRe PARKERS 

Your HONnoOY. 

" Fig % HEE Bi ¥ 

COURT: 
eh 

i 3 § IA 

without cbijection. 

COURT s 

{2 (By Mr. Parker) 1 show you what has been marked 

as Btate's Exhibit Bumber 3 and ask if you can ldentify that 

for us? 

A Yes, sir, this is a picture of the Dixie Furniture 

Company at 993 Marietta 

Dixie 

Parker) 

Street. 

This pleture shows the Dixie 

it was photographed while standing 

Furniture Company. 

All right, sir. Is that a true 4d 

ad 

a8 the scene existed on May the 13th, 

The State moves that into evidence, 

Bo objection. 

State's Exhibit Humber 2 is 

It was photographed as 

you step into the door near the area that had been partitioned 

off, and it's showing the view from the front to the rear. 

Q Was that taken under vour control and supervision? 

A Yes, sir. 

{ Does that reflect how the inside of the Dixie 

Furniture appeared 

 



  

MRe PARKER: The State moves Exhibit Number 3 

into evidence, Your Honor, 

Rs TURNER: Bo objection. 

PT: State's Exhibit Number 3 is admitted 

™ 

without objection, 

von Bk 

HR. PARKER: May I present that to the jury? 

a rare ba : 
THE COURT: {€HB, HiT. F 4 

Ville PAREKRLM?2 I believe State's Exhibit Number 4 

e
d
 een admitted, Hay I present that to the 

THE COURT: Yom, sir. 

# {By #r. Parker) What does State's Exhibit Number 5 

represent, Detective Jowers? 

A It shows the inside of the Dixie Furniture Company. 

It was photographed approximately at the exact location where 

the puddle of blood and Officer Schlatt's revolver was recovered 

Lom. 

4% Looking in which direction? 

A Standing in the front and facing to the rear. 

€ Does that show the office area back there? 

A Yes, sir, there is an office area in the rear, and 

it show 8 the furniture and the lamps that were somewhat blocking 

£% Pe a » i F - Xn an iy i Ror an so i THe ” Fo 3 4 
8 I show vou what has been marked as State's Exhibit 

-365= 

 



  

Humber 6. Have you seen that before, sir? 

A Yes, sir. 

0 And what does that represent, sir? 

A This is a close-up of the shirt that was worn by 

Officer Schlatt and on the photograph, on the shirt, it in- 

dicates the bloodstainsg that was on the officer's shirt and 

also an area over his right shit pocket -- correction, his 

left shirt pocket where a possible projectile penetrated the 

hirt. on
 

(J Did you find anything in that shirt pocket? 

A Yes, sir, we did. We found a cigarette lighter 

and a pack of cigarettes, and there were indications that a 

projectile had struck the cigarette pack along with the 

cigarette lighter. 

$ Cid you actually observe the cigarette lighter, 

TN
 yw
 =
 

La
 

po
nt
 

he
 

y a
 

&®
 

) ¥ And can vou tell us what condition it was in when 

you observed it? 

A Yes, sir. The cigarette lighter had been damaged 

plastic cigarette lighter, constructed 

with plastic, and I think it was clear plastic with a green in 

color. 

() And was that damaged in any way? 

A C83. Bir» 

 



  

£ $v ay gk odor 1 JR 
| % EY f WHE pA 4 BR £5 4 Sat <3 £263 ? 

portion where the fluid would A It wag damaged at the j 

be contained, in that area. 

oJ How was lt damaged? 

A It was chipped, it had been chipped. It was plastic 

and it had been chipped on the side of it, 

os
, 

(
 

WF
, Was that shirt recovered by you, sir, in State's 

6 And is that a true and accureéete representation of 

how the shirt logked? 

Fike PAREER: The State moves into evidence State's 

Exhibit Bumber 6. 

THE COURT: State's Exhibit Number 6 is admitted 

{J (By Mr. Parker) Ilicw about State's Exhibit Number 7, 

what does that represent, sir? 

A Okay, Number 7, it's a photograph taken while in 

the Homicide Office at the Atlanta Police Department. It's the 

shirt that was worn by Officer Schiatt. It contained bloodstainsg 

and a detailed torn area on the left pocket indicating where a 

projectile passed through the top flep of Officer Schlatt's 

shirt. 

38 7- 

 



  

% % 3% sea Bows 5 y ade. gem $= Bu ma Bn wn Rn ah i be ror we a i RA w an Tan oy don § Se 8 Eh 
9 Ali Y¥ igh Ce Ad was that FROCTOQU LAD taken under 

your control and supervision? 

¥, Poes that truly and accurately reflect how the 

shirt looked the day the photograph was taken 

MRe PARKER: The State moves into evidence State's 

Exhibit Humber 7. 

HRs TURNER: No objection, 

THE COURT: State's Exhibit Humber 7 is admitted 

without objection. 

¥ (By Mr. Parker) 1 show you what is marked as 

State's Exhibit lumber 8 and ask if ou can tell us what that 

A OKavV. This shows a close-up of the blood where X & 

Officer Schlatt's body was found, and to the right side there 

lg & green velvet sofa where a projectile was recovered by the 

Georgia State Crime Lab. This was photographed while facing 

in a southerly direction, 

NE Pe 5 
{J shiich side ig == 

gon 3a PREPS. Ag fo Sr rays $n ws 3 a Q AS you go down the front aisle? 

A Az you are walking from the front to the rear of 

the building, the sofa was located on the right-hand side near 

the aisle. There was a carpet area and the aisle wag of tile. 

 



  

a
e
 

Na
d Were you present when that projectile was removed, 

Mi, PARKER: The State moves into evidence State's 

Exhibit Bumsber 8. 

MR, TURNER: No cbjection. 

THE COURT: State's Bxhibit 8 is admitted without 

¥, (By Mr. Parker) I show you what has Deen marked 

as State's Exhibit Number 9 and ask you if you can tell the 

jury what that represents? 

A This photograph was photographed of the loading 

dogk at the Dixie Furniture Company. Two of the employees 

that were present when three of the suspects entered the 

building, I asked them to stand back in the exact location 

they were standing, and I positioned myself to the -- between 

the wall and the truck, and this photograph was taken while 

standing at the rear door at the loading dock at the Dixie 

Furniture Company facing out, The two employees here ave 

at the exact location where they said they were standing 

when they first observed the three subjects coming around the 
wr - 

5; Was that taken undey your control and supervision? 

Le GO Does that truly and accurately represent the truck 

 



  

and the loading dock as it appeared on Hay the 13th, 19787 
A vos ¢ 8B ir » 

Mike PAREER: the Btate would nove into evidence 

State's Exhibit Hunber 9. 

g (By Mr. Parker) i show you what has been marked 

as State's Exhibit Number 10. Can you identify that, sir? 

A Yes, sir, this is a photograph of the loading dock. 

This was taken while standing out in the parking area facing 

back to the door that is used to enter the building. It also 

shows a part of the truck that was parked at the doading dock 

on May the lith. 

iJ And was that photograph taken under your control 

and supervision? 

A Yes, Sir. 

* Does it truly and accurately reflect that portion 

i 4 4 3 y Xa 4 iiture Company on May the 13th, 13787 & a
p
e
 

| 5
 

fo
b 

> 
a 

iB £+
 

=
 

MR. TURNER: No objection, 

EX: The State would move into evidence 

State's Exhibit Humber 10, Your Honor. 

THE COURT: Admitted. 

{ 

ad 
# (By Myr. Parker) 1 show you what has Deen marked 

ag State's Exhibit Number 11 and ask if you can identify that? 

~370~ 

 



  

A Okayes This shows a man's black leather jacket 

hat was first observed by me lying in the == what 1 consider 

the storage room where the safe was located. It was lying in 

front of the safe, and upon closer examination of the black 

leather jacket we found two shotgun shells, red in color, in 

the pocket of the jacket, This jacket was removed, and this 

Lu
do
 

acket was later identified as being the property of Hr. Barold 

\& Was that photograph taken under your control and 

the floor there on May the 13th, 1978? 

A Yes, 8ir, it's in the exact position that I first 

observed the jacket, 

0 You say it had two shotgun shells in the pocket? 

Yes, sir, it had two shotgun shells, red in color, 

goeid and red in color. They were 410 shotgun shells. They 

were in the 

¥, Will you tell the jury what .410 means? 

3A Nat sis vy of hae $ " wl By ay &£% YY £2 on Br v | ar Fo oy § & 2 3 of “ # Yeu is B1lr it's the gauge of the shotocun it's a 
¥ 4 ws Fd - F 4 

small IE UCIE . 

HR. TURKER: SO objection, 

2A THEIrEIS 
Ad AE 8 4 ® 

aby LL The State moves into evid Fe
e 

Exhibit Number 1l. 

wy 3 

 



  

BeniS. 

Fa 

the safe was 

jacket. .1Iit 

facing 

{J 

» 

A 

it appeared 

Exhibi 

Court and Jt 

  

Exhibit 

{By Mr. Parker) I ask you to look at 8 

12 and tell the Court and jury what that repre- 

Okay. This is a picture of the agtorage room where 
w 

located, also where we located the black lestherx 

shotographed while standing near the front door 

Pe
nd

 

pack into the area inaide the storage room. 

ke wa fon - ada uy $e UB 3 ar % % ad pe 2 i wy it shows what, the depth ©L the room? 

LL Yes, ite 

Poes that truly and accurately reflect the room as 

8) vou On aay the i3th, 

Yes, sir. 

that taken vour eontrol and superv Wan 

I supervised the shooting, 

La iy i) TEx YY i Vy, TONER gen B 

Re TURBER: RO objection. 

BE el I a AL PEs x £F Gu wa fo i a a as o gi A a TORT g 
Miley FARKEERS he State moves into evidence State's 

t Munber 12, Your HONDO. 

oy 

THE COURNS Admitted, 

" Pon a TET ENT Sa 
3 BROW een mares ) 

13 

a Joa ps BE TTR SEL oF (By Mr. Parker you 

Hunber and ask you if vou can tell the 

2 
- what that represents 

fad, Lhis 18 a photograph Of a glove that was 4304 

-= Gorrection, on a cabinet that was located



  

directly in front of the safe. This glove was identified as 

having been used by one of the perpetrators that had entered 

the Dixie Furniture Company. 

{J And wag that photograph taken under your control 

and supervision? 

A Yes, sir, I supervised the shooting of this photo- 

¥ Was that glove found by vou, sir? 

A ¥eg, sir, it was recovered by the =-- there by the 

Georgla State Crime Laboratory. 

# poes that truly and accurately reflect how it 

appeared on May the 13th, 19787 

A It does, 

HMRe PARKER: The State would move into evidence 

State's bBxhibit Number 13, Your Honor. 

HR. TURNBR: Ko objection, 

THE COURT: Admitted without objection. 

{ (By Mr. Parker) I show you what has been marked 

as State's Exhibit Bumber 15 and ask if you can identify that? 

A This 1s a photograph of the inside of the Dixie 

Furniture Company at 9293 Marietta Street. This picture was 

photographed while standing in the area, near the area where 

the employees had stated that one of the suspects was standing 

This picture was taken from the rear facing to the front of the 

store, It shows the front door =-- correction, part of the front 

 



  

door and the partitions that were in front of the store about, 

and it also shows the furniture that was there, and it was 

also taken to try to show how complicated it was and the diffi- 

culties we were having by seeing in the store. 

8) By what? 

A By seeing in the store, The visibility was very 

bad because of the lamps and the furniture in there, it was 

very bad, and we were trying to show this because we couldn't 

do this in a drawing. 

Q Was that taken under your control and supervision? 

A Yes, sir, it was taken by IlI.D., technicians super- 

vised by myself. 

£3 Does that truly and accurately reflect the conditions 

of that store on Hay the 13th, 19787 

A Yes, Biv. 

MR. TURNER: At this time I would have an objec- 

tion based on the fact that the detective states that 

this picture represents where the -- some of the witnesses 

that testified or someone in terms of being the culprit 

was standing. I think the testimony itself is the highe 

and beat evidence, and this is a very poor representation 

of that. There is no opportunity to cross-examine in 

terms of foundation. We haven't found out what witness 

OY anything else, I think if this is admissible at all, 

& better foundation should be laid first. 

-374~ 

 



  

ORE COURT: I will mark it tendered anc not 

on its admissibility now. 

MR. PARKER: “he State moves into evidence State's 

Exhibit Humber 15. 

THE COURT: I will mark it tendered but I will give 

him a chance to cross-examine the witness first. 

J (By Mr. Parker) I show you what has been marked as 

State's Exhibit Number 17. Can you explain that to the Court 

and jury? 

A This was taken of the inside of the Dixie Furniture 

Comuany at 993 Marietta Street, It shows a puddle of blood, 

along with the two ink pens that have been ldentified as being 

the property of the officer, handeulfs, and a towel that had 

been placed under his head. It also shows the green velvet 

sofa the projectile was recovered from. This photograph was 

taken while standing in the aisle in the front of the atore. 

was that taken under your control and supervision? 

A Yes, sir, it was taken by I.R. technicians from 

the City of Atlante and I supervised the shooting. 
& 

AR ©
 fo
 i 

rT
 

a oF
 

o
r
 

we
 

4 ooo
d 

there on May the 13th, 1978 

A It does, 

ik. TURNER: bo objection. 

Re PARKER: the State would move inte evidence 

a -y 
i \d 

  

ly and accurately reflect the conditions



  

THE COURT: State's Exhibit Humber 17 ig admitted 

without objection, 

@ (By Mr, Parker) 1 show you what has Deen marked 

as State's Exhibit Number 18 and ask if vou can identify that, 

sir? 

EA Yes, six, this is a close~up photograph of a puddle 

of blood that we observed in the Dixie Furniture Company at 993 

Marietta Street, It shows the handcuffs, the two ballpoint 

pens, a towel that had Deen placed under the officer's head and 

also the officer's revolver. This photograph was taken while 

standing in front of the velvet sofa where we recovered the 

projectile and facing across the aisle at the revolver, 

2 Did you examine that revolver? 

A Yes, sir. 

{J and what condition wag it in, sir? 

A We found that it contained six live rounds that 

had not been fired, 

&) That had what, sir? 

A Six rounds that had not been fired, 

{ And how many rounds does that weapon hold, sir? 

p3 A six-shot revolver, 

MR. PARKER: The State moves into evidence State's 

« 

Exhibit Humber 18, Your Honor. 

+ TURNER: Ho objection. 

THE COURT: Admitted without objection. 

 



  

i (By Mr, rarker) low, Detective Jowers, did you 

take part in the search warrant and arvest warrant in Cobb 

ounty on Hay the 30th, 197867 

& And were vou one of the Atlanta officers that was 

represented, sip? 

A Yes, sir. 

0 were there other Avlanta officers besides yourseli? 

A Yeu, Bir. 

2 And who were those, sir? 

F. It was Detective W, A, Harris from homicide, 

Sergeant McConnell from homicide, and Bergeant MeClure from 

rObLEYY 

* All right, sir. Approximately how many officers 

total, as you recall, were present at that time? 

A Well, it wes approximately fifteen police officers 

that were there, 

{d I show you what has been marked as State's Exhibit 

Number 22 and ask if you can identify that, sir? 

A Yes, sir. This is a photograph of the defendant, 

Mr. Warren McClesky. This photograph was taken by the Cobb 

County Police Department on the date that they made an arrest 

at his home at 16d James Street, Marietta. 

CG Yhat date was that, sir? 

¥ 4 58 au AE an 45 = Ty £3 I £3 gr € "7 52 
£4 il Was on nay tue SUL, 1978, 

~377- 

 



  

£0 Did vou observe Hr, HeClesky on that date, six? 

LF on 04 ps 3 pw 
YEE, Bile 

i Did he appear to look as State's EBExhibit Humber 22 

A Yes, gir. He was wearing the same clothing that this 

picture shows, He was wearing those clothes when I first observed 

hime. 

2 And that photograph wag taken where, sir? 

A in Cobb County by the Marietta Police Department, 

Q Is it a true and accurate representation of 

Hive MeClesky on that date? 

A Yes, sir. 

Q What time of day was that taken, approximately, 

“ Lf you know 

We stayed up at Marietta until that afternoon, so it was ==. 1 

think the picture was photographed sometime around hoon, 

Now, while in Marietta, sir, did vou have a conver- 

gation with Mr. McClesky? 

A I did, sir. 1 asked permission to interview 

re I asked 1f he didn't object to talking to me, 1 

{ Who dic YQ 4 sk PETMIERION 

A I asked the Cobb County authorities because they 

A “his ~=- he was taken into custody early that morning. 

 



  

objections to me interviewing him in connection with a 

robbery and homicide that occurred in the City of Atlanta, 

the Officer Schlatt case on #May the 13th. They stated they 

did not have any objections, 

AL that time I went into the room where 

Mr. HeClesky was later brought to that location. At that tine 

I identified myself and I advised him what case 1 was working 

on, and 1 asked him did he have any objections to answering 

any questions. He was =-- at that time he was given a waiver 

of counsel which he signed, and I asked him if he objected to 

making a written statement. He stated, "io, 

{J What type of waiver of counsel was given him? 

A He was allowed to sign a walver indicating that he 

understood his rights that are guaranteed under the Constitution. 

{J Do you have a Copy of that, sir? 

A Yes, Sir, i Ce 

9, what specific rights did vou advise Wr, McCléesky of? 
© ww - “ 

all right. The form that we used is the form that Fo
ng
 

a 

is used in Cobb County. We used cone of their forms, we didn't 

have one Of our forms; however, it states at the top, it states, 

"Your Rights," and then it goes into your rights. 

"Before we ask you any questions, you must under- 

stand your rights, 

"You have the right to remain silent. 

“Anything you say can be used against you in court. 

 



  

You have the vight to talk to a lawyer for advice 

before we ask you any questions and to have him with you during 

questioning. 

"1 you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be appointed 

for you before any questioning if you wish. 

"If you decide to answer questions niow without a 

lawyer present, you will still have the right to stop answering 

at any time, You also have the right to stop answering at any 

time until you talk to a lawyer," 

ol All right, sir. Is there anything else on that 

form? 

A Yes. At the bottom it has a "Waiver ol Rights," 

and -it states heye that, "I have read this statement of my rights 

and I understand what my rights are, I am willing to make. a 

statement and answer uestions. I do not want a lawyer at this 

time. I understand and know what I am doing. HO promises or 

threats have been made to ne and no pressure or coercion of any 

kind has been used against me." 

It then has a location where he can sign it. It 

has "Signed," and Mr. McClesky signed, "Warren McClesky". 

it was witnessed by myself, Detective Jowers, and 

witnessed by Sergeant Cross of the Cobb County Police Depart- 

ment, and it was timed at that time at 9317 A.M. on the morning 

of May 30th, 1578. 1 also asked what was his educational level 

and he stated twelfth grade. I asked him was he married, and 

~380= 

 



 
  
 
 
 

 
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he will stop after he gets into the statement of what 

was sald and I will get a chance for cross-examination, 

and then he will bring the other guys on. 

HRs PARKER: Then I can come back 80 we can release 

hem, 

“ile TURKERS: I have no objection. 

(Whereupon, the following proceedings continued in 

open court and within the hearing of the jury.) 

Mie. PARKER: Your Honor, with the Court's permission 

and with counsel's concurrence, I intend to delete sone- 

thing in the statement. 

THE COURT: Is that agreeable, Hr. Turner? 

$R« TURNER: Yes, it is, Your Honor. 

THE COURT: All right. Proceed. 

{ (By Mr. Parker) Would vou mark and omit that, 

please? 

#, Just mark on it, cross through it. 

hos
 

3
5
 

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[31
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(d JUSEL Cross through thats 

Bow, following the adviging of Hr. HeCleshky's 

rights in Cobb County, did he give you a statement, sir? 

A Yes, sir. 

 



  

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vas a Sergeant McConnell present during part of 

fen, sir, he was present, along with Detective 

‘ TR fon > wi Pe ” Ed a 2 Bh SAL 
BOW atout Detective hMoLiure, Sip? 

that duril the guestioning, 

1 Tas . - : Be w w “» Be Wh ed FW, * oy % 4 wie Es &F on ir by ~ "4 ar op t Detective Harvis and myself and Warren McClesky 

with Bergeant Cross just listening in. 

Betrgeant dclonnell, was he there at the time the 

8 given? 

Yes, sir. He was in the building, Yes, Sir. 

# 
tow about in the room where Mr. 

Sir, I don't recall 

pe 
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= a | j SRO, fr ane Ne pn RR BY : Be Po a i PR Yes, sir. We had -~ there was another young lady 

bergeant McConnell was talking to, he 

interviewing 

L 

AC TAY hE «lod iy Cie we 1s - TH SE RES RS arn ) ans COURTS Se PETACL, Had YOu Tinlisned your 

oy he a, | A oon be Bx ia $ RE 0 & 3 a PETRIE 

on? bid you list the people in the room? 

~383= 

 



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JT OO oT [ER 
SOCAL E HK ein

? 

F
g
 4 

"Harris: 

MeCleskys 

7 I NR ey Harriss 

WilgClasn Ky 

"iowers: 

"Harriss 

"MeCleskys 

of Ben's girl friends 

house? 

pos 

friend of 

  

¥Harviss 

*HeClesky 

"Harris: 

Baird gu qu loss HeCleskys 

At ny 

AL your 

well, 

Aadress? 

1064 J 

PO you 

BG 

Lo you 

Hava 

I can’ 

Sunday for dinner, 

"Harriss 

"HcClesky s 

RJowers:s 

Lane 

Fe ro 

188 

HOW Long 

Le 

H ~ Hd 

Know 

nane 

OT 

KROW 

you 

house . 

nousea? 

sister's house. at my 

“iin AE abe ££ 
Smaes Oo 

now Jimny Lee Peters? 

now 

Mary Jenkins? 

sounds ene 

mistaken. 

where Mary Jenkins lives? 

lives in 

aver been to 
EE og swe 
Lary 

I have, 

t remember the date, same 

ohe 

sunaav? 
“ 

aque wag that? 

242 & - i ho Sc



  

MeCleskys It's been about a couple of months, 

would say a couple of months. bet
 

I guess, 

"Harris: Have you ever been to Mary Jenkins' house 

on any other occasion besides the one you just told us about? § 
" 

> "MocClesky: Huh-uh [negative]. 

"Harriss What was the name of the young lady who 

was in your bedroom this morning when we served the warrant? 

"HeClegkyt Brenda. 

Harrie: Brenda what? 

"rMeCleskyt I don't know = I think her last name ls 

Holden. Bhe's not my girl friend. 

"lowers: ls Brenda related to you? 

"HcCleskys Bo, 

Blowers: What is she to you? 

"MeCleskyt Just a friend, 

"Jowers: Is she your girl friend? 

a friend « we associate with each Aa
d & 44
 pi
 

4 "MeClesky 

other sometime -~ I have other girl friends I do the same thing 

withe I don't go with anyone dy, vou know, 

*Jowers: Why did you tell us earlier that you and 

Brenda was saving your money to buy furniture for your new 

apartment? 

MoCleskys Why did I tell you that? Because that 

was the truth. 

"Jowers: Where are you employed at nows 

556 

 



  

"reCleskys Dover Elevator. 

"Jowers: Do you know Willie Robinson? 

PacClegkys Yes. 

"Jowerss Who is the owner of the money that ve 

found in your bed this morning? 

"MeClesky? Who is the owner? He. 

"Jowerss How much money was under your plllow? 

b 

"MeClesky: BPoproximately - I can't say right off 
“ 

- approximately $1200 = $1300. 

"Jowerss Do you always Keep such a large amount of 

money under your pillow? 

"HeClesky: Well, my last withdrawal from the bank, 

Ho
mi

 

1 withdrew $560, dke before I took this job with Dover Elevator, 

I was drawing unemployment checks and cashing them and saving 

money, I don't pay rent where I'm at. I usually give then 

something. I don't have any bills = really the money I make is 

clear. I don't have to put in bank or should be able to keep it. 

Sometimes I have cash on band like that if I have something I 

t. Just like when I bought my car. I had a fo
de

 

plan to do with 

check for $1500 put into my account,” 

Q {By Hr. Parker) stop right there. 

A Correction == 

(& Stop right there, 

PLREKER: Your Honor, with counsel's permission, 

I am deleting something fras the statement. 

 



  

All right. 

is agreeable, Your Honor. 

THE COURTS 

‘hat 

would you pick up where you 

MRe TURNER: 

18 crossed out. 

like that if I have 

Parker) 

hand 

when 1 bought ny car. 

Q (By Mr. 

gir, and delete that which 

Sometimes I have cash on 

Just like 

Blank. "That's 

please, 

44 

it. 

found 

A 

te do with { plan 

check for 51500 put in my account.” 

that the that was 

hey right now. 

X noney 

to be used for the purpose of buying 

something 

a 

here I got the 

"Harriss Is Brenda aware 

the fact that I was 

was aware that 

in your bedroom was supposed 

furniture and getting an apartment? 

She may not be aware of 

but she 

893 

"ieClesky: 

going to use that money for that purpose, 

Were you at the Dixie Furniture Company, 9 

We were going to get an apartient. 

remember distinctly 

arris: 

1578. 

LE 
A 

i 3th, 

I ¢an 

Marietta Street, on May 

"HeCleskys Bo, I wasn't. 

was at, but 1 wasn't in Dixie Furniture Company. 

Were you anywhere near the Dixie Furniture 

where IL 

“Harris: 

icCleskys: Mo, 

Bid you p 

on that date? 

LL 

"Harris: 

the robbery and subsequent shooting which occurred at the Dixie 

I wasn't, 

articipate or have any knowledge of 

Jonpany { 
r 

i 

Furniture Company on May 13, 19787? 

I wasn't, "reCleskys 

 



  

"Harris: Did you have a shotgun in your possession 

on Saturday, Hay 13, 19787 

seCleskys Bo, 1 didn't. 

"UJowers: Has anyone given vou a black coat in the 

past three weeks? 

"HcClesky: NO. 

"Jowers: Jlave you discussed with anyone the robbery 

and the shooting of a police officer that occurred at the Dixie 

Furniture Company? 

"McClesky: Ho, I haven't, In fact, I haven't sven 

discussed it with anyone really. I read it in the paper. 

"Jowers: Has anyone promised you or threatened you 

to induce you tu answer these questions, to nake a statement? 

fJowerss Were vou advised of your Constitutional 

rights and do you understand them? 

and answer session, 

MRe PARKERS Your ‘Honor, with the Court's permission, 

I would like to ask Fr. Jowers to step down and put up 

two more withesses and then bring him back. 

THE COURT: All right, Any objection? 

MRe PARKER: I believe he wants to cross-examine 

first, I'm sorry, Your HOnor, 

4) THE COURT: After the cross-examination you want this 

 



  

Wwlitness 

¢™
 

Pe 24 HM de Foam open wo 
Lie Atianta 

A 

Company. 

£3 

A 

5
 7 

= 

  

AE A 8 

Yow RE ER Rh BE 4 Be 
id% e FARK Yes, BAL 1 

THE COURT: All right. Proceed, 

CROSBS-EXAMINATION 

LE 

Were you one of the first officers on the scene on 

Chay. Isn't it a fact that one of the first things 

Police Department did wes arrest one of the employees 

ang charge him with the crime? 

HO one wag taken into custody? 

All right, Do you recall the individual who used 

patrol car to go and get help? 

a?
 

| 

What is his Name 

He was employed by the Dixie Furniture 

Hig 
Grier. 

he held as a spect in that 

~390~



  

Cage? 

A Ho, sir, not to my knowledge, no. 

$ When you gay == okay, Didn't he go off in the 

police car? 

A Yes, Sir. 

% and coming back wasn't he detained and questioned 

and put under arrest? 

p22 sir, I was, you know, when the officer -~ Officer 

Walker was really the investigting officer, and there was no 
a 

arrest made by Detective Walker or myself. 

0 What about 

A I understand he w 

mately a block from that location and he 

wo Boe ag 

CHaryges., 

Gl Jugt a copy for t€ 

A Ye8, 81Y. 

QO Okay, How, in te 

tnat month, isn't it true tha 

corresponded with Powder bpri 

execution of the warrant? 

Sir, I am not tha 

warrants. I was at hone, + 1 

that & warrant would be execu 

along to interview one of the 

: see was there any involvemen 

  

Lh 83 

uniform officers? 

as involved in an accident approxi- 

was given a copy of 

he accident? 

rug of executing a warrant later 

t the Atlanta Police Bepartment 

ngs in terms of arranging that 

[4 t familiar with the make-up © 

vas I was called and advised 

ted and that they wanted me to go 
g 

suspects, if it was possible, to 

with cur case.



  

whether 

Powder Springs 

bw
 

2
 

Fo
 

you gone 

anyone 

(8! 

Then what vou are saying is, you don't know SRT 
1) ay * 

cther than you == well, you didn't arrange with 

execute that warrant, did you? 

oF 

sal you were just told to go along? 

Okay. How many raids or executions of warrants have 

in Powder Springs before? 

That was the first one, 

And vou say there were {ifteen officers there, 

There was approximately fifteen. 

Fow many raids or whatever have you sone along with 
- ® | - lf 

had fifteen officers executing a gsarch warrant before? 

Sir, 1 have never been involved with any =-- 

HOW 

answer to Lhe guage 

Lila 

where we had that many officers, to my 

had cases where there was eight 

  

haven't been involved in any case 

knowledge. We have 

to ten, but I don't recall 

Oe 

Let's EE Boy sia jo dar THI oF ae 4 : 

GO Lack to the Gay of the 

~392=



  

robbery for just a minute. Did you interview the witnesses in 

rniture store? WE
 terns of the employees at the fu 

& More: specifically, did you interview a Manle Thomas? 

0 Did vou ever have an occasion to take Hamie Thomas 

¢ 
BOMe PRICLTUYas,; 4 ¥ hotographic spread? 

& Yes, Sir. 

S; On June 2nd, 1978, right? 

A Yes, Sir. 

Q Okay. Whose pictures were in that? 

A The defendant, Harrven hicClesky. 

¥ iid she pick anybody out? 

3 How long did she look at the pictures? 

A she stared at the pictures and she never did say 

g, she just stared at them, I asked her did she recog- . £&
 

or
 

in
 

or
 

b
a
h
 

” 

-
 

jo
r hoe
 

bar
 

w
e
 

nize anyone, and she indicated no. 

& x vou have those pictures with you today; do you 

have them up there with you now? 

A 1 think the prosecution has then, 

MRe TURNERS Higa I ask the Prose Cultol for them? 

¥ (By Mr. Turner) While he is doing that, I think we 

can move on to something else. 

Did Mrs. Mamie Thomas ever tell you anything about 

-38 3m 

 



  

the suspect wearing glasses? 

) Yes, sir. 

i Is that in her statement? 

I can check, but I am sure she did 

apout glosses, 

x 
* ment who made the drawing. 

Ohave. Would that have been in her 

A I can check, 

Q would you look, please? 

A Yes, sir. Okay, I don't see anything 

4 viho took the statement from her. 

A Okay. The statement was taken by our 

homicide secretary, and it wag witne 

YELYYa 

gent at that tine? A Were you pre 

BAL « h
g
 

#
 FO Fi 

4 Did you ever go over that statement w 

A I went back to get a -- the date on 

at the Dixie Purniture Company, 

ety si % i PEA 8 on ’ FP i ¢ To gn " AR A $54 ya - p her a description of the suspects. There was a 1 

so 1 had to separate then, 

advised her not to talk to anyone 

become confused until she arrived at the 

How, on that date, on 5~13~78, 

describing gent out 

That was given to the artist at th 

gh GI 2 fon wien ro q ” a Oo gsed by Lieutenant WwW. 

would 

mention something 

0
 police depart~ 

gtatement? 

secretary, 

pd 

Loe 

Eb bugpan® 
ith her? ie 

the 13th, 

I went over with 

ot of con=- 

and at that 

there was 

an individual, wasn't 

 



  

there? 

A Yes, sir, they had several descriptions that were 

placed, 

9 Okay. Where did the geveral different descriptions 

come from? 

A The police officers that were taking all the infor- 

mation and people that were just stopping on the street that 

said they saw someone running from the scene. They started xk [ 

giving out those descriptions. 

a How many descriptions were given out then? 

A To my Knowledge, I recall one being given out, then 

later they gave out a different description, and 1 remember one 

of the officers came back and said, "Just pick up both of them 

if you see them." 

¥ Okay. How, what were those two descriptions? 

A One was given out, this wag from the tape that had 

been made on May the 13th, the tape recording of the conversa- 

tions between the uniform officers. I don't monitor that 

frequency. let me check and see what it was. 

All right. "Unit 55, you have it as a black nale, 

200 pounds, with brown pants and black shirt." The radio came 

back and stated, "Tall black male, glasses, black pants, bumpy 

complexion.” 

Q Ckay. Very good. 1 ask you if you can identify 

Defendant's Exhibit Humber 17 

 



  

2°
 A I don't know thew personally, no. 

{1 well, have you seen those pictures before? 

A Yes, these are the photographs that was used in 

the lineup that was viewed by drs. Thomas, 

8 Is Mr. McClesky's picture in there? 

A Yes, sir. 

Q And that is the picture she saw that day? 

A Yes, sir. 

0 All right, ‘Thank you. 

You made a comment a little while ago when you sald 

that Mr, MeClesky was in custody in Marietta. Let's go back to 

that for a minute. Isn't it a fact that the powder Springs 

\rrest was merely a pretext for the Atlanta Police Department 

to get thelr hands on Mr. HceClesky? 

A Bir, as 1 stated earlier, the only knowledge I have 

Of this was that I was called at home and I was advised to come 

in, that they wanted me to interview a suspect that Powder 

Springs was going to arrest on a robbery warrant, They wanted 

me to interview him and see was there any connection with the 

case here in the City of Atlanta, That was my only knowledge. 

3 flow, you said a little later or earlier in your 

testimony that Hr, HcClesky was allowed to sign a waiver form. 

is that your language, if I am quoting you correctly? 

A iI said he was allowed to sigan a waiver of counsel. 

£3 All rignt., When you say allowed, what do you mean? 

«396 

 



  

uw EF rn wa a Ae ey Le “ vox 3 PRT A re hy TS b PRR OVO RL: SR, te Sy EEA 
FA HE was given a waiver oi counsel. I asked his did 

% vu wo 1 oo » p NEE Te ” 2 SAE we gre © 3 fi rE 3 AON Wty gi ies PPORE 2 b kt We he object to answering any questions. He said no. 1 Baid, 

"Here, would you like to read over this and we'll go over it 

with you, if vou understand, and if you don't understand it, I 

will straight it up with you and we'll get it clear. If you 

don't want to sign it, vou don't have to, but if you want to, 

you can,” and at that point he signed it. 

{J whose ides was it to give him a waiver form? 

2 Mine. 

¢ why did you ask him to sign a waiver? 

A I have found as an investigator whenever questioning 

anyone in connection with any case, I always advise you of your 

rights. 

Fi
ne

s”
 

Ce Okay. But why 18 1t necegsary to sign a walver after 

be
 0 sad orally advised them? 

p. Sir, I always, 1 always allow you to sign a wailver 

> IIRL EA, : Bik ak r Tyr BO a A hs a ee 5 Cag “ . RTE —iidis RN va 
OL counsel even On a sinple battery or any casa I am connected [4 & po #3 

with; before I question you, I will give you an opportunity to 

sign a waiver Of counsgel, 

¥) The reason for that is so when you testify in court 

you don't have any problem with the statement, right? 

2 RI ou ap wo pn 
£4 iB, Bis 

i Now, insofar as the Yoom, can you describe that 

roow for us that you all were in? 

£5305 or 4 fe i A Okay, sir. 1 
nr 

IRAN Te RRR RT vg Re, ER HF. I TPN NE ep # 
Was the bergeant’'s Oillce That we were 

 



  

¢ HOw large is it? 

A I would gay it was about an edght by ten room. 

{J Small one? 

A HO, Bir. It had two desks in there and it had the 

file cabinet. 

¥ Okay. Who was in the room with vou? 

A AL the beginning we held & conversation with Warren 

-= Mr, McClesky, and when he made the statement, the statemént 

wap taken 

go % 

ht 

out to a 

ENE ls 
LB FINE hi >" 

Raa 

secretary who was located in the lobby. 

How, vou just sald Warren. Is that what vou 
r B P 

called him on that day? Are you. on a first name basis with him? 

A Hoe. "1 sald Warreh == Fre HeCleskye 

$] Well, what were vou calling him that day? 

A Mr. HeClesky, 

# You say how many people were in the room? 

A In what room, sir, are we talking about? 1 stated 

earlier that he was in a conversation prior to going to the 

secretary who typed the statement, We just —- 

¥; What kind of conversation =~ go ahead, 1'm sorry if 

you hadn't finished, 

A The conversation with the gentleman, discussing the 

case in 

£3 
3 

kL" 

record, 

Atlanta, 

a 

to talking about it. did he have any objections 

To 1 & 1 | AR meri gael {4 Ip Be OY Wis n ¢ od 3 ga vou all discussed it before you went on the 

it? 

 



  

A No, Bir. was on the record when I gave him the 

waiver of counsel. 

* Okay. But you say you had a discussion before you 

gave him the waiver of counsel, or am I wrong about that? 

A Yes, sir, prior to taking statements, 1 have found 

if 1 discuss the case, discuss what we are talking about, it 

gives me -- it helps me out when you are making the statement, 

80 at the end of the statement I can immediately go to my 

question and answer Session. 

¥ It also softens them up for the question and answer 

A I wouldn't have any idea, 

9; How long have you been going over statements before 

vou get them on the record? How long have you been doing that 

in your experience? 

A 1 always go over any statement anyone is going to 

make to me prior to sitting down to the typist, - 

Q All right, Why? 

A Bix? 

A i have found that it ezpedites matters better, 

% Expedites it how? I nean, if a person is making a 

statement, they are making a statement, right? 

A Yes, Bir. 

( They don't have to go over it before it in order to 

35 Ge 

 



  

give a statement to vou, do they? pe < ’ Ps 

£4 Sir, At 18 ny standard procedure to go over all my 

cases, any statement, prior to sitting down with the typist, 

Bp - 
Okay. Again, my question to you is, why you say 

It makes things easier? How does it make things easier? 
ot 

A I have found when typing, when we sit down and in &® e
a
 

this particular case, it was a guestion and answer session. It 

can help us move along because the guestions, I have & general 

idea what questions I want te ask him because of the conversa- 

tion that we have had prior to sitting down with the typist, “or - 

However, when we sit down with the typist and we start out, the 
w 
he 
d 

typist is typing and we are more or less trying to go over things 

there, where in this case it was a question and answer session, he 

wag not allowed to sit down and make a statement, it was a gues= 

tion and answer statement. 

OQ why wasn't he allowed to sit down and make a statement? 

A Because usually when we start off on a statement, I 

do not like to coach you through vour statement, and in this case 

I would have to give hin something to start off with, I couldn't 

just say, "At the shooting incident on that day would you please 

tell us about that." In this case it was a question and answer 

session, 

QO You say you don't believe in coaching, but isn't 

that what you do in the beginning when you have your cff-the- - 

p 3 a 3 we BR yw gi A 

FeQOrd conversations y 

 



  

a i de : : p ns 
hat LAG ah ROS QQaln 3g 3 

i v 

hy pid F BAY e 

with ig h, dq 
: wid A8 iL? 

A AB 1 stated eariler, sir, it's just a matter of 

discussing what we plan to question him about once we get with 

the typist. 

& Okaye How, when you started asking the questions, 

whe was in the roon? 

A ihre secretary and Detective Harris and myself. 

0 ORety« Now, how soon was this after he had been 

arrested? 

\ RF 2 FES HEE A am an “he pi Age ion} 
7 I0U pean the actual == 

J Yes, 

A it was about $3130 when we first started the inter 

View witn 11, Y 28 a 

y recall. It wag very early that 

$ Okay. B50 you all want around seven o'clock or soma= 

£2 ay 4 thing like that, just pulling that out of the air, is that right? 

A Noy sir, when we left, in fact, I never did discuss 

. ) ar Io TE TR ER FT ik BTR DONOR Ry BC 2 bo eT oe a oR BEA anything wilh Mr. HeClesky while at the 1064 James Street 

 



  

address. After we left that location, we were treated to 

breakfast at the Cobb County Police Department, and after they 

had stated that they had cospleted their phase of the investi- 

gation, I asked did the 

Mr. HeClesky, have any objections to talking to me and Detective 

Harris about the Officer Schlatt case in the City of Atlanta, 

# SO then when the statements were given, he was in 

the room with you and the two other officers and no friends, 

relatives or attorney, is that correct, just the three or four 

A it wasn't the -- more or less in the lobby with the 

secretary and Detective Harris and myself. 

¥ And he wag in custody? 

A He was in custody by the authority of Cobb County, 

{J Well, you all had already decided to take out a 

A Sir, this is the first time I have heard of 

Hr. MeClesky, Nr. Warren HcClesky, was on that morning, and, in 

fact, I didn't know his name until I arrived at the Homicide 

arrested, wasn't SH
 > 

-
 

=
 

= —
—
 “ A 

a Ww
 

5 a
d
 

—
 

oe
 - ot Li al the tive Mr. HcClesgks 

2 co-defendants also being arrested simultaneously here r,
 one of th 

in Atlanta? 

FEN LES BAle 

 



  

#4 

aware that 

S50 you all 

1 am aware that fo & A the 

an arrest was being 

wag being arrested, 

Q 

-= that part of the execution of 

in, as 

for me to g 

& MX. 

I stated 

sis 

HeCles 

How do you all 

Sir Py 

earlier. 

up to Harietta 

sky, and they would like 

and that was my involvement. 

FR 

%. 

you interviewed her the 

appearance, 

or talk to 

# 

  

just wanted to 

let's go back 

if you could tell? 

She was very upset, she 

Okay. When was this 

This was at the Dixie 

h i Okay. Did you interview her 

I returned, 1 

123%k wn dn Yo Pu EN ¢ RP RE aE ET a a 
witalt was her demeanor 

he was still upset, 

ANE i hb 2% 4) v Fig forget avout the 

arrest was 

Bae ¢ 

WR Sp. J SEN h 
COOrGinate 

the 

and that 

to Mamie Thomas 

Furniture 

In fact, 

@
 

made a dual strike, didn't you? 

and 1 an 

Gut I didn't know who 

the tine? 

I don't have any knowledge of that portion 

warrant. I was called 

I was advised that they would like 

& man would be arrested, 

for me to talk with him 

for a minute. When 

what was her attitude or 

she upget or nervous? 

was crying, she was very 

now? 

Company » 

subsequent occasions 

it was a few days #4 think 

then? 

x Po es ws BPS 

slie pald 

whole in¢ident.



  

¥ And what about the next time vou gaw her? Lo
 

A I went to the store several times on several 

OCCaBIONS 

i 0 she had an o¢casion to talk to you several 

. RE He © on $a $i TOE ~~ a ‘3: & = 5 

times, 1s that rigng? 

5 ry 

£4 AS25E 8 

|; Dkayv. Were you in court when we had the preliminary 

4 Rw pine HER Foam 3 da di BN » hearing for Mr. McClesky? 

L¥, Lid wou have an occasion Lo see Mrs. Thomas on that 

that was her deieanor or attitude then, if you 

could tell? 

A She was still very up 

# In court? 

A Bhe was crying as soon as she walked out of the 

courtroom, yes. When 1 saw her, she was Crying. 

{J Okay. Were you there when she testified? 

A i was not present in the room, no, sir. 

re 1G she ever mention to you that she was 

4 3 

having difficulty in texms of anything arising out of this 

 



  

¥% 

5. 

been in 

she told 

with her 

when she 

when she 

anvone 

Fo Tp Sg, | " ia dos Ay I Py a8 PE gn iat had came in the store, 

She told you that when? 

the cou: 

gre cane out of the courtroom. 

ad v Ya Lm Sa a Sr. ga FS 
430G YOU Go when she told yOu 

ged her that the time tO say 

| 

did you tell the District 

I told the City Solicitor, yes. 

| #0 TE Aq 5 
SRA id i you say to her after that? 

  

ated that -= she stated that the man in 

she wag 

that? 

that would have 

Attorney about it? 
“ 

After 

you that, do you know who else had any prior discussions 

about this 

told you 

saiag tnatl 

» oi TS 

casa y 

Te eg gv ga a 
fidn'ty did you have any? 

prior discussions? 

ST 1 ge “5 : 1 “3 ry BS 1] A & PN | % pr what she did, do you follow 

Her adnisslon vas wronde. 

Er BRE HE kd SIE RY a ar al AP 
whine isin LAE Ye GLTIREe. Chala 

FRE 

that particular discussion with you 

what 1 am saying, 

Lo you know if 

all the other 

 



  

% ( By 5 § 

9 4 ” [fi 3 RP pers ~ ie art Mrs. Thomas in conne 

the conversation oce 

Turner) Do you know if anvone interviewed 

ction with her conversation with you after 

urred? 

A Hot to my knowledde, no. 

0 Did vou talk to her? 

p Yes, sir. 

3 Okay. What did you talk to her about? 

A 1 advised her that if -- that no harm would cone 

to her if she would just tell the truth. 1 said that, "Ho one 

1 . 
15 | ¥: going to harm you 

say it; if not, then 

what did 

Ehe just 

to == she just start 

asked hey to go outs 

with us and I asked 

calm her down. 

# Pid you 

x 5 i Po a 
A oR a] § ak 

been on the Dixie Fu 

#" og wo 
v2 IES Re You 

tO perguade her to t 

A  § 5) ave n 

to tell the truth wh 

pach t 

$a astily 

iJ ¥ . I said, "If that is the man vou saw, 

gay it's not." 

she tell you she was afraid of? 

said she was afraid and she really wanted 

ed crying, and, in fact, 1 left her and I 

# 

ide. There was a young lady that was there 

her to take her outside and see could she 

talk with her after that date? 

sy I == as I have stated before, I have 

rniture Company case since this incident, 

ever go or did you ever undertake and try 

in court? 

ot tried to persuade her no more than sayin 

en you go to court. That is the-.only thing 

ire she would say, "1 am afraid; I am 

£3 
Bs £3

 

o 

 



  
VR ETT eR 

SGLEYaiGe 

W 

Gesk is 

would come 

to talk to 

would say, 

when this is over with, 

0
 

any? 

A 

joking 

ghip. 

up with 

is 

Je 

"1 just don't want to talk about it, I will be gl 

You hav 

  

anout 
n # 
aid you &ll have a 

Lach time I would go Furniture Company, 

¥ pve PRE Tw) Yo FR | 
Wn tie aisle, ang I located just as you 

in ghe would say, re not coming in here 

again,” you know, in a joking manner, and she 

go & 

I just want orget about it." 

What kind of relationship did you all build up, if 

wr 

I don't understand your question, please. 

You say that you all had some joking conversations 

conversation. 1 was just asking about your relation= 

2 seen and talked to her several times, right? 

ies, Bir. 

type of relationship, if any, did you build 

I built up a detective relationship with a witness, 

Are you all on & first name basis? 

I am on a first neme basis with a lot of people, sir, 

Brg. Thomas CLO ue. 

Including Mr. MceClesky? 

BNO, BiY. 

You are on a first name basis with him? 

307 

 



  

A Bo, sir, he is Hr. HeClesky. 

MEe TURNER: Thank vou, 

THE COURT: You may qo down, Detective, 

HRs PARKER: Call Hr. Cuendet, 

LOUIS &, CUEBRDET, 111, 

being first duly sworn, was examined and testified a follows: 

FRR © rod ght vr SCR TER TR OR TE DIRECT EXAMINATION 

Pe
st
 

a 
au

l 

(3 Woes 1&8 wry We 2 ve {8 Your rane { le SE a gx i | hdd would EY SEAVE Ads 2 HE AR fot ok ES BLY ¢ J F 2 ¥ 

A Louis A, Cuendet, III. 

2 Would you please spell vour last name for the court 

# CmUm ==, 

{J And wino do you work for, sir? 

A The State Crime Lab in Atlanta. 

Wowhere is that located? 

A Gn 959 East Confederate Avenue in Atlanta, 

3 what are your duties there, sir? 

A I am a latent print examiner. 

{J And can you tell us how long you have been with 

the crime lab? 

A I have been with the crime lab for five vears. 

#; Can you give ug some of your background and 

educational qualifications? 

A Prior to coming to the crime lab here in atlanta, 

 



  

I was employed by the F.B.I. in Washington, D.C., for five 

years. I went through the fingerprint school an was taught &t 

thie P.B.1. fingerprint school, which included eight hours a day, 

five days a week, and upon completion of the classroom training 

I was assigned to current work under close supervised training, 

after sik months you are under general supeyxvision for the rest 

of the time you are employed with the P.B.I. 

i have attended the advanced latent fingerprint 

school taught by the Georgie Police Academy; I have attended 

the two week seminar taught in Louisville, Kentucky, on 

criminal scenes and 1 am also a certified instructor in ink 

as well as latent prints to the Cecoryia Police academy. 

0 All right. On Hay the 13th, 1978, did you have an 

occasion to go to the Dixie Furniture Company? 

A Yes, sir, 1 did. 

®, And where were you at the time you got that call, 

sir? 

A I was at my residence, 

Q Did you proceed to that location? 

A Yes, sir, 1 did. 

#) Did you meot anyone else there, sic? 

A Yes, sir, ny partner at the time was Tony Rainey. 

I met bim at the crime lab and we net Jim Howard of the 

criminalistic section of the crine lab, and the three of us 

together went to the Dixie Furniture Company. 

g 4x £ 

ad 87 Sd 

 



     

   
   

     
   
    
   

   

   

  

    

(3 All right, sir. And what did you do when you got 

there, 
sir? 

a All right, sir. We -=- upon arriving at the scene, 

we took photographs and then started processing the scene [Or 

3 » 

jerprints and then assisted Jim Howard myself for latent fing 

with the colléction of trace evidence, which consisted of hairs, 

bullets, fibers, et cetera. 

{2 Bir, 1 ask you to take a look at bBtate's Exhibit 

object 

         

                 
          

   

  

A Yes, sir. There was a couch that was in the aisle- 

  

way not too far from the victim, We noticed that there appeared 

  

the couch, and then Jim howard of. the 

  

             snd we noticed that 

           digging down through it we recovered a bullet from it, 

             

    
        

    
        

     

  

i RN Ya PR Br yh y Bap va te Ma ws EEE Pn BY SE 5 uw 

LJ Was that done 11 YOULL prenenca, Bir? 
       

3 wo © gd 
it Yah oe 

  

(3 I hand you what has been marked as State's Exhibit 

you can identify that, 

A Yes, sir, this was a plastic bag in which Jim 

v 

Howard, upon removing the bullet, placed it 

  

        
             

    
    

  

plus mine, plus those of Tony Rainey, 
wn - 

  

"tg #4 oy = Pg Bah xy * o™ TTR RE foe By 3 Boxy sm a PEE 

Did all three of vou initial that bag, 8ir? 

a
 

Jin Howard put our initials on it, but 

it was Cole.      ky ay he a a n I were standing



  

{ Was that sgaled in your presence? 

A Yes, sir, it was, 

A It was collected, along with the other evidence, 

and transported back to the crime lab, sir. 

i pid vou have an oc¢casion to examine that after you 

got back to the crime lab or was that turned over to someone 

Jim Howard. 

6 Pid vou examine any clothing at the crime lab that 

had been recovered at the scene? 

A Ro, sir, I 4ld not, 

{ike PARKER: Your witnesdg. 

Mit, TURRER: Ho guestions. 

te would move into evidence 
"go 5 SC yh £F BS oo Ge ne % 

ix} ® ™ ¥ SNES E 3 A A368 0 Le = 

$ 44 FS 0 Yon wn Bro 9% wn iin fe : MRe TURNER: RO ODleCctiOn, 

FR fon ¥ ¥YY BY LX wi 45 3 TIRE Dh $0 cy avs Bos mn Tp ETE BORG BSR WT 
SHE COURTS State's Exhibit Number 23 1g admitted 

without objection, 

MR. PAREER: Hay this witness De sxcusged? 

ENLY En EF eS SEALs . wy Nw Hi 4 | Sh Sie gt THE COURT: Yes, sir, vou may be excused. 

= ly A ; 
HRs PARKER: all Kelly Fite, 

being first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows: 

 



  

ARTHALT ION re Yd 

WY 

E
S
 

Laboratory. 3 “ 

a 

Cr 1 bf - 

2 ot 
T
e
y
 

OTAtOry. & ial 

projectiles ¢ 
& and 

for ed i vill WCE 
5 ¥ 
“ A VE 

£ 

LA 
we 

BIEit 16 HOw 

t ever ttle 

PS hee J 

» 

; 
Fi. 3 QOL IL 

ry 

“ | ne, 
wis 
Ho in fog 85 

or be £7 all 
re 

L 

ourt? o in nes ¥ ® 

» 

tir r% =a 

LO 

I
n
g
 

 
 

 
 

31 F) i tol 
ear 

& £ 

  

Fag 

 



  

State's Exhibit Number 23, was on the 

when it was given to me by Mr. Louis 

OL the crime laboratory, 

Where 1s Mr, Howard today, 

eon leave, emergency leave, 

did vo ud on
t 8 All right, sir. Now, 

Exhibit 

A yes, 81iYr, 1 did. 

{ Ana how did you examine it, sir? 

5 Well, I examined it om 
» 

what type weapon it fired from and the 

are vou able to 

measured 

proximately «357 inches dismeter, which 

that 1t was probably 

looked at revolver. I then 

such 

i5¢h of this 

Cuendet and 

if you know, sir 

¥ 

ni 

i Gramning 

de 

bullet ang it showed 

ind 

Easy” Yaak 

Jim 

J
 

x - % Ra Btate's 

icroscopleally to determine 

caliber. 

terminations 

icated to me 

57 Magnum .d 

structure 

inpreesed on the bullet by the bore of the weapon it was 

fired frome. It shows #ix grooves with & right-hand twist. 

indicates to we that it was probably 

«38 revolver. 
ait is ong 2 
SMe CIRL 

weapon th 

width of 

w Ww
 ] 

P
o
 

wi 

7. RR Lived 

hag a 

are approximately 1125 inches, 

Exon a 

land 

 



  

a All right, How many type .38's are there, sir? 

A There are several hundred makes of weapons, 38 

caliber. 

£
3
 

ww
 

Amd are you familiar with all of then? 

A Most of them, yes, #ir. 

Q And a Rossi 1s the only one that has that type of 

twist and lands and grooves? 

A Yes, it ig, that I have seen. 

Q Bow many times have you examined bullets at the 

crime laboratory? 

A I have worked nore than 10,000 cases at the Crime 

laboratory since coming there in 1968. I have examined nore 

# All right, sir. I hand you what has been marked 

ag State's Exhibit Rumber 5 and ask if that came into your 

possession, sir? 

A Yes, The first tipe I saw State's Exhibit Humber 

5 was on May the léth of this year when Detective Jowers brought 

it to the crime laboratory. 

i, All right, sir. And 41d vou examine that exhibit? 

A Yes, it was requested by Detective Jowers that I 

examine State's Exhibit Number 5 and compare it with State's 

Exhibit Number 23 and determine If they were fired from the 

same weapon, and I did make such a comparison and noted that 

the lands and grooves structure and the small gross and 

 



  

ws & » iy phi op TE I By SNA RTA ai ET 4 yi 3 r? a Ge Fo £5 Ge ine Bo gn ” microscopic similarities were identical In both State's 

and Statels EBxhibit 23. ae
d 

ed
 

vy
 

oo
 

wd
 

ha
te

 

he fo
t 

[=
 3 ter

 

o Po an po
ss

i}
 

he Ld
 

3% 
i 

8 State's Exhibit 8 ig falrly mutilated, is it not? 

A Yes, the lead core 1s geparated {yom the metal 

Jacket; however, the bearing surface of the missile 1&8 intact 

i it is in goed condition for comparison purposes. r
s
 anc 

& In your opinicn, was State's Exhibit Humber 5 also 

Fired {rom -a ,J30 

gr % oy dha : oy oF 3 SER, LX ds ne aa Ben 4 bom BR Ree ME I bf gC The same Roesl that fired LHtate's Exhibit Number £372 

a 4 § Vin 43 ot pn 
©) SB BIL 

& w i 1 $) Sir, did vou come into possession of Officer 

IS Ce 2 vu fede an rs $3 wv ie as de Sia ah ve HS wr og NE he 
Sehlatt!'s shirt at the crime lab? 

«>
 Tm
 

= 
he
 & b
p
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we
 

pe
o oF
 

pe
 

a
 < 5%
 

wr
 

{9
 ££
 

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ah
 

5
 

r
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f
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pr
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LE
 

we
 

bi
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= bs
 

AT
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bi
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pH
 

[21
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35
 

fi
 

5
 & 5 

yo 

Fxhibit Bumber 24 and ask if you can identify that, sir? 

TP Nor LRT al LL el PTR %i a PT OREL TN pA ei 
Schlatt's shirt at the crime laboratory. 

#, Wag that done by you, sir? 

FY HO, 8ir, it wasn't. 

8) tow, did you examine those fibers? 

3 7 5 ae BT T JS ua eo 

£% 500 go p 2 Fw Wi 140 no t * 

HOO Gia that, s1xY 

& AiR OWA TU 

 



  

& na 

- o 1 

Exhibit 23 by Jim Howard 

shirt 

  

ov
 

A G5, Bl, 

it 

All right, sir. How about State's Exhibit Huasber 

VOU that before? 
an 

saan 

I have geen it, It's a metal pillbox 

contains blue fibers that were removed from State's 

in my presence. 

ThE COURT: What is the nuaber of last exhibit? 

state's Exhibit Bunmber 25 is a metal YH) PSE hae 
A ANGOOE 

  

contains blue fibers which Jim Howard removed 

from State's Exhibit Humber 23 in ny presence, State's 

Number 23 being a «38 caliber netal jacketed Exhibit 

bullet, 

Parker) You say it contained, State's 

what is fabrice removed from State's Exhibit 

NF, 
Xs, 8ir. 

Lg And that was done in your presence, s. 

Foy Yes, 81r, iT was. 

Q And was that examined by you? 

A NOe 8lT, it was not, 

wag that examined by? 

Howard. 

& gir, vou say vou did examine Qfficer Schlatt's 

; o Fa 

htaisd the ¢rine 

sir, 1 did. 

gl



  

9, Bir, I ask you to look at State's Bxhibit Rumnber 

6 and 7 and ask if vou have seen those two or seen that item 

ir? ta
d before, = 

A Yes, sir, this appears to be the victim's shirt. 

The torn area on the pocket appears to be the same as the shirt 

I turned over to the Court this morning. 

Q You brought that in here with you this morning? 

ys Yes, sir. 

{ Low, have you examined that torn place in that 

A Yes, sir, I have, 

{a And have you ever studied bullets being deflected, 

sir? 

A Yes, sir, I have. 

¢ And 1s this a Common ogourrence? 

A No, sir. It's not common, no, sir. 

$3 What can cause a bullet to deflect? 

A Usually when a bullet strikes something harder than 

it is, it changes its direction, changes its path. 

Q Could it strike an object at an angle that ig not as 

eo
] hard as it is and still change directions? 

Yes, gir, it's according to the angle. The smaller pe 

the angle, the greater the chance of deflection, 

pd
 

d
a
t
 

don't follow you. 

A Well, if a bullet struck this top here at ninety 

ig iT 

 



  

at a te! 

deflected, 

shirt could 

probably wouldn't be deflected, but if it struck 

degree angle, it's a possibility it would be 

You are saving ten degrees horizonal rather than » = 

Are you saying the torn place on Officer Schlatt's 

have been caused by a bullet that ricocheted? 

The smooth hele and the ragged exit hole indicate aot 

that there was something to deflect the bullet in the 

the shirt. 

F
u
 

=
 

would that be unusual, sir? 

Yes, sir, it would be, 

6 5 9 oy awd ate Bon a But it 1s still possible? 

Mr. Pite, is it your opinion, after having examined 

6 shirt, that this is what happened concerning the 

in the pocket, that a bullet did ricochet? 

Sh ™ 144 Ea 1 BF on : 4 . A gy 
Hie PAREER: TOU witness, 

WYSENET LF ENR BE RIB TY Sah 
CRO sr ™ LAE LIA) AGEN 

Sr rain rn 2d 
LURE RS 

pee o
N 

floor mutilated in any way, the one ti 

was the bullet that you all found in the chair or 
A 

deflected? §& et
 

Ai 

a PRES 

 



  

mprint of some object, 

{J All right, sir. Did that make it more difficult 

to study and test the bullet? 

A Wo, sir. The nutilation is on the nose of this 

metal jacketed bullet in the lead portion of it. 

od All rights How, did I understand you to say, is 

that your conclusion, a .38 Rossi probably fired the two 

bullets that you examined? 27]
 

& Yas, Sir. 

J Why do you use the word probably? 

A well, I haven't examined every weapon ever made, but 

pd
 have my £ile and the F.B.l.'s file which we have on a computer, 

that 1s the only weapon that it kicked out. 

Re TUREER: Thank you. 

MR. PARKER: May this witness be excused? 

THE COURYs Any reason why he shouldn't? 

MR. PARKER: No, sir. 

THE COURT: You may be excused, Mr, Fite, 
Bp 

MH. PARKER: Your Honor, may I have an indication 

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¥ ak COURT: About five o'clock tonight. 
. 
FS 

MR. PARKER The State recalls Detective Jowers, 

having been previously duly sworn, was recalled and further 

testified as follows 

-4l1l9- 

 



  

Q Detective Jowers, I hand you what has been marked 

as State's Exhibit Humber 26 and ask you if you can tell the 

Court and Jury what that is? 

A Yes, sir, this is a drawing of the Dixie Furniture 

Company at 993 MHarletta Street, H.W. It is a dlagram that was 

drawn by myself, and that shows the office area, the front, the 

back and the truck, where the truck was parked, and the location 

of the black leather jacket that was recovered, alse where the 

sofa where the projectile was removed from, also the safe where 

the black leather jacket was located in front of it. 

$) All right, sir. Now, how did you prepare that 

A This was drawn from looking at the store and drawing 

the diagrai. 

Pld you take any measurements? Be 

Te
 

fee
 

ow
 

#4
 

po
ss
 

2 ~
 2)
 

pt
 

™
 

¥ 

A Yes, slr, neasurenents were made of the building and 

from specific locationg. One of the nmeasurcenents was nade from 

the front door to the puddle of blood where Qfficer Echlatt was 

apparently shot. The measurement was forty-two feet from the 

front door to that location. They were taken from the puddle of 

blood to the back office, and that measured forty-seven feet and 

eight inchess The overall width from the front door to where the 

storage room was where the safe and the black leather jacket was 

er FA & FD 

 



  

located at, the 

From the 

roow where the safe and 

from that door to the loading dock 

building, the 

inches. The overall 

feet and ght inches. 

A Yen, 81ir, 

(3 Poss that 

portions at 

13th, 197872 

A 

Milly PARKERS 

8 Exnibit 

TURNEK?S Fide 

on that, Your 

Mi, PRARE is 2 

THE COURT: 

Bf wen TEE nd a TE 
Mle ZUTHEE until 

all of 

Lie 

measurement 

door 

the 

measurenents 

wigdll 

that is marked 

SE, tiguram 
R$ 

i3 

iy 
& oh 

Humber 

Y 

HONOY 

I 

has 

that 

pixie Furniture 

Was one hundred eighteen 

that is used to enter the 

door on the 

were twentv-seven feet and 

of the 

done under your control 

” ay Me PC x A Fer EL Pu ool x they were done by myself, 

% 

he State would 

26, 

would have a 

mark it tendered and will 

had a right to examine the 

Fy 3 
a VF Re 

feel 

and 

and 

storage 

black leather jacket wag located, 

side of the 

on 
3 3 § 4 

room was twenty-one 

eit the diagram itself? 

Super 

truly and accurately reflect the 

store on Hay the 

suonit into evidence 

little cross-~examination 

I will wait 

witness. 

 



  

Lx Ty Fi 3 OU ET RB CF a adh oo won Fou ang mm oD 
Mie PARKER He may go ahead, 

BLE ENE A Ee RE oR Bey 
RECROBG~EXAMIHATT ION 

BY MR. TURHER: 

Gd What are the measurements from the door to the 

blood puddle again, please? 

A Approximately forty-two feet. 

8 All right, And you say you measured that based on 

wnat you thought was where he was shot, right? 

fh The measurements were made from the puddle of blood 

where we found it in the center aisle where the officer's head 

had been lying. 

@ What is that suppoeged to represent, then, just the 

distance from the puddle of blood to the door, or does that 

attempt to purport to be the distance of where the officer was 

initially shot? 

A It indicates the location of where the officer's 

head was lying, also where the projectile was recovered, which 

was next to the puddle of blood. 

8 All right, sir. So in any event, all it indicates 

ig just that, ang you are not saving that is where the officer 

wags initially struck? 1 just want to clarify that. 

A Ho, Bi. 

MR, TURNER: Ho further questions, 

MR. PAREER: The State resubmitsg State's Exhibit 

Nunber 26. 

 



  

THE COURT: btate's Exhibit Number 26 is admitted 

MR. TURNER: Could 1 ask the officer to step down 

and point out the views of things on that diagram, State's 

Exhibit Humber 267 

THE COURY Yes, sir. 

THE WITNESS: Okay. This is the front, which is 

993 Marietta Street, 

le PARKER: Talk louder for the court reporter, 

please, sir. 

THE COURT: Hr, Bheriff, take the microphone over 

there 80 the court reporter can hear the testimony. 

FURL THE WITHEES: Okay. This is a diagram of the Dixie 

Furniture Company at 993 Marietta Street, This is the 

front door and as you enter the front door there are two 

doors, glass doors that could be either pushed or pulled 

to enter the building or exit the building. I was advised 

that one of the doors was locked at the time the incident 

Gecurred. As vou start down the alsle there is a parti- 

tioned area here that made it very difficult to see tou the 

reay of the buliding from the front. All of the {ront of 

the building ig glass; however, vou can't see through 

because of the partitions and the areas that are not 

shaded indicate the areas that are not covered that you 

could see through the pertitions. 

 



  

AS you move down the alsle, you had to meke soxt 

of a right turn and then another left turn to go down 
we 

an aisle. As we moved down the alsle approximately 

forty-two feet, this is where we found the puddle of 

was the ki
: blood, Also next to that on the right-hand 8ic 

sofa. That is the green velvet sofs where the projectile 

Was recovared. 

On the left-hand side was the officer's revolver, 

which was located here, As you nove back to the rear, there 

is & desk, a long desk, that extends over half the length 

of this area here and on the sides is glass, it was con- 

structed with wood, and at the top of it ig glass, and 

between there was two little places that could be used to 

enter the office area from this aisle. 

Directly across from here is the loading dock. This 

is where the truck wag parked and this is the loading dock 

area here. As you move from the loading dock area into the 

office area here, located ~- vou just walk straight back 

and you come into a wall, and there -- and make a short 

right turn and you are in the storage ares where the safe 

was located, alse the location of where we found the black 

leather jacket in front of the safe here. 

There is a restroom in there and just a little area 

over there behind the door that you could store items, 

1 

ver here is also the office arem, and it's 

 



  

Eo 

partitioned off by a partition that is constructed of 

wood. The overall length from the front door where the 

storage room, where the safe was located, from that door 

to the front door of the Dixie Furniture Company, the 

overall length was one hundred elghteen feet and four 

inches. The measurements of the widths of the aisle was 

four feet, one inch wide on this particular aisle here. 

Prom the door where the storage room, where the safe and 

the black leather jacket was recovered from, {rom that 

door to the door that is used to go onto the dock, the 

loading area, that measured twenty-seven feet, six inches 

from that location, 

The overall length of the room would be twenty-on [i
 

feat and eight inches, and, of course, the width would be 

seven feet and nine inches. 

MR, PAREER: Your Honor, I plan to go into some 

4:
 other matters now that I believe == 

THE. COURT: All right, ladies and gentlemen, I will 

let you go to the jury room and the sheriff will be here 

shortly with vour coffee and we'll get you back in the 

courtroom as goon as you finish. 

(Whereupon, the jury retired from Lhe courtroom, 

after which the following proceedings were had.) 

THE COURT: Mr. Parker and Mr. Turner, I would like 

for this case to get to the jury not later than Batuxday, 

 



  

if we can. Do you think that the time the Court adjourns 

might be significant in that vegard? 

PARKER: Way I have just a moment? 

Your Honor, I assume that counsel wants to go through 

a Jackson vs. Denno hearing, and the State anticipates that 

we will have Detective Jowers, possibly Detective Harris, 

two secretaries that typed the statement, and possibly 

Lieutenant Perry, possibly Sergeant McConnell. 

All of that, I guess, will have to be done outside 

the presence of the jury if that is any indication of 

which direction we should move, 

THE COURT: I might try to get all of that in this 

afternoon. Let's see how we feel two hours from nov. 

HRs TURNER: I would Like a recess, Your Honor. 

THE CQUAT: All right, let's take about & ten 

minute recess. 

(Whereupoh, a short recess was had.) 

SHE COURT: All right, proceed, 

REDIRECT EXAMTIMNATION 

BY HR. PARKER: 

W Detective Jowers, following the taking of McClesky's 

statement in Cobb County, did you return to the Atlanta Police 

Departisent? 

& Yas p BAL» 

. Bo ao fle J. 3 . An  & FT - RE 4 A RTO ay SED BAR Ry 
8 And what did you do, if anything, in connection with 

4 * 
hah.’ 8 ¢ Rood 

 



  

time 

Qo 

& 

YO RR sa 3 
TREE p at the beginning. 

Pistrict Attorney's Office 

Hr. Burney went over what he 

arrival. 

{) 

30th? 

5 

HEMOryY » 

and, 

His 

an 

LJ 

you working 

  

we 

Okay 

in fact, I'd 

oral 

that time? 

CRay. 

were introduced tO & Fre =- 

18 he one of the 

Yes, sir, he is, 

co-defendants 

We returned to the City of Atlanta and at 

I think it was David 

this in 

and did you interview him, sir? 

Yes, sir. Ve interviewed Mr. 

And who conducted 

Present was Detective Harris, 

Later Mr. 

arrived and he 

and what tine 

Okay. It was the 

it was -= on 30th 

it wag sbout siz or omer 
bs AY 

statepent was not reduced to writing on the 

statenent. 

on 

Yas, sir, 

Lewis 

had told us prior to Rr, 

that have 

afternoon, 

it was in the 

Burney at the Homicide 

that interview? 

Lieutenant Perry and 

Slaton from the 

was present when 

Slaton's 

Haen on the 

Let me refresh uy 

afternoon, 

seven in the afternoon. 

30th Fl he 

dow, on Bay the 3lst then, were



  

LE And what was your first assignment Hay the 3lst 

¥ » a 
4 you reported Lo work? 

A Okay, On May the 31st I was in the Homicide Office 

and I wag advised that =-- later that Lieutenant Ferry, the 

Commander of the Fomicide Office, and Sergeant McConnell, had 

went to Marietta to pick up Mr. Warren MeClesky, and upon their pt
 

arrival at the Homicide Office Lieutenant Perry walked in, and 

Mr. HMeClesky was walking behind him, and Lieutenant Perry pointed 

to Mr. HeClesky and said, "Jowers, I think he wants te talk to 

vou,” and at that time I agked did he want to talk to me, and he 

sald yes, Mr, HceClesky stated, "Yes, I would like to talk to you," 

He said, "They are trving to hang this shit on me and I want to 

get it straight," and he said, "I want to talk to you about it.” 

I said, "Okay, come around here to the office." 1 

Parsons’ secre- gaid, "Hy secretary is tied up, but the Hissin =e ot e
e]
 

tary, Mg. Turner, she is in her office, we will go around here," 

and again he wag allowed to sign a waiver of counsels At this 

time -— 

(; Who was with you at this time? 

A Okay. At the beginning of his statement it was 

Sergeant Sturgis, who is in charge of the Hissing Persons, and 

the secretary, Ms. Margene Turner, and myself, Later Detective 

flarris joined us, later almost at the end of the question and 

answer session where he answered -- where we asked Mr. HcClesky 

several questions. 

iy 5 
id de 

 



  

9] all right, sir. now, was the waiver of right to 

counsel form presented to Mr. McClesky? 

A Yes, sip, at this time we used the City of Atlanta's 

waiver of counsel, which is a little different from the waiver 

that was used by the Marietta Police Department. 

{ And wnere was this gone over with him? 

A Okay. This vas gone over == I went over the waiver 

3 

of counsel in the Missing Persons Office, 

0 And would you read into the record the waiver of 

counsel -- 

2} Yes, sir. 

3 -- dated May the 31st, 19787 

A Okay This is a "Walver of Counsel by Defendant 

in custody.” Th 

Atlanta. 

It starts off by saying, where hig name is typed in, 

"1, Warren HMeClesky, have been informed, by the undersigned lew 

enforcement officers, prior to being questioned by them, that I 

an’ suspected of the offense of murder and robbery in Fulton 

County, State of Georgia, on the 13th day of Hay, 1978, and, have 

been informed by them of ny Constitutional rights, as follows: 

"One, that I may remain silent and do not have to 

mare any statement at-all. 

"Two, that any statement which I might make may be 

used against ne in court, 

 



  

"Three, that I have a right to consult with an 

attorney before making any statement and to have such attorney 

present with nme while I an making & statement. 

"Four, that if I do not have enough money to employ 

an attorney, I have the right to have one appointed by the Court 

to represent me; to consult with hin before making any statement 

and, to have him present with me while I am making a statement. 

"pive, that if I request an attorney, no guestions 

will be asked of me until an attorney is present to represent me." 

Then it has a paragraph that follows, “After baving 

my Constitutional rights explained to me, I freely and voluntarily 

waive my right to an attorney, I an willing to make a statement 

to the officers, I can read and write the English language, and 

fully understand my Constitutional rights to an attorney. 1 have 

read this waiver of counsel and fully understand it. Ho threats 

or promises have been made to me to induce me to sign this waiver 

of gounsel, and to make a statement to the officers. 

"ohis 3lst day of May, 1978," and again I asked hip 

to tell me how far he had went in school, and he stated the 

twelfth grade, I asked him was he married and he stated not 

marvied, and at this time he signed the walver of counsel, 

Then it says, "All of the Constitutional rights in 

the above waiver of counsel were read and explained to the above 

defendant by me and he freely and voluntarily waived his right 

to an attorney. lo threats, promises, tricks or persuasion were 

JU 

 



  

employed by me or anyone in my presence to induce him to waive 

his rights to an attorney, and to make a statement without an 

attorney, He freely and voluntarily signed the above waiver 

of counsel in my presence after having read it." It has ay 

name, Detective HW, K. Jowers. It was witnessed by Sergeant 

Sturgis and the secretary, Hs. Margene Turner. 

% All right. Did Mr, HMeClesky ask you any questions 

concerning his vights? 

A KO, 81x, he stated, you know =~- he signed it and 

said, "Okay, let's go, I want to tell you what happened,” 

J All rights bow, tell me how you proceeded having 

Hre MeClesky rell you or letting him tell you what happened, 

A Okay. As always is standard procedure with me, I 

have found that it is better to let them just express themselves, 

tell what had happened, and then after they complete their state- 

ment, 1 will ask them a Juestion and answer session where I can 

be more specific on what I want rather than try to coach them 

through a statement to pick out what I want, I let thew tell 

what happened, 1 explained this to him, I told him that he 

could just sit down and tell in his own words what he would 

like to tell about the incident and I advised him at that time 

apleted his statement that if he didn't 

object to it, I would conduct a question and answer session with 

hil where other detectives would come In and ask questions also. 

At this time he turned and he started talking with Ms, Turner, 

wp 3m 

 



  

the secretary, and giving her the information that she needed 

to start filling out the forms. 

¥ All xight, sir. Now, did he dictate to her a 

statement? 

Fe He did. 

{J and how long & stateuwent was it, sir? 

# I mean the portion that he dictated by himself. 

A Okaye I think -- let me double check, 1 think it was 

only one page. Okay. It's just one page that he did by himself, 

and the remaining twelve pages weve question aml answer sessions 

conducted by myself and Detective Harris. 

sent all the time that those guestion 

and answer sessions were conducted as well as the first page? 

A Yes, Sir. 

¢ All right, sir. Would you tell the Court, you say 

- Fr oY : Margene Turner typed part of that statement? 

A ¥en, sire. She iB not a Homicide secretary, we have 

special secretaries, She works for Missing Persons; however, 

she assists us whenever our secretary is tied up. She started 

this statement and ghe had to return to something that she 
wo 

needed to type, and at that time the question and answer 

session was completed by our Homicide secretary, Mrs. Offutt, 

{ All right. dow far did Hs. Turner type, if you 

Know? 

 



  

A bhe went to the twelfth page of the thirteen pages. 

# Sir, I ask you how many pages does Pat Offutt's 

name appear on in this statement? 

A Okay. OBhe -- excuse me, She came into the office 

when Mr. MceClesky signed it because when she typed the last 

# “ 

two statements, he signed all the statements after he was 

allowed to read the statements again, and at that time she 

witnessed the signing of the statement, Her name appeared 

starting on Page 9, and the other pages were witnessed By 

Detective Harris and ayself., 

¥ HO are you saying Pat Offutt typed Pages 12 and 

13, but witnessed more than those pages? 

A tes, slr. She == when we -=- we wait until we 

have completed the entire statement, guestion and answer 

session, before we allow == you know, before they can sign 

it, We like for then to read it all together, rather than to 

read parts of it and to sign it, we like to give it all to 

them, allow them an opportunity to read it, and after they 

read it, then they sign it, and she was present when he signed 

the signature to the statements, 

¥ what time did this statement start, approximately, 

A Okay. The time that it started was at 1:26 P.M. 

G And when did it complete? 

A Okay. I don't have a time that it was completed, 

-433= 

 



  

0 All right, sir. Du you have a supplemental form 

that you would have possibly noted that on? 

A Okatve Six, I can't find anything to indicate the 

exact time, 

{J All right. Can you tell us approximately how 

long the interview was? 

A This interview lasted, it was at least about 

approximately two hours. 

Q Could it have been shorter or could it have been 

longer? 

A Yes, sir, it could have been shorter or it could 

have been longer. Once we started the question and answey 

session, it was a continuous thing. We stopped and purchased 

3 

him some clgarettes and some potato chips and then we came Dack 

and completed it. 

id And why was that done? 

A I asked him while he was making the statement, you 

know, during the question and answer session, he kept saying, 

nrait a minute and let me think, I want to get it right, I want 

to get it straight." I asked him, I said I was a little thirsty, 

and I was going past the snack bar, and I asked nim 1 he wanted 

something, and he said a pack of cigarettes and some potato Chips. 

0 Where was Detective Harris at this time? 

A Detective Harris was not there at this time, he vas 

2 W PRASE SIE. ER po A of EN 
in the Homicide Cilice., 

fo 8 ih 3 

 



  

* Bid you leave Mr, HeClesky there in the office 

by himself? 

A Yes, air, I left him with the secretary, 

0 Were you afraid he might run? 

A BHO, Bir. 

£ And where is the Missing Persons Office located in 

the police department? 

A Okay. In order to get there from the Homicide 

™ 8 ELice, you would have to come out of the Homicide Office, go 

down the hall approximately twenty feet, and vou make a left 

turn and go down about twenty feet, and make another left turn, 

and go all the way to the end of the hall which ig about fifty 

feet, and that is where Missing Persons is located, 

Be
y Did you ask anybody to watch Mr. MeClesky while you 

left him? 

A Sergeant Sturgis was there in the office with 

MB. Turner. 

GU 20 somebody was with him? 

A Yes, sir. 

8) But Sergeant Sturgis was not questioning him? 

A Bo, sir, she was conducting Hissing Persons' busi- 

ness 

$, she? 

A C8, Bir. 

¥ A lady police officer? 

~435~ 

 



  

A Yes, sir. 

Q How, would you read into the record what McClesky 

told you as he dictated it to the secretary, sir? 

A Okay. This is the statement of Warren MeClesky. 

it is dated on the 3lst, May the lst, 1978. It starts off, 

he started it off, he said, “Saturday, Mav 13th, 1976, I leit 

home at approximately eight and went to pick up Ben Wright. 

“hen I went to plcek up Dupree and from that point we went to 

pick up David Barney [sic]. Then we rode around talking about 

getting some money. Ben suggested that we try the Dixie 

Furniture Store. We rode around the block a couple of times 

looking at the Dixie Furniture Store before we could really 

make up our minds whether we were going to go in or not. 

Alter we decided to go in and cheek it out, I went in and 

looked to see how many people were in there, Then I took 

the information back to them. After I gave them the 

information, & decision about where the car would be parked 

had to be made. After that, we decided that Ben, bBupree, 

David would all go to the back door and that I would go 

through the front. when I got on the inside, I got the people 

to lay on the {floor and I just stood over them and watched 

them, while they were supposed to be getting the money, I stood 

there approximately fifteen minutes and after having taken so 

long inside the store waiting on them, 1 became very nervous 

jittery and then started walking back towards the front door. 

Re at, 25 BS Send 

  

E13



  

got all the way to the front door and, just as I got to the 

door, I saw the police car when it pulled into the parking lot, 

I immediately crawled up under a bed or a sofa, furniture that 

was in the front, It was enough clearance between the furniture 

for me to see the officer walkKine the aisle. 1I was giving So
d oo
 

Fv
 

} 
u
g
 

Le
 

him time enough to get up the aisle so that I could case out 

the front door. Just as I got up from under the furniture, I 

got up to my feet, 1 Heard two gunshots, I immediately panicked 

and started quickly to the front door because I did not know if 

the officer had seen me and had started shooting at me. I did 

not leok around to see, Hy intention was to get out of there 

as soon as posgible., After 1 got clear of the front door, cut 

of the front door, I ran all the way to the car. After we got 

to the car, everyohe wag really puzzled about which direction 

to go in. SO, Bernard Dupree suggested that we go to his 

house, After having arrived at his house, we quickly went oh 

the inside, changed clothes; and then we cane hack outside, 

David went in a separate direction, Bernard Dupree staved at 

home, Ben Wright and nyself left in the car. From that point, 

I took him to Mchaniel Street to the poolroown. From that 

point, I went to 20 Bowen Avenue ==" 

” He has here, "I went to 20 Bowen Avenue," 

8 All © ig BL 

A "I went to 20 Bowen Avenue, I was in Marletta up 

-437=- 

 



  

to that point.” 

* You left cut something. 

A "Prom that point, 1 took hin to 

to the poolroom. From that peint, I went to 

where for a couple of hours, 

» 

I was in Marietta up to Marietta, 

fa w I Eg bi. Bo rw 4 @ Roni anal i Fam 4 

L% All Eigiite HOW, 18 Chat wiiat Mr. 

Margene Turner? 

B, Yes, Bir. 

Ga and who was present at that time, 

aw
w 2 

¥ Fon on yon pia od in vs 23 SEW or 
Arnary ana mysell. £o 

& and how about Sergeant Sturgis? 

A She was still at her desk. 

£) All right, sir. And following 

given voluntarily? 

Fie Yes, Sir. 

{ All right, sir. Then you 

answer session, is that correct? 

A ies, 

{ Now, how was this done, sir? 

A Okays &s 1 had stated tO him 

made the first page of the statement, I told 

tell what he wanted Ee
 

a
r
 

ea
d 

4%
, hin to just go ahead ai 

~438= 

  

EA on They 9 a EN MeDaniel 

YN 

a4 

and from that point, 

4 ry . Rig P MceClesky 

thét 

gstavted the question and 

before 

Street 

Bowen Avenue 

to 

that point.” 

sir? 

wag that 

by you or anyone? 

he made hig == 

wanted 

3 a ii Ol * Fo
n



  

own words so that I wouldn't have to coach him to get what 1 

wanted out of him, I would question what I wanted cleared up, 

80 I told him ag soon as he completed his statement then any- 

thing I needed to get clear or any questions, I would ask him 

questions if he didn't object, and he sald, "Okay." As soon 

as he completed his statement, at that time we conducted a 

9 All vight, sir, low, does that start on Page 2 

then? 

L¢) All right. Will you read into the regord Page 27 

A "The following is a question and anawer session 

conducted by nenbers of the Homicide Squad,“ 

it starts, “Jowers: Prior to Saturday, May 13th, 

1978, did you discuss with Ben Wright or anyone else about 

robbing the Dixie Furniture Company? 

"MoClesky: Ho, it wasn't discussed. During the 

course of time that we were riding, trying to find out how we 

were getting some money for that day, it was suggested to get 

it from Dixie Furniture Company. 

Jowerss On Saturday, Hay 13, 1978, whose automo=- 

bile were you driving and what type of automoblle was it? 

"McCleskys We were riding in ny car, a 1971 black 

Grand Prix, two-door hardtop, the tag number is LPW/126. 

BY iF on Pad we ED Pr § DPR sah go Db aT or 3 5% a 5 Pn BEE \ 4 Jowers: Where was Ben Wright when you picked him 

aE 4 
—— 4 wg hy 3 — 

 



  

up on May 13th. 

esky: It w "HeCl 

remember the name of the 

Lee Street.” 

{3 Can you slow down just a 

& Ed * pr ED Té y A HoCleshkys It w 

remember the nape of the 

y 

lee btreet. 

"Jowers: Do you 

Wat and am nt ¥ Hon ans 
Lie Cle 8A id : Yon. 

*Jowerssy Did yo 

Jenking! house? 

"MceCleskys Ho, 

nRIowerss Did 

Tes. "HeClesky: 

rowers: For 

err "hcClesks o 
- 

shells, tape and 

Wah age 4 Sir, 

Mr. McClesky? 

gir. 
of 

And did 

of that information? 

3 
NO I'd Bite 

  

ag off Campbellton 

street, 

as off Campbellton 

street, 

you 

He went Dy there to 

the 

vou pressure 

Road, I don't 

but it is not too Lar from 

little » 

Road, I don't 

but it is not too far from 

know Mary Jenkins? 

uw pick up Ben Wright {rom Mary 

I didn't. 

ge by Mary Jenking' house on 

what reason? 

black leather coat.” 

given freely and voluntarily by 
ww’ 

him in any way concerning any 

~440-



  

* Did you threaten him in any way? 

Fst ALS r Bi» 

a oR RE, TE * > fy a | Rio 20 1 . ye A BE wn pag pe 4 > 5 myn £3 And Page 2 was still being typed by Margene Turner? 

4) All right. Would you read in the record Page 3. 

Fo Page 3, "Jowers: Did everyone go inte tha house or pt J 

you go in by yourself? 

*McClesky: No, everyone did not go into the house. 

Dupree, David remained in the car up on the corner of 3 4 ¥ 

Campbellton and Ryan in my car. 

"Jowergs: Did Mary Jenkins give vou the sawed-off 

shotgun, shells and tape? 

"McCleskys Yes, 

*Jowerss Did she also give you the black leather 

"Jowers: Can you describe the sawed-off shotgun 

Hery Jenkins gave you? 

"HMeClesky: Yes. It was sawed-off, .410 gauge 

ghotgun. The stock had tape on it, I can’t remember if it was 

white tape or black tape. 

we color of the 410 g
e
 "Jowers: Can you tell me t 

shotgun shells thet you received from Mary Jenkins? 

ESPN POE Fe ~ Batis Bo NR HeCleskys:s They were red. 

"Jowers: What color was the tape, or can you tell 

A F 

at 

 



  

me what type of tape it was? 

"MeClesky: The tape was 

nospital tape. It was not like the 

it was & big roll with some cloth in 

you received 

get him 

lengths, 

x STEROL FP] ’ - i 

JOWERYE 18 

-> oy 3L the 
4d YL FEE 5 

to 

It was 

A 0 4 EN, Re TET on grey 

sen Wright was 

"nv ’ « on a $ brow Jowers: Can you des 

13 from Hary Jenkins on Hay 

ell, Was Page 3 given to 

Clesky? 

Yes oat iE » 

$2 ~ oo sw E50 i ew a ps bo ga om vn de gin wag any 10rce, threats, 

give you the information © 

Page 4, "HeClesky: = It wa 

I don't know the size of it, 

winter of '77, and the jac 

00 bilge 

Where were vou 

I i | TR NI 
MUCLEEEY S 

v » 

livin iil with w 

*Jowers: Do you 

TR w F Hot po . a Tr ky on er Tow - oy showing MelClesky a black le - a 

wHeClesky: Yes. This is 
- 

4 ue §* PR Tn oi van § 4 wih ol gun and the shell from Mary 

King 

cribe 

promises or 

white, I think it was 

you buy in stores, 

* 

it, 

ste 

the leather coat that 

13th." 

you freely and voluntarily 

rewards used to 

| 
He a. 7 1 Page 

de 

8 biack, three-quarter 

tried it or » 
. 

ket did not fit me at that 

when you tried on the 

Jenkins! house. At that Fe 
w 

this coat? (Detective 

ather coat.) 

y oat that I had when Lhe 

 



  

« 

this coat because of the black spot that is inside on the 

lining. 

=, "Jowers: Ig this the coat that was used at the 

Digie Furniture Company on Hay 13th? 

"MeCleskys Yes, 

*Jowers: Who had this coat at that time. 

"MeClesky: Ben Wright carried the coat into the 

Pixie Furniture Company because when we got out of the car, 

Ben had the shotgun concealed in the black leather coat, 

"Jowers: In your statement, you stated that you 

went into the Dixie Furniture Company to see how many people 

were there, and you took the information back to them. When 

you went into the store, did vou talk to anyone that was 

employed by Dixie Furniture Company? 

"HMoClesky: I went into the furniture store on two 

different occasions on Hay the 13th. The first time, I was 

looking at some items, not really carrying on a conversations 

[sic], but getting some prices of some of the furniture. It was 

@ lady that was behind the counter and I asked her the price of ¥ 

the component set and she gave ne --" 

0 And was Page <4 given to you freely and voluntarily? 

A it was. 

2 was any force, promises or threats used to obtain 

CEI We ee 4 ih an? 
that FRR 4, to 1 af 

A te) tr Bie 

~5§3- 

 



  

the exac 

Ln
 

EJ
 Would you read into the record Page 

Ali right. " == the price, but I can't remember 

ct figures that she gave ne, 

> ow ' Fa RT Po PT LE » ~ wi 4% we Bo o ome Jy pr Bin. wh Be go Jowers: Can you describe the lady that was stand- 

ing behind the counter? 

"MeClesky: I can't really describe her, but she 

wag & black lady in her mid-twenties. 

"Jowers: Did you ask her anything about an unusual 

bed, like a water bed? 

oy
 "HcClesky It is possible, I don't remember. 

"Jowers: How leng did you remain in the store, 

after the lady quoted vou the prices? 

browsing 

= 
r-

 
Pa

 

a te H
a
 

Fo
o)
 

55]
 

fx
 

¢ < EJ
 

¥s
 

3 io,
 bY So
i 

b
o
o
n
 

B
=
 

La
l rr
 

Fs
) 

*
 

| 
w three minutes, just 

bo P
t
 

i dy
: 

£T
 around, and after I thought that I had the 

exact amount of people that were in the store, 

changed 

sleeved 

gleeved 

"Jowerst When you returned the second time, did 

into the front or the side door? 

"HeClesky: 1 came into the front door. 

"Jowers: Were you still wearing the same clothes 

bad on when you first came in? 

"HeCleskys:s Yes, everything except the shirt. 1 

the shirts When I first went in, I had on a short- 

shirt, When I went in the second timé, I had on & long- 

shirt. 

¥ ve
 3 a TR A ak - EIR an rh wk a rm a AE Jowerss: were you wearing anything on your head? 

pet LE hd 

 



  

LBERYS a hat, 

Wooton yee» (“33 T HE £1 gn £3» ibe LE 7 WWE SE 3 best i} Yu gegering 1d 

i EL «¥ oN I or £ PAL a 8 ° Th JP 4 a is Brom B® ww en pit aa 

bd HOW, Was rade 2 given oy Hele sky freely anil 

A Yes, Biv, it was, 

& Was any force, promises or threats used to obtain 

that information? 

£i WO Ble 

Q All right, sir. Would you read into the record Page 

A Yes, sir. "hoClesky: Yes, a flop hat. I had 
a 

stocking on up under it, s0 that all 1 had to 40 was to pull 

the stocking down, over my face. 

v"IJowers: What color was the flop hat, and what did 

vou do with it after leaving the store? 

"HeCleskys The flop hat was blue, made out of denin 

# 

material, with air holes in the top of it. I threw the hat away 

into a dumpster. 

Jowers: Where was the dumpster located? 

"ieCleskys Right off of Lee Street. We were going 
wo pe 

to McDaniel Btreet and just as we crossed the railroad tracks 

leaving lee Street, we saw a dumpster and we put all the c¢lothing 

that we did not want into a sack and put the sack into the 

dumpster. Dupree and bavid were not with us at this time. 

was in the process of me taking Ben wo Mebaniel Street. 
i 3 

iA 
bake Sc ae 

This 

 



  

Jowerss Was this on Baturday, Hay 13th, 19787 

"MeCleskyi Yes, 

"Jowers: ‘How long have you been knowing Ben Wright? 

ipcClesky: Prom '74. 

*Jowerss What type of weapon was he carrying on 

May 13th, 19782 

"HeClesky:s I know for a fact that he had the shot- 

gun. He had a pistol but I don't know if he took it with him 

or if he left it in the car. 

"Jowers: Did Ben Wright have a stocking cap over 

"HeCleskys He had a stocking, bet I don't know if 

he had it ons Because I went into the front door, and they went 

8, Was Page 6 given to you freely and voluntarily by 

A Yes, sir, it was, 

{2 Were any promiges or force or threats used to obtain 

A Ro, sir. 

& Will you read into the record Page 7. 

A *Jeowexs: In your statement, you stated that vou 

picked up Dupree, Do you know Dupree's first name, or ig that 

his first name? 

+4
 "McClesky:s I did not know his £irst name, but 

eb 1 

 



  

i found out that his first name is Bernard. 

"Jowers: How long have vou known Bernard Dupree? 

"HeClesky:s 1 met Dupree also in "74. However, 

we did not become very good friends until this year. I just 

knew him. 

nJowers: 

him up at? 

know the address, 

Richland, it runs 

Blowers: 

Dupree was carrying 

SUYe « 

Rowers: 

up 

get him? 

BreClesk 

off Techwood., 

rovers: 

What 

13th, 185787 

"Helle 

the was in 

Riowers: 

but 1 think 

QL 

David Barney | 

ype of weapon did David Barney {s 

Car, 

On May Lith, 1978, where did you pick 

I picked him up at his house. I don't 

name of the streat is that the 

near Donnelly Avenue. 

Can you describe the weapon that Bex 

on May 13th, 197872 “ws 

I thought that it was & +2 I am not 

In your statement you stated that you 

gic). From what location did you 

vi 1 picked him 117 Pine Btreet, 

x) hat type of weapon did Bernard® —- 

ic] carry 

I don't know. The whole time that he 

I never did Bee 

3% Warren McClesky EE I showed you several 

 



  

phactographs that were taken by our identification unit from & 

helicoper, showing the areas around the Dixie Purniture Company 4 ve 4 J 

do you think vou can show us where vou were parked on Mav 13th 
- & EM 4 4 

19782" 

Q How, was Page 7 given to you freely and voluntarily 

on
d by Warren HoClesky 

) Were any threats, promises or duress used to obtain 

that information? 

4 

HO, sir. #*
 

Q All right, Would you continue with Page 8. 

pi "MeClesky: Yes, 

"he aerial photographs are numbered from 1 to 7. 

HeClegkyt: In photograph Humber 5, I can show you 

where I was parked both times, 

"Jowers: Do you object to putting your initials 

on the photograph where you were parked both times? 

-deskyt Okay, I will write 'first' and I will 

put my initials and I will write 'second' and I will put my 

"Jowers:s Marietta Street runs north and south. In 

what direction was vour car pointed in? 

"HeClesky: It was pointed in a southernly direction. 

"Jowers: Were you driving the same car on both 

occasions that you went to the Dixie Furniture Company? 

 



  

Jowers: The first time that you went to the 

furniture company, how many people were in the GAT? 

MeCleskyt There were four people in the car the 

first time and four in the car the second time, 

Jowers: Mame the people that were in the car. 

"HcCleskys den Wright, Dupree, David Barney [sic], 

and myself, 

“Jowers: When you were in the store the second time, 

what was your Job in the robbery? 

"HeClesky:s Hy job was to watch the front." 

Was Page 8 given to you freely and voluntarily by 

Ld Were any threats, promises or other inducements 

made to get Mr. HeClesky to give vou that information? 

QO I show you what has been marked as State's Exhibit 

number 2le Can you explain to the Court what that is, sir? 

A Yes, this is photograph Humber 5, This picture was 

taken from a heliceoper by 1.0. Technician Hrs. Cortez. on this 

picture == 

; ¥ What day was that taken, sir? 

\ This photograph was taken on Hay the 24th, 1978. & u pi I, fr 

*, 

Da
d 3am gr dw 

PGR LW: 4 at taken under your control and su 

 



  

to leav 

7
 

fn eh 
1k 

area, 

Exhibit 

A 

aerial view of 

w 5 
+ 

oy Yes, sir, I instructed the I.Ds technician prior 

ing the police department on the directions that 1 wanted 

rograph taken and what 1 wanted to show in the photographs, 

Were you out in the area at the 

Ho, sir, I was not there, out there. 

weren't in the helicoper? 

gir. 

with that area? you familiar 

Yes, Sir. 

And that ig Btate's Bxhibit Number what, sir? 

iwenty what, 

air? r
e
 

What is the tag number on there, State's Exhibit 

Twenty-one, 

Twenty-one? 

Bir. WF oe 
: 4 = 4] F 4 

Does State's Exhibit Number 21 accurately reflect 

the Dixie Furniture Company and surrounding 

air. 

All right, sire Bow, what appears on that State's 

Number 217 

You can see the the Dixie Purniture Company, 

iE 
~~ 

 



    

also the parking lot area. You can see the top of the loading 

dock area, you can also ses the Dixie Purniture truck that is 

parked at the loading area. It shows Harietta Street, Eighth 

street, Third Street, Watking Street, and it also shows the 

location where Mr. MeClesky stated that he had parked his car 

the first time that he went to the Dixie Purniture Company. 

9) How does it state that, sir? 

A He has -- in his handwriting he put "first" and he 

initialled it "wu", 

there a date on there? ed
 

»
o
u
 

in
 

4 | TRC SR Rg 9. all right, sir. 

A HO, Sir, he didn't date it. 

# And how 18 that written on the photograph, sir? 

A Okay. He just has "first" and then he has bis 

initials "WM". However, on the back he later signed his name, 

warren Hellesky, and dated it 5-31-78 in his writing 

{ All right, sir. How, is there tape actually on 

that photograph? 

A Yes, sir, because of the surface that is on the 

photograph I covered his name, Warren McClesky, dated 5-31-78 

with tape, and I also covered where he put "first" and put his 

initials, and also where he put "second" and his initials, 

because it would rub off if you touched it with vour hand. 

{3 All right, sir. How, who actually put the tape 
™ 4 - E 

 



  

en the photoyraph 

\¥ vho instructed you where to put the tape? 

A He didn't instruct me where to put the tape. After 

he put his name -=- correction, his initiels, he put “"first® and 

put his initials "WM" and then he showed me where he was 

the second time, and he put "second" and he put "Wk", At that 

time XI put the tape on both of the locations. 

5 

¥ All right, sir. Those two locations, that information 

was given to you by who, sir? 

a Bl me 5 es tt A vy BA or i EEE OR 
#4 Mr. Warren HOCLESKY « 

Q All right, sir. 18 the 

[
$
8
 

3
 

B
a
n
 

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ge
 

is
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s
 

i
 

Ee
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a
 $ &%
 te S
u
 

pri
c: 

F
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in the courtroom today? 

oo
 

oe
 

&
 &g
 

~ on
 

& 

p w 4A I, TW nh ah Rid 3 SR x PRAPEIRY Tge NER $e BS in po 3h x 8, All right, sir. Would you <¢ontinue with Page ¢, 

k ow » en ™ & ai oh gS hy PIN a a BN RI dW RTA Lh Be » wn 2 ww ix 2 A Jowersg: Can you tell me approximately where you 

wore standing in the store when you were watching the employees? 

"EeClesky: 1 was standing behind the counter, lean- 

ing across the counter, just watching the people that were on 

£F wy a gi FO PT No a EE 9 pe an oy PO SOIR, SAW Jowerss:s Where was Ben Wright? 

th a 

 



  

"McClegkys 1 don't know, 1 did not see anybody 

behind me. 1 just heard some drawers moving. I was watching 

the people to make sure that they wouldn't move. All that I 

know is that they came through the side entrance. 

"Jowers: Did you see the police officer's vehicle 

when it came into the parking log? 

MceClesky: Yes, 1 saw him when he pulled in. 

Jowers: When you were standing and watching the 

people lying on the floor, could you also see the front door? 

"HeCleskys Yes, 

"Jowers: Where were you standing when you saw the 

“¥MeClesky: 1 had already made my move from behind 

the counter and I was leaving the gtore because it was taking 

them too lotig. 

"Jowars: Did you tell anyone in the store that you 

vere leving? 

"HMeClesky: I didn't say anvthing to nobody. 

"Jowers: What was your approximate location when 

the police officer enteved the bullding of the Dixie Furniture 

Company? 

HoClesky: Going out the front door, 1 was over to 

my left laying flat on the floor approximately ten feet from 

the door.” 

5 How, was the information on Page ¢ given to vou 

 



  
  

ain to Obt go 
Ay Lh at thre 

 
 

forma 4 in 
£ 

that 

rRCOTG gud d ') 
A, 

iy 
[§] sir. 

A y AQ { 
ph age j# 

AJ 

¥ a 
id ¢ 

% a on be xh 
Fibs BK Ld 

1 
& 

prt ing fa et # HH wi 
2 # 

heard 

3 [<1 

» 
RE ght sor ig ) wid 

vi Len "Yhere was oy eo 
x 
[Ey 
i'n as} #141 

wr 
¥ ww 

NY 

CEL 

hk 1 pA LJ irawer ~~ 
Le 

aan Lhe in rawers 
By 
a 

ba 
suites od 

Of way 

RT AL LR 

IW TE 
v 

£35 

 



  

See 

he gtepued 
I 

from 

couldn't 

approx im 

LW 

pecause 

him time enougn to g 

the police oificer 

8 MeCleshky s 

where I was laying on the floor, was 

gee nh 

ately how many 

shots? 

"rcCleaky: 

Hee n I could 

et 

Blowers: 

after vou heard the 

"rcCleskys 

up when the shots were 

SLOre.. 

"Jowers: 

shot? 

the 

"HeCleskys 

as he stepped through the front door? 

I couldn't see the police vfficer when 

door, and the only thing I could see, 

his feet, but I 

after the police officer passed by you, 

seconds had passed before you heard the 

1 would gay about fifteen seconds, 

legs go by me, and I was trying to give 

on up there to the counter. 

pid you get up off the floor, before or 

shots? 

It happened in the process, 1 was gettin oh # fF J 

-~ 

fired and I immediately fled from the 

Did you know the police officer had been 

* 
be Ho, 1 didn't have any knowledge that 

anybody had been shot, because 1 thought that the police officer 

gpotted me running out the door and was shooting at me. 

"Jowers:s Are you sure that you were standing at 

front door when the police officer pulled up? 

SrcClenkys 1 an positive.” 

¢ How, was that information given to you freely and 

Ln
 4 

A 

 



  

voluntarily, sir? 

A Yes, 8ir, it was. 

Lt vias any force or duress or promlses made to obtain 

that information? 

#4 tly Bile 

# Would vou read Into the record Page 11. 

A “Jowers: When you heard the two shots, how many 

"HeClegky: Two shots. 

"Jowers: What did you do after vou heard the shots? 

"HeClesky: I immediately ran out the front doors. I 

ran to my right, ran down to the corner, back to my vight, and 

ran cown to where we had my car parked. 

"Jowerss Who was at the car when you arrived? 

wn » peCleskys It seemed to fe that everyone was 

arriving at the same time, 

"Jowers: Name the people that got into the car with 

vou and fled from that location where the car was parked. 

"MeCleskys David Barney {sic}, Ben Wright, Bernard 

upree. 

*Jowers: Where did you go wheh you left the Dixie 

Furniture Company? 

"HeCleskys All of us left together. We went to 

Pupree’s house, 

"Barris: While vou all were in the car after the 

 



  

robbery, did you all have any conversation pertaining to the 

shooting, which occurred at the Dixie Furniture, located at 

593 Marietta Street? 

"HoCleskys The only conversation that I recall, 

was that everybody was confused as to which direction we were 

» 

going to go. This is when Dupree sald that we could go to his 

"Harris: Have you discussed with the other com- 

panions who shot the police officer at the furniture store? 

"McClesky: Ho, I have not discussed it,” 

§ dow, was that information on that page given to 

you freely and voluntarily? 

HY Yas, Bir, 1t was, 

Q Were any threats, force, or promises used to obtain 

A Lo, 8 iv, 

{ All right, sir. Would you read into the record 

a DR a 0 ¥.. MC a Tall o nd ib 4% of & & a , " >a - 

A rage li. Jowerss What type 01 weapon were you 

Carrying? 

¢Cleskvs A ,22 revolver, brown handled, black 

 
.
 8 Jarrell, 

"Jowerss Where did you get this weapon from? 

"MeCleaky: I aot it from Ben Wright. 
4 po | 

¥ oie Non i INE A] FP 4 4 8 an b= Fags in <3 TRY F = SWAPRER 
Harriss When 41d you get the weapon irom ben 

at” | 5 7 

   



  

2 

MocClesky: Rav 13th, 187 

Cars. I was driving and Ben handed ne 

*Jowerst What did you do 

4 
~ the robbery? 

1 gave it to 

"Jowers: How long have y 

Barney [sic}?" 

Q Stop right there, 1f vou 

MR. PARKER: Your Honor, 

the Btate would move to onit a 

Mr. Jowers was starting to read 

MR. TURNER: That's agree 

THE WITHESES: Okay. It w 

Homicide secretary, Mrs, Offutt 

¢ (By Mr. Parker) ead the 

gave to your 

§, while we were in ny 

the weapon, 

with the 

Wriaht, 
wt 

Ben 

ou been knowing David 

would, 

with concurrence of coungel, 

of the angwer that part 

» 

able, 

as at this time that the 

answer there that Mellesky 

A "Jowers: How long have you been knowing David 

Barney ([sic}? 

"MeCleskys: I met David back in June of '77." 

{J low, that is when what happened? 

A “he Homicide secretary, Mrs, Offutt, she came in 

3 RR. BE TI Se 
agtarted Lyping. sie and 

% 38 # # 3 n to aie PF a Ta nw 8, HOw dO you know that, six 

A well, Nrs. Hargene Turney 

  

7 

= ¥a 4 an ve Bou on ny won 8 rey a r Bt the time she stopped,



  

she put her initials behind the last statement that was nade 

by Hr. MeClesky and she initialled it "MRT". 

Q All right, Continue, please. 

A "Harriss Nr. MeClesky, you stated earlier in your 

statement that after the robbery, you and your other companions; 

went to Dupree's house, What did you all do when you arrived 

there? 

"McClesky: VHhen we arrived, we went on the inside 

of the house and everybody immediately changed clothes and 

after they had counted all the money out and split it up, 

Dupree remained at home, David Burney went in another direction, 

Ben Wright and I left together and I took him to Hcbaniel Street.” 

Q All right, sir. Was that information obtained freely 

and voluntarily from Hr. HeClesky? 

§ Was an force, threats or promises used to obtain 

that information? 

Q All right, sir. Would you continue? 

A Page 13, “Harris: Hr. MecClesky, what share of the 

money did you receive, once it was divided up? 

"MeClesky:s It was §160 or $180, I can't be specific. 

"Harris: Have you ever seen Ben Wright with any 

weapons besides the ,410 shotgun and the ,22 caliber revolver 

that you made mention of earlier in your statement? 

 



  

I have seen with another kind [sic 

  

But I dg Lind 1t was or where it cane fron 

Bf ws wean of gy ay Pl Shas 3 pou po 4 Ya be Ean Phi Yori ga 1% po pa ary is bd AN YOu descrioeg the one that You seen 

PT Re CC . wo | 3 4 TR waa Se Baa ny 53 Th x or Fo] od Sol IF 0 BAY it wag 8 iver ? chrome It oda #4 tex reveliver “* 

a1 STREP IONE. Sl Pag NE on Sy 13 ARTE PREY EET ON NR Ney Yar EG ise AED SOU recall where You WELT ane Dow LON 

BOO 1t vias when vol gems Ps fn weanona 
is wiga sy WII Ji Baw Lila 8 Ay 4Rle Fa 

It was about a weel before the Dixie 

  

Purnitore Store robbery and at that time, Ben was Keeping the 4 ’ be pe 

un with him at all times, He sald he thought it was "hot! and 

EY a be ge 4 x gs 
p LHORGaHaL 18. 0r hed 

2 LE oe RE Sat age SW AAG TR wf a - "wy FB he ET ain 3 - THY EE ¥ a A SON WAS Keeping the gun with him at all tines. ae 

sald he thought he was 'hot' and he didn't want to get caught 

  

Au 3 rh 4P dy, ooh ws dn 3 di - 0 Py sn EN gon i Hh wi kw A p 5 i fh empty-handed, rept it on his person at all times, 

JOWersgs: Have you been advised of your Constitu=- 

tional rights? 

"HeCleshky: Yes. 

"Jowers: Did vou understand then? 

"MeCleaskys Yes, 

By PH 8 aaa Ea ky Bow bb R PE SO RRL er, J po ‘Jowerss Were there any tricks or promises made to 

: TR A at a ER RN I a ew hn aims we ae 
you tO incuce YO AF BERG CHAE 8 LO answer these 

  

questions? 

8 oc 8 Bm dle ak gs he. 
ind ab gtatenent PS 

x 

7% » ¥ ~ 5 3 A AS Sor Ea ais Te Re ch Bs pn ee Tg CR on ¥en Py ik % All right, sir. kow, after the typist finished, 

 



  

how wag the 

# 

given to Mr. McClesky and I asked him 

he agreed with everything 

ne 

statement, 

corrections 

statement, 

# 

a 

could sign it. 

what 

  

statement handled at that point? 

At that time all -~ let's see, thirteen pages were 

te read over it, and if 

that was in it, that had been typed, 

If he did not agree with what was in the 

had been reduced to writing, we would make any 

that was needed. At that time he resd the entire 

Pid he read it aloud, sir? 

Ne, 8ir, he -= ne just picked it up and started 

looking at it and finally he looked up and said, "Ckay.” 

chat he had 

- 

» 

Did he sign each page as he went or did he sign 

one time? 

I really don't remember exactly which procedure. 

Did you then withess the statenent? - 

Yes, sir. At that time I signed it, witnessing 

the statement. signeq 

All right, sir. What was done with Mr. NeClesky 

at that tinpe? 

A I think after he had signed the statements, at 

that time he was transported to the City Jalil, he was arxreésted, 

Placed in the City Jail? 

ies, Sir. 

And is that same bullding? 

Yes, 81t. 

-40l= 

 



  

1 Did you have any more conversation with him that P
y
 

E
w
 

day yourself? 

A Not that day, sir; however, I did --.1 did talk to 

Mr. McClesky on the -- let me get this. It was on June the 2nd, 

1978, 

What was the occasion of ti w
e
 

t
d
 

- fx
 

ih
 

oa
 Fs)

 
M
H
 

- 

go
d 

La
t 

A Gkaye I was =~ I came -- I walked into the Homicide 

Qffice and 1 saw a newspaper that was on the table that had 

pictures of the defendants, and at that time 1 realized that 

Mrs, Thomas, who we felt at that time was a very key witness, 

it was pogsible that she could have geen the plctures, so I 

immediately called at the Dixie Furniture Company and I went 

through the procedure of insuring she did not see the paper, 

ah or
 a stated ne, that the paper was still folded and laying on 

the table. I talked to the manager of the Dizle Purniture 

Company and I asked him to secure the paper, 80 we could be 

sure she did not see the pictures; however, we later discovered 

that this paper did not contain any pictures of the delendants, 

She was later d¢iven transportation to the Homicide Office, and 

at that time I approached Mr. MeClesky and I advised him that 

we wanted to conduct a lineup go it would give us an opportunity 

to let our witnesses view him, 

O This was on June the 2nd? 

-504=- 

 



  

ow 

A And it was at the City of Atlanta Police Department, 

and the lineup room is located in the rear of the third floor at 

the police department, and we have a door that goes directly into 

the City Jail, so I went over and 1 brought him over through the 

back door into the lineup room, and at that time Mr. McClesky 

stated --— refused to appear in a lineup, he stated that he did 

not wish to be represented by & State appointed attorney, and 

I asked him how long would it take to hire an attorney, and he 

stated approximately a week, because of the problems that he 

was having. Because of the case that we were working on, 

Detective Harris and I decided that it would not be in the best 

interest of the case to force him to appear in a lineup, and at 

that tise he was allowed to -~ he was returned to his cell, 

GQ Now, where was Mamie Thomas at this time; was she 

in the vicinity at all? 

A Yes, sir, she was in the Homicide Office. 

ao
, 

i
 

a
,
 vhere was Hr. HeClesky? 

A He was in the rear at the lineup room. 

& All right, sir, And can you see from the Homicide 

Office into the == 

A HO, Blr., 

U - 13 feup room ? 

A Ho, Bir. 

v And what prevents you from seeing in there? 

A bay again, Sir? 

Fad E. 1 1 

— iyo 

 



  

& Why can't you see from the Homicide Office in there? 

Because there 1s a room =-- there ig two rooms that Le
 b
e
 4

 
a 

vou would have to go through before you could get to the lineup 

LOOM. 

¥ and how would dr. WMceClesky be taken to the lineup? 

A Directly from the jall., We have a door that leads 

directly onto the third floor of the jail. We have a special 

key that we can use to go through that door and go directly 

onto the third floor at the City Jail, and we bring the people 

that we are going to use in lineups or in custody straight into 

the lineup room, and as soon as we complete the lineup, they go 

straight out of the lineup room back into the jail. 

Wd Would he have passed the Homicide Office at any 

time? 

A HO, Bila 

g Wag Classie Barnwell there on this day? 

A Ro, sir, not on thig days 

Q To your knowledge, has Warren MeClesky ever appeared 

in a lineup at the Atlanta Police Department or any other lineup 

that you know Of? 

# To your knowledge, has any of the victims in this 

case, the witnesses, viewed Mr. HMeClesky that you have had 

anything to do with or anything else you had anything to do 

si EE 

witns 

at TL 

 



  

aeen 

Q bo you know of any lineup at all Mr. MeClesky has 

in? 

A HO, 8ir. 

Q is that the only other time vou have had conversa- 

with Mr. MceClesky? Was that the last tiwe, on June the 2nd? 

A Yas, sir, that is the last time that I think I talked 

to == 

the 

ALLO 

give 

Po gal 

them 

$ Did you have any conversation with him on the day of 

preliminary hearing? 
wh 

A HO, Bir. 

&
 Q Did you speak at all, good morning or anything? 

A I don't recall, 

HMRe PARKER: Your witness, 

Ey FY BRE a YA BT ERY 
CRUG S~ELAAMINAT ION 

0 How, you stated that in response to the District 

rney's question on each of those pages the answers were 

n truly, voluntarily and freely, is that correct? 

A Yes, sir, 

Q dow do you know that? 

P 3
% 

|
 -= 1 gather he was asking did 1 have any force 

net him like a weapon or something that forced him to make 

« 1 was only testifying that he freely and voluntarily made 

statements in my presence, To my knowledge, there was no 

“HH 

 



  

persuasion made by force. 

#] all right. Do vou know what was going on in 

Hrs MeClesky's mind? 

A HO, 8ir. 

50 your statement about anything being {ree and 

voluntarily is vour own conclusion, right? 

A fy statement of freely and voiuntarily -- I think 

of == I never went that deep into the mind on that, but it comes 

to me whether force was being made, that is why I stated that it 

vas given freely, because ny definition of that would be had 

force been applied, twisted his arm, put a gun to his head, and 

that is why I said that. 

# Were you through? 

&£ YOu . 

} All right, S850 would 1t be fair to say what vou 3 xX 

meant was you didn't apply any force, vight? 

A Oh, ves, sir. 

# 5 po 7 o H NN " gm Sey Be p? ,y Ru oy oe 3 i, ° 5 py : § § " ve: a 5 - ov +, PO you know what had been done or sald to him in 

Marietta or on the way 

A ho, Bir. 

4 Okay. Let's start off with that. The last time vou 

saw Hr. #dcClesky in Marietta he told you he didn't know anything 

about it, right? 

A Yes, sir. 

0 How, at that time vou all had taken one of the ¢o=- 

— 2 Eo Ei 
au 

 



  

defendants into custody and gotten a statement from him, is 

that correct? 

A Yes, sir. 

£2 Whe was that? 

A His name was David Burney. 

{ Also you had talked to Ben Wright's girl friend and 

gotten a statement from her, hadn't you? 

A I don't know if they had a statement from her or 

not. I knew they were talking to her. 

8 Okay. And you algo had information from the victims 

or the people who were in the store at the time 0f the robbery, 

# 50 you had all of that information in advance, 

A Yes, sir. 

G Okay. bow, at the time that you talked to 

Mr. MeClegky at Marietta, do you know if he knew anything about 

the information that you all had? Did vou talk to him about 

the people that you had interviewed? 

A I really don't recall, sir. I don't really recall 

whether —-= it was a typical type of interview that I conduct 

always where I try to sense something, try to Plok up something, 

I give something and try to receive something, just an interro- 

gation type deal, 

at LW he 

 



  

QO Let's start with that. You say vou give something 

in order to receive something? 

A Yes, sir. 

{4 what do you normally give? 

A I will say something that I know to be a fact and I 

will see what kind of response I get, 

% 50 you try to psyche them out, is that what you are 

saying? 

A I don't have any degrees in psychiatry or anything, 

but == 

{7 Well, what I mean -- 

A Well, you say psyching outs I don't know about 

that. 

9, I'm sorry. Are you through? 

A Yes, 8ir. 

iJ What is your intention when you give sonéthing? 

A I am trving to pick up a response to see how they 

respond to it. 

§ What did vou glve Nr, HeClesky? 

A I really don't recall, I an sure I discussed 

probably some facts that I Knew about the Dixie Furniture 

Company, you know, anything that I knew that basically everyone 

knew that would be on the streets that wouldn't hurt the case, 

but at the same time, something that might strike a note with 

bh im ® 

G68 

 



— ——— S———— 

    

o Chay. Let's start right there, At the time the 

initial shooting and robbery occurred, the police department 

bought & shotgun had been used to shoot Ufficer Schlatt? 

Be
y 

n
>
 HO, 8ir. 

@ That never was the initial theory there? 

A WO, B1Y¥. 

fs Ridn't appear in the paper? 
= A k 

A Yes, it did eppear in the paper. 

J DO you remember how it got in front of the paper? 

A To ny recollection, an officer was standing out in 

front of the store yelling, "He has been shot with a ghotgun,” 

and from there the newspaper people started off and started 

interviewing him and we started conducting our investigation, 

and if the public thought there was a shotgun, fine. 

(2 “hat is the theory Mr. MceClesky was operating on, 

he agldn't know about the guns? 

MR, PARKER: I will object to that. He doesn't 

know what Mr, MeClesky knew sbout it. 

6 (By Mr. Turner) I will just put it like this, Did 

you have a discussion with Mx. MeClesky when you talked to him 

the first time in Marietta? 

A Sir, I really don't recall, i just don't recall 

whether 1 =~ I am sure I didn't give him anything that was true, 

because if the public felt that it wag a shotgun, we felt that 

it would be to our advantage. 

: a 
a Ow 

 



  

(2 Ckay. How, at the time that he was arrested, you 

also ~~ when I say you, 1 am talking about the Atlanta Police 

Repartoent, was also arresting David Burney, right? 

A Yes, 8ir, he was arrested about the same tine. 

& And he gave a statement, correct? 

A Yes, sir. 

G when did he give his statement? 

A fle reduced hig statement in writing on the 31st; 

but on the 30th of May he made a statement in the presence of 

Detective Harris, Lieutenant Perry and Mr, Lewis Slaton and 

mysell, 

® All right, How, in terms of that statement, had the 

contents of it been revealed to anyone else other than the people 

you mentioned who were in the office? 

A To my knowledge, I don't think so. 

Q | Okay. S50 there would have been no way for 

Mre McClesky to have known whether, say, Mr. Burney or anybody 

else had given any statements against him because he was in 

Harietta at the tiwe, right? 

A TO my knowledge, right. 

Q ANd there were no news reports on anything that had 

been sald, or did you hear any? 

A I didn't hear any. 

{J You all didn't disclose the contents of the first 

discussions you had with Mr. Burney, right == 

 



  

about 

Wan 

the people who took 4tE? 

your nat? 

kV) a S - 

4 & Ped # p34 i 3 i 

Po Fh oy we gk of in eb PER i Po ny ey $ on A 

of ONE aaa in LaeTG AB DO Way Le . F 4 ; 

”~ 

a BR 08 

7 ah gi 2+ & 5 3 Ng " on BY we. SHA po \ 
well, he didn't find that out from Ne 4 

rast thing he said to you 

know anything about it, right? 

The first thing he gaid to you when 

could 

in 

he 

have Known 

HO 

Marietta 

got to the 

Atlanta Police Department was that he wanted to talk to you, 

right? 

A 

to 

stick 

tr are 

tell you all about it, 

this 

2 4 yy 
’ a & “vy 

were the words he used? 

something to the effect that, 

they are trying to hang 

on ne," or words to that effect 

Bid you ask him what he meant whe 

£0 hang thls on me 

8 oa x 
wid YOu Fl 

tr 
bd 
# 

50 at that point the onl 

“471 

. ix aria fa 
Wasnt w 

thing he could 

this on me, 

Hen 
Ley 

 



  

TR Th Me Sra dl rs Ym Ie BA 5x wo AP INE Bead Tha? Te Ei Tv Ea ¥ vt 
referring tO was probably hary Jenxing and Dav id DUTNeVY » 8 

that right? 

*
 =
 Hy understanding is that they were holding news 

conferences outside and the TV was moving and news bulletins 

wera goming on. Shere were a lot of things going one In fact, 

as I stated earlier, I didn't know the pictures were in the 

paper until ~=- 

§ The statement from Mary Jenking and David Burney Le
 

weren't public knowledge, were they? 

0 pid you stop to ask him what he meant? 

0 Didn't vou think that was curious, on one day he 

didn't know anything about it and the next time you see hin he 

wants to talk to vou hecause he thinks somebody wants to stick 

it to hin? 

A No, sir, it happens. 

A it happens. 

9, It happens? 

A Yas, sir. 

¥ Do you know what happened in the drive from Harietta 

A No, Bir, I was in the Homicide Oifice. 

(& So you don't know what threats or anything else might 
a 

 



  

have been made or said to the defendant at thet time, do you? 

4 bo, BIL a 

U Cn that basis, how can you say when he gave you his 

statement it was freely and voluntarily given? 

A At the time that he gave the statement to me, he wag 

not -- in fact, as I stated earlier, we had a very relaxed 

atmospheres as 1 stated, I walked out of the office, I left him 

there, he had some clyarettes, he had some potato chips. He was 

talking to me and we were just talking in general, really dis- 

cussing things, it was a very relaxed atmosphere, and that is why 

1 am saying that I feel it was not given under any duress or 

pressure, because at the time he gave it to me, he was very k ¥ 4 be 

relaxed. Whether he was tense and upset prior to entering the 

Homicide Office, I wouldn't know, 

{J What 1 am saying, you don't know what had been said 

» 

Or done to him to get him to give the statement? 

% Other than what you did? 

A Just that he said he wanted to give it all, 

\¥ fou said the atmosphere was very relaxed? 

& You sald vou have been a police officer for eight 

years? 

Yen, sir. h
e
 

Ca
l 

0 Have you ever heard of the Hutt and Jeff interrogation 

-473= 

 



  

routine? 

A WO, B81rv. 

0 You have never heard of one situation where one 

police officer assumes the role in leaning on the defendant and 

the other policeman tries to soften him up to talk to him? You 

have never seen that used? 

A Bir, I haven't == 

QO Have you seen 1t used, and then you can explain it? 

A No, sir, not in that way. No. 

td What way have you seen it done, then? 

ps Gir, you know, every =~- every detective has his own 

way of interrogating, more or less talking to people when he is 

trying to get something out of them. 

[gic], is that correct? 

A I wag = 

. I'm sorry, Hr. HeClesky 

A Yos, sir. 

Le Bow, did you yo over the statement that Hr. Mo 

"J
j 

£
£
 

Jo
ta
 

£
 

o ~~
 

Ww
 

& 

gave you later to try and rify the contents of it wl 

check out the dumpster? 

0 What did you find? 

A i went te the dumpster and it was empty, completely 

QMpLy. 

474 

  

(Cl 20 you were trying to get something cat of Hr. Burney



  

5 CE a Ne oy pay 

THE LOUSY 

benne hearing? 

isn't this 

Are You. CEYyIng 

JACKSON 

to == aren't we trying to 

determine vhether what he said, he said freely and volun=— 

tarily? 

MR, TURNER: Your donor, what I expect the evidence 

to 

ne had been: told to say by 

of the inconsistencies Wg! 

I am trying to show even in 

them out, the gtatenents F 4 

didn't hold any water, and 

talking with these other 

ment. based on what they had 

THE COURT: Well, 

2B og 

he sald was sald {reely and 

true or not. 

MR. TURNER: 1 will g 

“hE COURT: A jury. is 

question of whether any sta 

Turney) How ig! Te 

As 1 stated earlier, 

two hours. It could have been a 

a little longer. 

of 

show 18 that my client at that point wag saying what 

other officers. Bow, in terms 

that I an trying to get into, what 

statements when he checked 

staterant vas one that 

reason for that is he was 

fice and had given the state- 

gaid, 

only question at this hearing 

jury's presence is whether what 

voluntarily, not whether it was 

& v et into that later. 

going to have to pass on the 

tement he gave was true or not. 

long did it take you to get 

I think it was approximately 

little shorter, could have been 

 



  

# 

and drinking cold drinks, right? 

A 

stopped and 

he wanted 

During this time vou were munching potato chips hy k : 

w 

Ho, sir. de wag eating. He at one tine «= we 3 

we sald he wanted to smoke a cigarette. ide said 

some cigarettes. He smoked a cigarette and he was 

eating potato chips, yes, 

¢; 

did 

one that he had signed, 

anc 

you take the question and answer statement? 

answer 

Oxay. 

You already had 

Why did you need to get into questions 

£7? 

A@ standard procedure with me, and, in fact, on any 

homicide that is recorded at the Atlanta Police Department where 

my name is attached to the question and answer session or where 

anyone is 

following 

progedure 

this hearing, 

giving we a statement, there will be immediately 

a question and answer session, that is standard 

with TRE» 

THE COURT: Again, that is outside the purpose of 

TURNER: I have no further questions, 

REDIRECT EXAMINATION 

BY KR. PARKER: 

G Did he sign the first page prior to the additional 

twelve pages of guestions and answers? 

A BO, sir, I don't think so, I don't remember, but 

I am pretty sure he didn't, because I wanted to complete the 

~476= 

 



  

tatenment, the question and answer 

him an opportunity to read the entire statement a 

he could sign it. 

“Re PARKER: May this witness cone 

THE COURT: You may go down, 

MRe PARKER; The State calls Lieutena 

Wa. Ke PERRY, 

Relng first duly sworn, was examined and testifie 

FAP TIETEVEN TOUT RD TR AT PA RBIRECT EXAMINADION 

$
=
 4 5X SE 

PARKERS 
raw 

LY $s 

| 54 v
s
 

Fo
ns
? vou give u please, . 8 your name, 

i Pa a go 3 " Py Te £2 ETT { ANG who do you work for, sir? 

Department, 

And what are vour duties there? 

Commanding 

All right, sir. in ow Were you working 

May the 13th, 

A I was, 

® 5 en 43 Rd fa Este R: BN 5% + 3 Th a, . % t RE a tr 5 7 ¥, AllGl Were you cirectling or attempting 

down? 

nt. Perry, 

td as follows: 

sir? 

the Homicide 

such capacity 

to direct an 

8% 
iY of the 

investigation into the shooting of a police officer? 

A That's correct. 

{ Let me call your attention to the date 

3lst, 1978. Were vou working on that day, sir? 

 



Fi Bre Pd 5H : a 

NM A205, Bail oe   Q bid you have an occasion tO go to Cobb County, 

Marietta, Georgia? 

A I d id ® 

0 And what was the purpose Of that? 

A To return Hr. Warren kKeClesky to our jurisdiction. 

2 and did anyone go with you? 

A Sergeant McConnell, 

0 All right, sir. And can you tell us what time you 

may have arrived in Cobb County? 

A We got there approximately 12:15, right after noon. 

0 All right, sir. And did you have any papers with 

FA Yes, sir, we had & murder warrant. 

J And that warrant was for who, sir? 

A For Warren HMcClesk 

{ And who had taken out that warrant, sir? 

A Sergeant HeConnell, 

C How, did you obtain custody of Warren MeClesky in 

Cobb County? 

A Yes, sir, from bheriff Bill Hutson, 

0 What time did you obtain custody of him 

A About thirty minutes after we arrived there, We 

went to his office first and viewed some pictures, and then we 

went to the jail, 

 



  

" All right, sir, How, you did take Mr. McClesky 

into your custody then? 

PX Yes, sir, upon leaving the Sheriff's Department, 

Q All right, sir. And what was the first thing that 

you did when you got Mr. McClesky? 

A First I handcuffed Mr. MeClesky in the presence of 

Sheriff Hutson, Bergeant McConnell and several of the deputies 

wiiile he was in the jail, I had Sergeant McConnell to bring 

the car to the loading area where the Sheriff accompanied us. 

Once we got into the vehicle, I advised Hr, McClesky of his 

rights. 

O fou did yourself? 

A Yes, sir, I did nyself, ves, sir. 

# What pights did vou advise him of? 

A That he did not have to nake any statement; any 

statement he might make could be used against him; if he could 

not afford an attorney, one would be appointed to him; the same 

statement that had been made to him the previous day. 

Q Did you go through his full rights with him? 

A Yes, sir. 

2 Did you advise him that he could stop answering 

questions at any tine? 

A At any time, AL any time he wanted an attorney we 

would stop asking him any questions, 

O All right, What happened then; sir? vo } a F 4 

7G 

 



  

A The next statement I made to Mr. HeClesky was, 

It looks like they are putting it on you," He turned and 

Putting what on me?" 1 said, "Shooting the police 

officer." At this time he stated, "They can't put that on me." 

in tne back, That was hig first statement. 

iJ All right, sir. liow, were you driving at that time? 

A Ho, gir, Sergeant McConnell wae driving. 

8. And had you already proceeded back towards Atlanta 

A You, Biv. 

#) and what route did vou take? 

A Came down the freeway. 

(3 All right. And what other conversation did you 

have with Mr. HeClesky? 

A After that first initial statement, lI.didn't really 

feel that Mr. MceClesky would talk to me at all. He opened up 

and we began discussing who was in the back, what each person 

was doing, Very readily he began to talk about where he was at, 

He stated he wag on the floor under a sofa when he saw the officer 

come in. At that time he stated that as the officer went by, he 

heard two shots. He said he first thought the police were shoot= 

ing at him, Decause he was trying to get up and. go out the front 

door. We talked about it in general, just where he was at, where 

-480~- 

 



  

everyone else wag at. 

# Can you approximate what time you left the Cobb 

County Jail, sir? 

A Vie got there around 12:15, and like I say, went to 

the Bheriff's Office and viewed some photouraphs that was made 

Cobhefore, We pust have been - there by his department the nig : F 

there thirty minutes. We came back down to the jail area, 

possibly around one o'clock, in the neighborhood of one o'clock. 

¥ And this would have taken the time to handcuff him 

and bring the car around? 

A When we left the Sheriff's Office then we went to 

the jail. At that time ~- 

Q Where is the jail in reference to the Sherifi's 

Bi It's across the street from where we were at. 

ffice is in the court=- 

house? 

EL _
 

o
F
 It's some Kind of a building, I am not familiar with 

it. He is upstairs on the second floor. 

£) All right, sir. Then you had to walk across the 

street to where the jail was, which 18 across {rom the courthouse 

there? 

A Te the jail, ves, sir, with the sheriff, and at that 

time we obtained our prisoner and came back out and got in the 

Cal» 

 



  

0 S30 you left Cobb County at approximately 1:00 P.M.? 

A I would make an approximation at 1:00 P.M, 

#; How, how long did the trip take back to Atlanta, 

approximately? 

A I would say probably twenty minutes. 

# All right, sir. How, what happened, if anything, 

after vou got back to the Atlanta Police Department? 

A We arrived at the station and we parked in the 

detective lot. We got out ar 

year elevator which cone 

floor and I met Detective 

oe 

to him. 1 told him; I said, 

that time 

fk GL 

JOwers, 

I left. 

& 

wd brought Mr. HeClesky up through 

to our floor, got Off on the third 

and MoClegky over 

LLB 
who think he wants to tell vou what 

; 
i I wag not with Hr. MeClesky 

td Did you stick your head in the room or were you 

present at any time while MeClesky wag giving any statement? 

A Ho, Bix. I was not there, I went to my office 

and 1 think he was in what we call the Youth Office, along 

secretary and the 

‘The Youth Of ¥ fice? 

invesatigators, 

A Well, it's an office, Youth Division, we were using 

their secretaries at that tine. 

9. Is that termed Missing Persons? 

A Missing Persons and Youth, ves, sir. 

# At any time did you threaten Warren HcClesky? 

a ¥ 3 i 
= 2 ads 

 



  

& HO, Sire. 

i Hid vou pronise im anvening? we 2 3 af 

a TR I | bo PETS a bos 5% at 47 H Rotning whatsoever, 

§ of i jo rq gn pk $5 i B TORE Gl, Sul EN ? § i A op L® Lid you tell hin what RAgne happen to him £ he 

didn't talk? 

A BO, 8ir. 

(2 Did you make any threats whatsoever? 

* Did you make any physical threats where words were 

not spoken? 

A MOL & One, no, Bir. That was the main purpose in 

me going. I don't usually go pick up prisoners, but in this 

ST But oh Wilay 4 2% OF on I went rnwself 21 Eh a ERI TIES Yur Lares LO ake sure bo AL Lica €3 5 LaLa [J Fo will LE wlll & W 2 EH f° SUPELVIEOY $3 EEG § oq we Ad A 62 

nothing jeopardized the prosecution of this case. 

Fike PARKER: Your witness. 

ad EE a TRO EB 2 ay CY rs 4 NE Pl FY 1 vy EY LROLGS-EXAR IRATION 

  

8 When you went to pick up Mr. McClesky, do you know 

if that is the first opportunity he bad to find out that he was 

pDeing charged with murder in this particular case? 

& 1 assume thet it would be the first, because the 

warrant wasn't drawn until that morning. 

§ All Tight. BO when you cane to get him that was 

the first he knew about being held for any murder charges, 

 



  

= A I don't know what they told him in Cobb County, 

I couldn't answer that, 

{4 All riaht. 

you initially met hin? 

Fis Very little. 

vision inside the holding 

I think he said something 

had surrendered, 

that is when we 

F
W
 9 All right, 

Cobb County? 

A Sergeant McC 

QO All rights: ® 

back? 

sttitude 

Th 
iii 

er something to that effect. 

went to the 

onnall 

here 

the right-hand 

* 

BAIL» 

when first you ¥ 

~ d you all have any discussion when 

w 

I think he was watching the tele- 

area when we first went in the jail. 

about he had just noticed Mr. Dupree 

Other than that, 

How, who was driving on the way to 

drove up and back, 

¢ 

were you sitting in the car on 

side next to Hr. MeClesky, on the 

back seat together QO So vou all were 

then? 

A That's correct. 

O He was 

right, 

RO you know anyone by 

bandcuffed? 

the name of Earl 

 



  

& Farly? 

{ tar] lee? 

Fi bayrl Lee? 

A There 48 a sheriif, bari Lee, 

{J all rights Where is he the sheriff? 

A Bouglasville, 1 believe. 

  

{ Alli rigatc. Bow, he was invoived in the Enowles 
po | J 

killing, wag he not? 

A That's correct. 

& isn't it a fact that you told Hr. dcClesky that 

should do the same thing to him that Earl lee did to 

A No, sir, that is not the truth. 

9, You didn't mention anything about Parl lee 

ap £0 Mr. HoCleskys: 

* GO iow, you say that he openec up in response 

you said to him, is that correct? 

A That's correct. 

& Why did you make that statement to him? 

Knowles? 

A You don't know whether a man is going to talk 

you start talking to him, 

# Okay. How, what was your purpose in going to 

that day, to interrogate him or bring him to jail? 

A NO, it's to bring him to jail, I usually talk to 

—d 
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Ea ox 3% Pog wv i Yk ate NL th 
wigtneyx tiiey Wall x PRT PT YT TE Lr = gh PETERS pe 

people 1 have in CUB LOAY » 

LO 

outgide the pres 

TN aN ia rd we he Pn Be a 4s Toa 
Le electrocuted 1a ne 

5 ) Th sy 

FES Ny BAL, 

t 

think vou 

have no explanat 

he would actually talk 

eACuBsed 

Sd TN ag Ca, 
i 8 , & LER EUNES AN 

» * 

baing £irst Quly sworn pie < F 4 

oy ath PAR FEEL Ey a 
Cidh es  EOANARGHS 

42 Would you 

£4 HY hame 18 

  

Hargene



  
yr a &! And who do YOu wWOrK withd 

A gureau of Police bBeérvices, dissing Fexsons. 

£4 # y fn Pk x 5 nA 4 & yg Vos gin cm 004 NT ¥ 4 ho PRL ET Re ST a WO wn A , ARG how long have you been with the police depart- 

Fg ol § . un $s, is "Fa jaa EC TL Si 
& SdRCE EeCERMOEX Lhe L3Xd, 4700, 

i SINCE 4YbUY 

¥ What are your duties there? 

3 £ on am "w , a Rr RR er A gn sw el 

£4 wdliCe ualiGal'y QL L210. 

& All right, Dow, 1 call your altention to the date 

wy A BS ao a Ta ot Se PO TH fi } by SPE pas 8 vars we te Fn ve pri x 3 - FGPG TE Wh CL May the 3ist, L9%/¥s Were you working on that date? 

A Yes, I was. 

9 Lid you —-- were you requested, ordered, instructed, 

. vy a EEE Wk gh : By pin gn 8 YLT so gn pw pe pa *Y 4 ¢ 3 ho J to type a statement Ly one Warren fHcCiesky? 

A A + He ~ fo Py pe 2g pL VE ¥ a i Mer SR) ME fd at ah 
#4 Hy 4 Wah TegUaBied OF LeleCTiVe JOWaIR. 

Wow Detective Jowers? Eo
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8, How, did he have anyone with him at the time he 

Calg over and approached vou? 

A It's possible it could have ween Detective Harris, 

but I'm not too sure. 

8, All right. Did he have anyone in custody at that 

time? 

A Yes, he had Warren scClesky. 

{2 MO you see him in the courtroom today? 

A Yes, 

s Would you point him out, please? 

A [Witness indicates.) 

{) He 1s wearing the white sweater? 

A That's right, with the moustache, 

dR. PAREER: May I have the record reflect she has 

ldaentified the defendant on trial? 

THE COURT: et the record 

4 
8 

© hin talk, I li 

£58 reflect, 

Q (By Hre Parker) What did you do at this tine? 

stened to the statement, 

and he was asked several questions oy Detective Jowers, and later 

by Detective Harris, and he wag fed Dy Sergeant == by the sergeant 

in Homicide, and I stopped taking his statement because I had to 

GO hone, 

Q And what tire did the statement start? 

A ADOUTL == it was a little after lunch, I guess about 

A £3 EY 
hank - 2%] Rd  



  

  

pe
 i and when did it complete or when did you go home? 

A I left going home about six, 

4 Hz UD Peli, 7? 

Ey an eB p A That's right. 

#] And what are vour normal hours? 

& Bight to four. 

{J S80 you were working overtime that day? 

That's right, 

er How, how did that statement =-- how was it given to 

1a? be!
 

O 

A Well, the first statement, okay, Detective Jowers 

just told him to tell me anything he wanted to and I will type 

it down. 1 took the first statement and it wasn't good enough, 

and he gave me another statement, and then a guestion and answer 

gession followed, 

A That's right. The first page is directly, is his, all 

{ You say there was one torn up prior to that? 

Fo
o That's right, The first page, you know, was just 

talking on it, and he said something on there he didn't agree 

with, 80 he said, "You have to tvpe it over." 

O Who sald that? 

bd, * B dhod  



  

  

0 What didn't he agree with? 

A I don't remember what it was. We just tore it up 

and started over again. 

¥ Whose ldea was it to tear it up and start over? 

A It's my idea to tear it up. There is no need to 

keep it, you are transferring one thing to the other. 

J Well, did Detective Jowers didn't agree with it? 

A Yes, I think so, but, vou know, I am the one that 

is typing, and I have to transfer what is on one paper onto the 

next one. Like Warren was talking, he was telling me what he 

wanted me to put down, and probably there was a word that was 

wrong, or whatever, and since I was typing it and it had to be 

correct, you couldn't make an error, and it had to be correct, 

I just tore it up. 

Q 50 it was Mr. McClesky that didn't like it? 

A That's right, he didn't agree with what was on it. 

0 Appoximately how many pages did you type, do you 

A Thirteen, 

O Did vou type them ali? 

A HO, I typed up to thirtéen and I stopped. 

Q Did you put vour initials on the last page that vou 

typed? Did you put your initials on any pages? 

A 1 put my initials on the last pave that I typed. 

I show you what has been marked as State's Exhibit o
f
"
 

pn 34 hu  



  

3 

Humber 27. DO you see your initials on that page? bj 3 pay 

8; Ald dO you see a page number at the top? 

A Yea, 1 do. 

(2 Did you type beyond that point or did someone 

relieve you? 

A Someone relieved me at this point. 

# 50 you actually typed the better part of twelve pages? 

A Chay. 1f you count the {lrst page, which was his 

narrative, that is the one I added to this one, making thirteen, 

I believe, but it might be just twelve, Okay, 

THEI, COURT: Are you counting the one vou tore up? 

5Y 

LEE WITRESEY Wes HO, starting with that 

Okay. It's twelve pages. 

1% (By Mr. Parker) You did type twelve pages? & 

nregence the whole 8 
Now, was Hr, MeClesky in your 

time while you were typing? 

A Yen, he was, 

{ And did you see anyone threaten him? 

A No. In fact, I thought they were being too friendly. 

pvt 

Q Thought who was being too friendly? 

A The detectives, towards him. 

$) Wino? 

& Detective Jowers and Sergeant McConnell in Homicide. 

 



  

J What do you mean, being tou friendly? 

A sergeant HceConnell came in while they were talking 

back and forth and asked him did he want something to eat, so 

Sergeant McConnell went upstairs and got him something to eat, 

and having witnessed a lot of investigations, this was just out 

of the ordinary. &also, during this time, lcClesky was left 

alone with me a lot, and we talked, we just really talked, and 

I say, it was just out of the ordinary. 

0 Wag == do you know a Sergeant Sturgis? 

& Yes, 1 do. 

i Who is Sergeant Sturgis? 

A Ne 18 my sergeant, 

8 Was she in the room part of the time? 

A Just a little of the time. When she first came in, 

Jowers and MeClesky was sitting beside me, and MeClesky, you 

know, made the comment that she was really fine, but he didn't 

have time to lock at any women because he Knew where he was 

Going. 

* 
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 12 was going? 

Q Now, you say you and Mr, MoClesky carried on a fine 

conversation? 

A Yes, we did. We were in the room ~-- okay. Detective 

Jowers had gone out and he left kMcClesky in there with me and 

 



   

& What type conversation did you and McClesky have? 

A We were talking sbout being in prison, what do you 

do, vour sex life in prison, you EKnow, whatever. 

a 

¥, Was that pretty much the general nature of your 

A That's right. Ve didn't talk anything about, you 

now, the investigation, 

a
 How, vou say vou were with Warren Mellesky during 

the better part of twelve pages of statement? 

i Rl TE TI 
Fa That's r ight 

4 TRA ol wg pt y i> os A oy » Bs Wy 2% 0” Q Did you ever leave his presence? 

A HO, I never left his presence, but during the time 

£2 Plenty of officers came in? 

A They were coming in to see who did we have that we 

couldn't let them cone that far back with. 

& Did any ofilicer in your presence threaten 

A tio. Like I repeat, they were just too friendly 

0 pid anyone make any gestures where any words were 

not spoken? 

(J How would you describe Mr, HeClesky's composure at 

 



  

A Well =~ well, he began giving hls narrative, okay, 

he wag calm, He was very calm, but he was talking -- okay. Like 

the {first statement he gave, he, you know, he would say, well, 

God, that's not right, and he would say let me do it over again, 

but he was still calm, sort of nervous, but he wag caln. 

Mite PARKER: Your witness, 

CROSB=-EXAN IHATION 

Q You sey that that was a very relaxed atmosp oy 
—
 

Fo
n ene 4
 

£5
 

going on? 

A Yes, it was, 

Q They were giving him food? 

A Right. And I can tell you what they gave him, 

; What did they give him? 

 -
— 

wr
 A Coca-Cola and some potato chips. 

PE
 

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n
 3) Zz ; Sid Detective Jowers, what kind of 

relationship did you observe between Detective Juwers and the 

defendant? 

A If I hadn't known he was a defendant, I would have 

thought they were old friends, 

MRe PARKER: Excuse me. I didn't understand that. 

THE WITHESBS: 1f I didn't know Mr. McClegky was a 

prisoner, I would have thought he and Jowers were Old 

friends. 

Q (By Mr, Turner) How were they talking? - 

 



  

Sergeant Bturgils 

MeClesky sald, 

going, 

about 

with other people he is 

I won't be seeing any wom 

i 

was 

where 

A 

& 

A 

{ 

% 

£5 

twenty-five 

a 

I am going to repeat one 

walked in, somebody sald, 

"I can't worry about that because of 

an a long time." an for 

Po you know what prompted 

there any discussion between Jowers 

he night be going? 

IL I 

Low, have vou seen Detective Jowers 

¥ 

interrogating? 

Yes . 

dow many times? 

More often than not. I would say out of 

prisoners I have been in his presence, 

all of them, really. 

80 that general way Of «= 

That is his general way. 

why did vou y it's out of the normal? 

Because I have never seen them offer any 

clgarettes or whatever. 

50 that is where the companionship comes 

That is it. 

where I 

hat about where he 

act that 

nut 

was 

and Hr. HcClesky 

way 

at least 

you. Know, 

prisoner 

iow, what wasn't good enough about the first page? 

I don't == I <do not even remember, Like 

whatever once 1 typed, you know, he dictated 1 typed 

  

+ $414



  

gave it to him, and he said, "No, this is not right." 1 

remember him ~~ like he was demonstrating he was hiding behind 

some furniture and the officer walked in and he left and I 

think == that might even be it, I don't even remember. 

# Ukay. How, was Detective Jowers on a first 

basis with Mr. HeClesky that day? 

A He was calling him Warren, 

L® Have you ever heard him say Hr. HceClesky to 

A Yes, 

{ When was that? 

A Throughout, throughout the interrogation. 

na na 

You Know, 

he would change from warren to Mr. HMeClesky. It was really 

Hr. FeClesky during the question and answer session. 

GQ But Warren otherwise? 

A Yes, sir. 

MR, TURNER: 1 have no further questions for the 

4 5 3% Fo WE RD ¥ . ¥ ow uh 4 J tL, ns DRT 
Mile PAREKENS: May this witnegs be excused? 

MRe TURNER: lio, I would liike for her to stay 

during the rest of the term of the trial. Since 

L$
 an employee, she can be put on call. I have no ¢ 

THE COURT: You are excused, ma'am. 

HRs PARKER: "The State calls Pat Qffutt. 

BND TTA PAY LIED CIO 
PATRICIA ABN OFPUTT, 

is 

 



  

being 

oo 
y 

BE Fike 

a 

get 

oh 
ow 
Hn 

ye
, 

Ph 

Fa 

£3 LF ho 

i 

four &na 

  

Wit = 3) SWOLD , 

Would you give us your name, plea 

Patricia Ann OQLiutt, 

JF Sa Bo 
A000 0F WAOM are 

1RVEe been with then? a)
 how long you 

VEEES. 

And how long have worked in Homicide? 

Six years. 

Wheat is your normal duty? 

4:00 P.M. to midnight. 

All right. Do you recall whether or 

the 31st, 19787 

1 
WAH» 

dt PO you recall whetherx 

gtatenant = 

by Lhe name 

Yes, 81lYr. 

and why did you get involved in that or how 

involved? 

follows 

not you were 

Because Margene Turner was supposed to get olf at 

I relieved her, I came on duty at four, and she 

“b§~ 

was in



  

ner? 

that 

re 
YOu 

the 

ten 

Be 

iad 

init 

pick 

process of taking the statement, and my superior officer 

me to go relieve her and to finish it. 

what time did you start -- what tine did vou relieve 

A I would have to estimate around six, something like 

+ lt was after I came on duty. 

GJ All rights And where did you go to relieve her? 

A “0 the conference room on the third floor. 

3 All right. How, who was there present at the time 

got. there? 

A Detective Harris, Detective Jowers, Hargene Turner 

myself as best I can recall. 

Q All right. Now, did you pick up in the middle of 

statement? 

A Yes, sir, 1 did, 

# And how was that interview being conducted at that 

3) when I first came in I stood there for approximately 

CG
 ~ rh
 

2ifteen minutes to where she could finish a page, becauge 

had just started a page, and then we stopped off in the 

le of the page, and if I can recall correctly, Margene 

lalled the statement where ghe stopped; I think, and I 

ed up, and it was a question and answer interview, 

# 

0 How much did you type, do you recall? 

A I think about three pages, three or four pages. 1I'n 

 



  

not certain, 

P
i
 

L
o
 

typing that 

& 

the pages 

i 

A 

£2 

A 

A 

{3 

read? 

A 

he signed 

put ny nape 

superior officers, 

that |! 

gach 

Could it have been 

Lhiave Deen, 

statenent? 

dy & DOR 1.3 OR TT JE rays. ne read -— the 

18g been typed == 

You say the defendant 

Warren BRcClesky. 

Do you see him in the 

Your pardon? 
& 

you iim in the 

se 
BL Q, 

him 

¥ jo 

page, then 

5 p rol 
On 1t be Liat 

we have 

then the pages, 1f I can rene 

Margene ty ped Fl after she left, 

WR roe 8. # 

QAO T & 

the 

read 

I think 

is 

to initial 

remenber correctly, 

then 

page 

1t wasn't long. 

was done after you finished 

defendant read the statement, 

¢ Who do you nean? 

courtroom today? 

gourtroom today? 

point him out, please? 

white sweater on? 

that had been typed to 

" er ri 23 £. on ws Bx fw -~ 
ie pages; and then after 

the detectives == 1 know 1 

the instructions of our 

everything we type, and 

the Ones that 

that he read then the 

—4 5m 

 



  

I witnessed that he had read and signed the statement. 

{3 All right. And during this whole period of tine | x 

was Warren MeClesky in your presence? 

GQ Uid you observe anvone threaten him during that 

time? 

A Ho, sir. 

(J pid vou observe anyone beating on him? 

A HG Bike 

2 Did you observe anyone making gestures or threats 

where words were not spoken? 

A Ho, sir, not in my presence, 

Q tnd did he stay in your presence until all the sheets 

A Right, until the statement had been completed end he 

signed the pages and they were withessed. 

0 All right. and then what was the next thing that 

you recall? 

A After the statement was completed and I left and the 

detectives were -- I left Warren MeClesky in the conference room - 

with the detectives and then I left and went back on duty, back 

2 TER TI Fy; TRE SR ¥ 
Pidhe FHDNIGIS LENA YOU. 

of HT 1%. Wy Sir RAE TY STAM TY ON 
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Hille TURDGEKS  



  

6 What time did the interviewing seasion, for lack 

of a better word, end? 

we 

A Bir, that's hard to say. Like I say, 1f I remember 

correctly == I know when I got there I was taking statements, 

you know, from some of the other people, and 1 was not aware 

that Margene Turner had remained on duty because they were in 

the conference room, I was in the Homicide Office and my 

guper ior officer approached me and told me that Margene needed 

to leave and asked me if I would pick up and finish the state- 

ment, so I immediately went to the conference room and I -—- as 

best I can remember, 1 started it around five or six o'clock. 

A And then after == I wouldn't think that it would 

take over thirty or ferty~five minutes to type, because I type 

ninety-five words per minute, so that was fast, you know, 

# 80 were you all through by about seven clelogk? 

A it would be an estimate, but I would say around 

6:30 or 7:00, somewhere alony there. 

HE. TURKER: ho further questions. 

HR+ PARKER: May this witness be excused? 

yg ¢ bo ] yo - 24 » 

MR. TURNER: Bhe may, Jour Honor, 

F “ ' « TCL 2% a ae Figg jo HE COURTS You may be excused, He, OLIutt, 

ER wy ay SFG Ny a Ta = . wae $a ox ow . id ~ a i o s a " W 

MRe PARKER: The Htate hag no further evidence at 

this point, Your Honor. 

THE COURT: anything from the defendant? 

MRe TURNER: Your Honor, 1 think -- 1 would ask that 

~501- 

 



  

the Court recess at this time since it is five o'clock. 

1f we put anything up in the morning, it will be very 

brief, so it won't cause any substantial delay, 50 1 

would ask if th $a
 » Court would recess until in the morning. 

THE COURT: Let's go on and put whatever evidence 

you have got up. We have kept the jury waiting for two 

hours. let's go on and get this matter disposed of and 

get back to the jury. 

MR, TURNER: I am really not prepared to go forward 

right now, 

WRT 1 said proceed, If you have any evidence, 

put it up; and if you don't, don't put any up. 

Mile TURNER: I am not going to put my client on the 

stand right now, If the Court wishes to rule on the motion, 

it may do so. 1 request that we be given a gontinuance 

until in the morning to put that evidence On, 

THE COURT: You don't want to offer your client now? 

MR. TURNER: I was not aware of the situation insofar 

as the situation as Margene Yurner testified. That leads 

down to a few other things I would like to discuss with 

my client first. I did not have a chance to discuss then 

with him because I just found out that she testified to the 

extent to which everything went on. I need to discuss the 

matter a little further with him, and I can't go further 

without doing that. 

Fol Ee 

 



  

THE COURT: You mean -- I will give you ten minutes 

to confer with your <lient. 

Mi. TURNER: Your Honor, as 1 said, it's going to 

take longer. If the Court does not want to give me the 

continuance, we would note an objection for the record and 

move on, but we do reguest & continuance on this until in 

the morning. 

THE COURY: Again, I want to offer you an opportunity 

to put vour elient on the stand but == 

HRs PARKERS Your Honor, the defense was the one that 

reguested a Jackson va. Denno hearing, it was not the State. 

THE COURT: i understand that. What we have been 

jury for me to pass on one question, whether what he said 

was said freely and voluntarily. 

MRe TURBER: Well, again, 1 have made ny recuest on 

that issue, If the Court does not grant it, then I am 

prepared to offer a few words of argument on the motion. 

rd COURT: All right, sir. Let me hear from you. 

RNER: Simply this, Your Honor, I think the 

Court has been around long enough, I asked the cfficer 

about the Mutt and Jeff routine, 

THE COURTs Certainly I have heard it. I have read 

more murder nysteries than I have heard in the courtroom. 

FENNEL HRe TURKER: What I am telling you is this, based on 

 



    

the testimony we have from the witness, Hs. Tarner, I 

think we can say at least insofar as Officer Jowers is 

concerned, he was killing the defendant with Kindness. 

1 think that indicates pure and simple deception on that 

level, 

THE COURT: It doesn't say that the police have to i 

do anything about not being nice, it says they can't trick 

him or force him into making a statement or offer him any 

inducement to make a statement, That doesn't mean they 

can't be nice today and disagreeable tomorrow, does it? 

MR. TURNER: Your Honor, under the circums ances, 

you consider the facts of this case, you had a police 

officer ‘who was shot, and you have other police officers 

acting like it's a Christmas party going on in terms of 

the interrogation, If the Court thinks in its wisdom that 

that doesn't result in any form of deceit and «= 

THE COURT: It would be improper for me to make a 

comment, I don't know if the police believe one word tha 

man said, That is not the guestion before me. The guestion 

is whether be said it freely and voluntarily, whether he was 

forced to say it. 

MRe TURNER: 1 just submit it on that level and note 

an objection in terms of the Court not granting a continuance, 

and we'll take it from there. 

CRY: Mr. Parker, anything you want to say? 

“S5Ud~-  



  
Mike PARKER: Your Honor, this is a defense mation, 

pure anc simple. I am attempting to comply with it. I 

am attempting to proceed on. She Court said we were going 

to go until about 6:00 or 5130 or somewhere. 1 told 

ire Turner exactly what I intended to put up and he has had 

these witnesses, the list of witnesses, he could interview 

HR, TURNER: None of this material was in the file, 

My first time hearing about it was on the stand. As a 

matter of fact, if we want to get down to it, Detective 

Jowers lied in his testimony several times. He stated that 

when he left Mr. MHeClesky in the office there was another 

detective there, yet you hear from her own testimony he was 

left there several times with her alone. low, that is one 

glaring inconsistency in the evidence. 

THE COURY: That would be a guestion for the JULY, 

that is not & question that presents itself to the Court, 

though, Mr. Turner. 

iRe TURNER: 1 have nothing further to say on it. 

THE COURT: I will rule that the State has carried 

the burden of proving what was said wag said freely and 

voluntarily. 

i Ail right, bring the jury back. 7 
“we 

(Whereupon, the jury returned to the courtroom, 

efter which the following proceedings were had.)  



  

B COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, I will ask you 

to be patient, There are certain things that have to be 

heard outside the jury's presence. 

right, proceed, Hr. Parker. Po
ot
 ve 

ad 

State calls Detective Jowers. w 1 2
3 y. 

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» La - » ~
 

» J ¥ we
 

F pe
i 

[5] ® Ka | OW BRE F 

having been previously duly sworn, was recalled and further 

testified as follows: 

[REDIRECT BAANINATIONR 

i Biv, I call your attention to the date of Hay the 

31st, 1978, and ask if you were working On that day? 

A Yes, sir, I was, 

And did you have an occasion to be in contact with 

Warren MceClesky on that date? 

15] Can vou tell us approximately what time vou came Into 

his presence or he came into your presence? 

A Yes, Sir, it was approximately 1:00, about 1:30 P.b 

on the afternoon of #Hay the 3ist, 1978, 

And where were you at thig time, sir? 

A I was in the Homicide Office at the Atlanta Police 

Department. 

J All right, sir. And how did Mr. HcClesky get there, 

 



  
 
 

 
 

 
 

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City of Atlanta, and this form is a "Waiver of Counsel bv 

Defendant in 

that is used 

is typed in, 

ment officers, prior to being questioned by 

SUL pec ted of 

of his Contitutional rights. 

ht, 8ir. And do you have the form that he 

Yes, Bir, I do. 

Would you read that to the jury, please? 

Custody”. It's a little different from the form 

in Marietta. 

It starts out, "1," and the name Warren HeCleshy 

"have been informed by the undersigned law en 

b 

. the offense of murder and robbery in Fulton County, 

State of Ceorgia, on the 13th day of May, 1978, and, have been 

informed by 

on gh Je a ro yd 
MBE any 3% od 

them ©f my Constitutional rights, 28 follows: 

[1 Bo a A pn mes Sel an Nd tit : adie % OR RAH Singh Une, that I nay remain silent and do not have to 

tement at all. 

3 7 Wp hy TE . NR Ro a A i eh an ol a RT Ne ee ee a TWO that any statement which I might make may ne F 3 3 bh 

| VEE $4 bo ed i £3 y Fig o> used against me in court. 

"Three, that I have a right to consult with an 

Statement and tO have such attorney 

me while I am making a statement. 

"Four, that if I do not have enough money to employ 

I have the right to have one appointed by the Court 

to represent mej to consult with him before making any statement; 

 



    

and, to have him present with me while I am waking a statement. 

"pive, that if I reguest an attorney, no Jguestions 

will be asked of me until an attorney is present to represent 

pig 

Inmediately following that we have a paragraph 

that says, "After having my Constitutional rights explained to 

me, I freely and voluntarily walve my right to an attorney. 1 

am willing to make a statement to the officers. 1 can read and 

write the English language, and fully understand my Constituional 

rights to an attorney. I have read this waiver of counsel and 

fully understand it. Ho threats or promises have been made to xe 

to induce me to sign this walver of counsel, and to make a state- 

ment to the officers. 

3 “This 3lst day of Hay, 1978," and again, I asked 

him to advise how many vears of school he had completed, and he 

stated the twelfth grade, and again I asked was he married, and 

he stated he was not married. 

To the side we have an area with a line where he 

signed his name, Warren MHcClesky. 

Then, underneath that we have, "All of the 

Constitutional rights in the above waiver of counsel were read 

and explained to the above defendant by me and he freely and 

voluntarily waived his right to an attorney. Ho threats, 

promises, tricks or persuasion were suployed by me Or anyone 

in my presence to induce him to waive his rights to an attorney, 

~509= 

 



  

wy cox A a de i ite be , Fg Ti i VG TR ln (Oe Ne i 8 ore 2 " 253 a statement without an attorney. He freely and 

slgned 18 anove waiver of counsel in my 

me AN " A ; ee RR 2 TR, IPL Se Ra in ae a 
read Lt. It hag an area to the side where 

presence 

RE 8 pan 3 w a pi ER in El a i 
Detective W.e BK, Jowers, and it was withessed uy 

Sturgis and the secretary Pgs Margene Turner. oo F 4 kip 

La 

18 she nale or female? 

Pata SSS RETR ON 
cid? LE 8 Teale, 

od Fo i TV WO on TIE TRI FP ETE Tes WS 02 8™ 3% & She 1s the sedrelary Joy lissing Persons. 

How, following that, did you proceed to take a 

Yes, sir, at that time I told Mr. McClesky til 

ahead and make hig statement about the incide 

shooting of Officer Schlatt on May the 13th, 1 

atta Ditreet. I advised him to go ahead and when 

ver me TH ph § ry Fal ol po A AM AW & | som po Te PT VS ee Hg bo 
making his statement, if there was soneth ing that 

$ 5 wn a a by esse oa de Sin x i ga a ad pod Fg Pe § [7 rs mnie wu 
CiGall up Or sone thing rr BONE additional inforuat 

nov 

% Sp ae wre 03 oe be Jon 8 gn § we ois. $n PIP I ATR. x. Sox om ta sin 5 US HF ao pr Be gs a 
B8I0CN, and &t nls time he stated that he understood, 

making his statement. pe
s 

Se
 

wd
 

0 iT
 

FA
5)
 

5 e
r
 

£ ~~
 

pa aiid 

All right, sir. And how long a sta 

  

object to it, I would conduct a guestion and



  

# £2 Re i an 0) 10% Fo pms Be pr Jos, rw go oh Wy £8 en BN a 
Fg bg dictated yo WA thout the aed L100 anG anpwey 

BRBBION, ONE padi, 

Ie TG Bove SNe 3 on 2 wo a npr Re AC PAP Se i oy “Iv gin 
it All wight, Bir. And would YOu read waa £ to the 

4 py per WY aa iD 
JULY, please 

A Yes, sive This is dated Hay the 3lst, 1974. It 

FY Yes, sir, the tine on it is l:24 P.M. , and it has 

“ 
(3 

b 3 his name, satatement of Warren Mellesky, home address 106d Janes 

Street. It should be Marietta, but it has Atlanta. 

“ Bea 8 wit 2X 2 oie bn win br & Fo Bs 4 nA TA i Pana OARRR 
A Saturday, day 13th, 1878; 1 left home at approxi- 

mately eight and went toe pick up Ben Wright, Then I went to pick 

up Dupree and from that point we went toe pick up David Barney 

[sicl. Then we rode. around talking about getting souwe money. Ben 

suggested that we try the Dixie Furniture Store. We rode around 

the block a couple of times looking at the Dixie Furniture Store 

pefore we could really make up our minds whether ve were going to 

go in or not. After we decided to go in and check it out, I went 

in and looked to see how many people were in there, Then I took 

the information back to them. After I gave them the information, 

3 we decided that Ben, Dupree, David would all go to the back door 

and that I would go through the front door. When 1 got on the 

inside, I got the people to lay on the floor and I just stood 

over them and watched them, while they were supposed to be 

-5l1l=- 

 



  

: 3% be ud yg a} y getting the money, 1 

and after having taken 

I Lecame very nervous 

towards the front door 

and, Just as 1 got to 

pulled 

sofa, 

clearance between the 

up the aisles I va 

Te t I could ease 
MLW { EY | wy LORLG asad 

under the furniture, I 

I immediately panicked 

$ 

because 1 did not know 

I did 

to get out-of there 

rot Goon, out of 

ai ter we 

Fr gos 
be £3 direction 

gi 2 ar Pl ~ t y i ES a 

go LO nls aouse, 

went on the inside, 

avid went in a 

SLOo0d there 

into the parking 

furniture 

furniture 

giving 

Gut the 

got to the 

After having 

changed 

approximately fifteen minutes 

86 long inside the store waiting On them, 

and jittery and then started walking back 

oe I got all the way to the front door 

the door, 1 saw the police car when it 

E
e
 

3 AOL. immediately crawled up under 

that front. 

the officer walkin 

him time enough to get up the aisle 

front deor, Just as I got up from 

two aunshots., 

and started quickly to the front door 

: ¥ oificer the had seen me and had started 

not look around to see. Hy intention was 

soon ag possible. Alter 1 got clear of 

the front door, I ran all the way to the 

car, everyone was really puzzled about 

So, Bernard Dupree suggested that we 

guickl 
wn arrived at house , we Y 

amd then we back out—~ clothes, 

separate direction; Bernard Dupree stayed 

at home; Ben Wright and myself left in the car. From that point, 

took him to Hebaniel Street to the poolroom. From that point, 

1 went to 20 Bowen Avenue whare I stayed for a couple of hours, 

and from that point, to Marietta. 1 was in Marietta up to that 

 



  

wi gr wn 
point a 

£1 $7, a ih ON . in og Ey BR 4 RY EP gs ” LF Now, was that one page given To you 

voluntarily by Mr. McClesky? 

Ey < wo £ wo 
# Yad yo 1V 

a; pid vou threaten him in any way Or use 

v aoe 4 pars 3 
PrOMLIECS Fd 

5.
 

o
e
 

pos
 

NOW 

then questioning # 

sir. At that time I advised 

object, if Hr. HMcClegky did not object at this 

% ol * Ta > ; ov A a won > ES a 4 PT 

conduct a guestion and answer BessSion. 

{4 All right, sir. Was this 

reduced to writing also? 

A Yes, sir, it was. 

0 And would you read the next page, ple 

A Yes, 8ir, this is Page 2. 

Wade 4 a ah 0 3 
Lhe egstion ana pe

 following is a ¢ ' 
Ww Wh 

conducted by members of the 

"Jowerss Prior Saturday, 

you discuss with Ben Wright or 

Dixie Furniture Company? 

RWS CORN we Bot Ed cartier TB 8 3 we ey Yeh Er) MeClesky: Ho, it wasn't discussed 

course of the time that we were riding, 

getting We were some 

  

following that 

him 

and 

answer 

May 13th, 

anyone else about robbing 

Coercion or 

you. continue 

if he did not 

ime, I would 

answer session 

sagsion 

1978, «did 

the 

turing the 

trying to find out how 

guggested to



    

get it from Dixie Furniture Company. 

"Jowers: On Baturday, May 13, 1978, whose automo- 

x 
- pile were you driving and what type of automgbile was it? 

"HeClesky: We were riding in a [sic] car, a 1971 

black Crand Prix, hwo=-door ha 

go 

Paul; WW, 

{J Did he state whose 

3 3% i " sf ae wi} LL BPP Teh ad 
pe tHe stated, "We were 

Grand LWo=dOoor nardtop, 

on ir * a all right, 

i 

on May 13tn? up 

Lr» % 
a "icClesk 

remember the name of the 

bree 

boy RJowerss 

Cl oe FF es ws He ¢ BeCleskvs - 

L Fa ~ 

jp & 1: BN 

"Jowergs Did you 

Jenkins! house? 

"Jowers: Did you 

13th? 

"MoClesky: Yes. 

"Sowers: For wha 

wid We 

Yatop. 

GO 

Where was Ben Wright when you 

It was 

street, 

RNow 

The fag number 1s 

eal 

a 18971 black Car ¢ 

¥ ut Oh Br TN 
48 Liilib the tag number 

ALeadl 

off Campbellton Road, I don't 

but it ig not toc far from lee 

5 Cr IRR Rl 
Mary Jenkins? 

pick up Ben Wright from Harry 

go by Mary Jenkins' house on Hay 

t reason? 

nt by there to pick up & sawed-off 

 



  

a Foy pr Bes 9 9 ox Hon gone % ETL gu ws » Be gin 7 wus ae Lot LT aa TET Nn An Re L shotgun, shells, tape and the black leather coat, 

Bir. Was the information on that page a
 

& 
EF
 

Po
d 

Fo
es
 

ef
 

Po
re
 

La
 

> w C
l
 

- 

given to vou freely and voluntarily? 

A Yes, Sir, it was, 

Th JAR ait Wa. 70. a Bae Foun obo are pit so a5 Po at he he pi ae Hag! - i.e eg i me AY Were any threats, Coercion or Promises made Lo dw 

Mr. HcClesky to get him to give you that information? 

A MG, Sirs 

0 All rights Would vou continue. 

A This is Page 3, "Jowers: Did everyone go into the 

house or did you go in by yourself? 

"MeCleskys Ho, everyone did not go into the house, 

Ben, Dupree, David remained in the car up on the corner of 

Campbellton and Ryan in my car. 

Md Mary Jenkins give you the sawed-off Riovwergt 

shotgun, shells and tape? 

"Jovwers: Did she also give vou the black leather 

coat? 

"McClesky: Yes, 

Po . a EF on wn Cy PERRY. bn 3 Bugs a TR nF SE he #0 FAY 
PJowers: Can vou describe the sawed=-OLI snotgun 

that Mary Jenkins gave you? 

"MeClesky: Yess It was sawed-off, .410 gauge 

it can't remember if it was shotgun, The BtoCk had tape on it, I 

white tape Or black tape. 

YJowers Can you tell me the color of the .410 

~515= 

 



  

shotgun shells that vou received {rom Mary Jenkins? 

*HMeCleskys They were red, 

TJowers: ‘what color wag the tape, or can vou tell 

me what type of tape it was 

"MeCleskys: The tape wap white, 1 think it was 

hospital tape. It was not like the kind that you buy in stores, 

it was a big roll, with some cloth in it. 

"Jowerss Can you describe the leather coat that 

you received rom Mary Jenkins on Mary 13th?" 

QO All right, sir. Was the information on that page 

given to you freely and voluntarily? 

A Yes, sir, it was. 

ie Were any threats, promises or coercions used to get 

Hr. HMeClesky to give you that information? 

EY No, 8irx. 

{} All right, Would you continue, 

A Yes, sir, this is Page 4. 

“MeCleskys It was black, three-quarter lengths, I 

don't know the size of it, but I had tried it on during the 

winter of '77, and the jacket did not fit me at that time, It 

was too big, 

RJowers: Where were you at when vou tried on the 

black jacket? 

"MeCleskys I was at Hary Jenkins! house, At that 

time, Ben Wright was living with her. 

~516~ 

 



  

"Jowers: Do youn recognize this coat? (Petective 

Jowers is showing HeClesky a black leather coat.) 

"iicCleskys Yes, This is the coat that I had when I 

7a
 

po
 

wr
 

rt
 

rT
 the gun and the shell from Mary Jenkins. 1 recognize this 

coat because of the black spot that is inside on the lining. 

"Jowers: Is this the coat that was used at the 

Dixie Furniture Company on May 13th? 

"HMoCleskyt Yes, 

*Jowerss - Who had this coat at that time? 

"HoCleskys Ben Wright carried the coat into the 

iHixie Furniture Company because when we got out of the car, Ben 

had the shotuun concealed in the black leather costs 

"Jowerst In your statement, vou stated that you went 

into the Pixie Furniture Company to see how many 

there, and you took the information back to them, When you 

i b) went into the store, did you talk to anyone that was employed 

ant into the furniture store on two 

different occasions on May 13th, The first time, I was looking 

at some items, not really carrying on a nversations, but 

getting some prices of some of the furniture. It was a lady 

that was behind the counter and I asked her the price of the 

YER ERS RR OW TES. RE TCE SR SOE t component set and she gave ne =—-' 

$ Was the information on that page given to you freely 

 



  

& Were any threats, coercion or promises made to get 

TT EF os Ie mee, 1 Bx Re 
that information? 

A HO 4 gir. 

& Will you continue. 

behind the counter? 

"HeClesky:s I can't really describe her, but she 
vb 

y 

a black lady in her mid-twenties, 

al “ ma 2 BY on via gn ‘ ¥ 

ieCleakys It is pessible, 1 don't remember. 

ye Eh We pn Bod dn, " oo A 3 3 Pala wee Saupe Wi of By . 3 ne me Fo ah ge oy VOWRY ES 2 How long did YOu remain in the store, a 

the lady quoted vou the prices? 

"MceClesky: Approximately three minutes, just bro 

around, and I left after I thought that 1 had the exact amoun 

people that were in the store. 

"Jowers: When you returned the second time, did 

come into the front or the side door? 

"MeCleskys I came into the front door. 

"Jowerss: Were you still wearing the same clothes 

BE i Tao le , © Jr ; moh de Pu of ge or J ia Wg PERCEPT WE CUE feClegky: Yes, everything except the shirt, I 

a or TR 34 VR TR TRE | RRR ¥ y oe Tf TY J is 4 A This 1s Page 5. -= the price, but I can't remember 

Jowers: Can you describe the lady that was standing 

Was 

Did you ask her anything about an unusual 

fter 

ys inne wi LY 

t of 

Ou wh 

 



  

changed 

sleeved 

freel: a 
oF 

stocking on up under it, 

n
l
 you ¢ 

material, 

into 

bs PE a TOI 
CO Me laniel 

  

and 

0 with it after leaving the 

shirt. 

erst Tong 4 {7a 2 a 
INI WICE Hero yeu 

"hcllesky: A hat, 

rJowars: 

information the on Co
 

3 

E 
od

 
ty & or

 

A
)
 gs HOW, Was 

PRP, Wo TE. i BEN 
voluntarily? 

S1Ts 3 a5
 = 4 

RET 
LL WJ 

RF rs 2% 
p44 

Were any threatis, induc 

soy gw For 4 : ro o Py % -1eBRY to give that 
aw 

YOu 

vOu gontinue., 4 
« 

ER a 4 Ph 

wid Ud i § [3 

+ EE a Nien s 
MoCleskys 

all I had to S50 

Over 

What color 

store? 

Was wf™% na, fon Bw oh bi iu MeCleskys hat was blue, Lp 3 Te 
431 $2 

with a he top of it, 

a dumpster. 

BY. . » a ng on ge Jowers:s Where was 

wea Street 

t ’ 
Crosse the 

tg aa 
Fr 2 vg 5d 

NE TET se dhe ye . : go ph SR RET 
LLC C,y WE Saw 8 GuUuilnipi 

sd ole 

hat rl 

on a short 

I had on a long- 

ge'given to you 

maents uged to 

and what did 

out 

the hat away 

7, PRL Som 
. we wala 

railroad



  

that wé did Dot want 

auupEtaer.  Pupree¢ anc 

This was in the proce 

Flowers 

“MelClesky 

RJowers: 

BHeClegky 

rowers: 

May 13th, 19782 

"MeClesky 

He had a pisto i 

left it in the car. 

Rowers: 

ace, too? 

8 Na ie WT HeClesky 

Be tbe oo) = ”~ , 10 SVR RAR 3 \ 
Had 1t One. Hecause 1 

back." the 

0 How, was the information on that page given to ’ Hey 4 

freely and voluntaril 

A gin gi TG PO TW 88 of oe taking be 

y? 

the sack into a 

Davida were not with ug at this 

MebDaniel 

this May 13th, edi 

» 3 Yan, 

HOw long have you been knowing 

Php ws > 
: AE J 144 

what type Of weapon was he garry 

4 tw or Log ie FR 1 PR $ - $4 2 : 4 Know Lor a fact that he had 

> don't know if he 

BLOCK 

had 3, hot I He = 

« 

4 Was any force, promises or inducements use 

Mr. HeClesky to give you that information? 

A NG, Bil. 

0 All right, Continue. 

= #4 FY *) 
AR 

  

t JOWeLS: statement, you 

-520= 

- 

» Pe 

“Ng © 

don't 

into the 

ime, 

Streets 

19787 

no Wright? 

L959 

over his 

know if he 

into the frent door, and they went into 

2 
£4 LG 

gtated



    

a 
¥ k 1 
8 that Qutb 

" 

£3 
3% 

HSJOWEYT S 

wy 
FO 

A 
% 

af & 8 wn ; 5 2 
GIG DOU RECON Yak ¥ 

. 
Y ke 

4 5 

BT oma we 
alae ITN 3 

know the LE 
Sala Ry Fi 

Richland, 

  

wha we 

Dupree wag carving 

  

le 

BUTO 

"lowers 

aise plcKed up 

get him? 

Eo % on Lag 
He a R2BRY 

PRR ll Fite, Fa 30h LF 
24 Li & El DYES » 

BOF ona pans we gn 
WwW ITS SZ 

we ak 4 FY X wu % 3 133 

CHEETYY OR Bay LC AD 

Hit onr™} » To 
Belek 2B AY 

avid 

A 
xh 

nase Bernard. 

ave 

gar VANE prea RR Le tx po gol friends until this ye 

1 AL WR SCTE a V4 
é aA PLCKE a 5% Rt } i at 18 

a Po, | t. a ’ hs Sas ae 
& THIBK Tha Lt Lae name of 

a 8 § oy oN gi Pa Wie Be i ad {hare my 3 1a ¥i 
Cascade near Lonnell Y av 

#6 CR pm hl a oon gon ss a Fos 2 
Ldll YOU GEC 108 wna 

: Gh 3 fn a Rs IVE 
i3 {4a hd x of Sa did Fd * See BB 4 Fd 

: I thought that it was 

Barney [sic]. 

  

PLS 

- 
gl 

&& 

However # 

ow hig first name, 

N&INQ , 

but I 

dupree? 

We 

I just knew 

PLE» 

weapon oo 
* 
iy cn 
2 5a: 3 

eddie 

ww Pe Y 3 Loo wi : BF es ve a oh 
: i picked him up from 117 

x ik Py. a I Us WP. gop or | 
wihiiat tv pe OL weaion did 

AH0OW e I.don't 

  

Pine 

“% 

i 

Barney 

Bernard 

1 an Lal 

Street, 

2 
{ oy ic] 

 



  

was sitting in the car, I never did sce it. ; ’ 

Jowerss Warren HceClesky, if I show you several 

photographs that were taken by our identification unit from a 

helicoper, showing the area around the Dixie Furniture (Company, 

qo . . 4 a aR a 2 5 »% “ PI a % iis " § a al rsa met Fa 5 ah %f 5, 

GO You think you Can show us wihere you ware paried an May 13th, 

$, Now, was the information given to you on thal page 

given freely and voluntarily? 

A Yea, 8it. is
 

WJ Were any threats or promises or coercion used to 

obtain that information? 

A HO, Bir. 

Q All right. Hould you continue? 

A Page Be. "HeClesky: Yes, 

trl a oa wn wn a pea LE " aa as » Es in 3 ai go un be ivi 
¥ohe aerial photograpiis are numbered from 1 to 7. 

leskys In photograph Humber 5, 1 can show you 

where 1 was parked both tines. 

"Jowers: Do you object to putting your initials on 

the photograph where you were parked both times? 

sleskys Okay, I will write 'firvst'® and I will 

put my initials and I will write ‘'second' and 

" Jowers: Marietta Street runa north and south. In 

what r
e
 rection was your car pointed in? 

5 2 ‘ 

"MeClesky: It was pointed in a southexnly direction. 

ney ia Nid ps an now end wah oan ing NS EE SR IRR 
OWED SS Bare vou Uriving the sane ar en Lo th 

_— ye ual 
wo Ae fir 

  

I will put my initials



  

wh He Be de WE hp iw J dn Be £ FP 5 prate = fo $y on ed ap 4 
occasions that you went the Dixie 

LL SV OI a ER A Te 
Mal iennys 

wt 

# " a A. 
WO Werss 

rn
 

Fa
 

a
d
 

& hit
 

(
3
 

t ~
 

Fo
k 

ES 

> Vo tad Ee RA we hun yw th in 
Ye DOW Bany people wake 

Bhd a TY a os BENE on a ae ami GR) Conn vx’Y py 
Molleskv: A108 Were LOoUur Deo ple 

first time, and four in the car the second tine. 

Bh Sg TX vin mn in 2 § PT RS | Is ow $s ig Tg ay % JOWErs: ame the people that were in the 

LE pa a Lr 4 2 USP 7 ES Ly OP Gene Wg a my dp ge on *HeClesky: Ben vWright, Dupree, 

"Jowers: When vou were in the store the 

what your job in the robbery? 

Sia pn 1 wy Lee RW v 2% Pe i ol og bor Yon 

: Fd SO I C6 Ky : ny was to watch the 

* liow, was the information on that } 
& 

freely a veluntarily? 

A YOH, Bly, iC was. 

4 Pe "5 bo Bo = 4 . » FT q prin pe, : “3 ” “ Pus i y S WETE any threats, promises or inducements 

3 ROR STTOR A | i SAAT Bk ue gs » bow Loins? that information from Mr. HeClesky? 

{J Would you cantinue, 

og FO 3 3a BR po 
2age 2. WMOWEeTHaS 

store when you were 

yeas? 

IRTP on Pre < 

MelCleskys I tara EB 
Vga dy 

-h 

ing the pecvple w 
counter, just watch 

where Was 

  

approximate 

watching 

the 

front." 

page given to vou 

Eo 3 
PERO 
used 

on the 

second time, 

the 

deaning 

floor,



  

i don't 

ening me. 

the people to 

ENow 

just heard some drawers noving, 

make sure that they wouldn't move 

side entrance, 

the police ¥ 
i 
& 

Rnow is that they came through the 

# J hy ML, WW gy hs pe QF gy Or £0 0% JOWeYT S$ With YOu Seo 

when it came into the parking lot? 

Yes, saw him when 1 

BAP an a 3 a 
JOWEY 8: when 

people lying on the floor, could 

"HeClesky 

BY rn Gb ae y 2 a Was 
JOWEeYrss where were 

wom YA . POR of SPR police Oliicer? 

Zoi t™Y ox ola Tike ch Meg. LSE 
"HoeClesky : I had a 

them too long. 

Riowers: 

were leaving? 

3 

i 

RIOWEYrsSs 

police officer entered 

my left laying flat on floor 

SOO ra " 

that information i oF son dm 
| %) LET Ro 

and voluntarily? 

ir 

he pulled in, 

you also see the 

a, yee mn 3 3 wha on FA you standing when 

eady nade my nove 

the counter and I was leaving the store because it 

Going out the front door, 

approzimately ten 

Lrom Page 9 given 

£5 we 
* 

i wa 

I did not see anybody 

watohing i 

All that I 

officer's vehicle 

you were standing and watching the 

front door? 

you saw the 

DN fj PRP SW TY 
from behind 

was taking 

Did you tell anyone in the store that you 

didn't say anything to nobody, 

What was your spproximate location when the 

the building of the Dixie Furniture Company? 

re 
i was gover to 

feet from the 

to you freely 

 



  

it was, ba 
20 

§ 

ba
? 

De
.)
 o 

FA
 : 

3 

ey
 45:

 
A
 

Y
 

-
 

63 Were any threats, promises or inducements made to 

Are HeClesky to get him to give thet information te vou? 

a NO, Bir. 

¢ Continue, please, 

A Page 10. “"Jowers: From that location, could you 

see the police officer as he stepped through the front door? 

"MeCleskys I couldn't see the police officer when 

he stepped through the door, and the only thing I could see, 

from where I was laying on the floor, was his feet, but 1 

couldn't see his face, 

"Jowers:s After the police officer passed by you, 

approximately how many seconds had passed before you heard the 

two shots? 

"MeClesky: 1. would say about fifteen seconds, 

oo. 

because 1 could see his legs go by me, and I was trving to g a
 

< eo
 

nim time enough to get on up there to the counter. 

RJowers: Did you get up off the floor, before or 

after you heard the shots? 

MeClesky: It happened in the process, 1 was 

getting up when the shots were fired and I immediately fled 

from the stove, 

"Jowers: Did you know the police officer had been 

shot? 

"HoCleskys: Wo, I didn't have any Knowledge that 

 



  

front door 

a
 

rah Lo ty 

ran aown 

arriving & 

  

L 

Rad dos £8 
Fadi 

£% 

"HeClegkys 

the 

  

2 

    

ol ei 3 ¥ PoE YER Ne 8 TR A . i wi an TR I BnOt, Le I thought that the police 

ted me running out tne JdoOr amd wag shooting 

that were si 5
 WEYL 

pb Ciel 

“ TI 3p 
i LiL A 03K 

a ple Ae Rea 
i Sif 8A LV» 

the information on that page given to you 

8ir. 

any threats, promises or inducements used 

pn WE : p— ve PO way iv aT ie, Vu Th 4 si 

you the information on page? 

Would you continue. 

  

. BB ng, ae ah , pS h a | il. JOWerss you heard the shots, 

eg uly 

i DESEO I Yar & Clesrys WO shots. 

WERKE I What did YOu qo after you heard the 

CLATCEBAYS 

  

or. a 
BOWLES 

wers: Hawme the people that got into the 

5 ae gn pire T Snow OR | Sp ra Ti gin - 5 my by wou im WE from location where the car was pal 

El inmediately ran out 

3 . . 3h o Lp al YN fh ST or EY BPN 
ran down to the corner, back to my right, 

- is} pr ARP EE NA a oft gn id @ wi had ny car parked. 

Car when at 

TT re * Po 5 ho #8 3 pe om 2 - a RB ) “ it seeped LO me that everyone was 

game TlAg, 

  

front door. 

how 

ard 

Cay 

RP: 
Nis 

 



  

"hecClesky: David Barney [sic], Ben Wright, Bernard 

Dupree. 

"Jowers: Where did you go when you left the Dixie 

Furniture Company? 

"HoeClesky: All of us left together, we went to 

Dupree's house. 

"Harris: While you all were in the car after the 

robbery, did you all have any conversation pertaining to the 

shooting which occurred at the Dixie Furniture, located at 

J Marietta Street? 

"HeCleskyt The only conversation that 1 recall, 

was that everybody was confused as to which direction we were 

going to go. Yhis is when Dupree said that we could go to his 

houBG « 

"Harris: Have you discussed with the other com=- 

& panions who shot the police officer at the furniture store? 

*rocCleskys Ho, I have not discussed it." 

& And was the information on that page given to you 

freely and voluntarily? 

A Yes, sir, it was, 

4 And was any inducements, promises, rewards used to 

set Hr. MeClesky to give vou that information? 
ow - > pe 4 

{2 ould you continue, 

a Page 12. “"Jowers: What type of weapon were you 

 



  

-
 

- 

bh 
3 

t
d
 

- 

Saa
t 

i | 
54 

x
 

wh
 

Co
 5 E 
2 

J 

b a ha
 

Py
 

" avolver, brown handled, black 

barrel, 

"Jowers: Where did you get this weapon from? 

"MoeClesky: I got it from Ben Wright. 

"Harris: When did you get the weapon from Ben 

Wright? 

"MceClesky: May 13th, 1978, while we were in my car. 

I was driving and Ben handed me the weapon, 

"Jowers: What did you do with the ,22 pistol that 

you used In the robbery? 

"HeClesky: 1 gave it back to Hen Wright. 

"Jowerss How long have you been khowing David 

Barney [sic]? 

"HeClesky: I met David back in June of 77." 

At this point our secretary who had, I don't know 

if she wasn there, she wasn't there when we started the state 

ment, that is why we had used the Missing Persons' secretary, 

He. Margene Turner, however, I think at this time our secretary 

had returned to the office and 1 went around so that I could 

release that secretary and so she could continue typing, and I 

think she pronounces her name Offutt, and she continued at that 

point. 

"Harris: hr. MeClesky, you stated earlier in your 

statement that after the robbery, you and vour other companions, 

-5 28 

 



  

went to Dupree's house, What did you all do when you arrived 

there? 

PHeCleskyts When we arrived, we went on the inside 

of the house and everybody immediately changed clothes and after 
(} 

they had counted all the money out and split it up, Dupree 

vemalined at home, David Burney went in another direction, Ben 

Wright and I left together and I took him to Hebaniel Street.” 

J How, was the information on that page given to you 

freely and voluntarily by #r., HeClesky? 

A Yes, 8ir. 

{2 Here any promises, inducements or threats made to 

£3 i rt
 

Ro
ng

 

Ld MeClesky to give you that information? 

A No, sir. 

* Would you please continue, 

A Page 43. "Harris: Mr. HMeClesky, what share of the 

money did you receive, once it wag divided up? 

"ieCleskys It was either $160 or £180, I can't be 

specific. 

"Harriss Have vou ever seen Ben Wright with any 

weapons besldes the .410 ghotgun and the ,22 caliber revolver 

that you made mention of earlier in your statement? 

"HeCleskys Yes, 1 have seen [him] with another 

Kind, but I don't know exactly what Kind it was or where it cone 

"Harris: Can you describe the one that you seen? 

 



  

® on ok TRG 
HAD | SO § Ks GRY 4 

Raarris: Do you recall where 

ago it was when you sav this weapon? 

It was about a 

store robbery and at that time 

with him at all tines. He sald 

want to get caught emply 

at parson 

Jowerss Have vou been advi 

tional rights? 

"MeCleskys Yee, 

®Jowers: Did vou understand 

"Jowers: Were there any 

Be a $n 3 PR a "i ag pi HA Loe Loy to induce you to nake 

these questions 

"HoeCleskyt Ho. 

n of End 

ol All right, sir. 

completed, how did you about getting £0 i 

if it was signed? 

5 H f ig standard 

7 

it was silver, chrome plated 

Wen 

on gin 18 
BAG 

the 

tricks 

procedure 

you 

Hen was 

CEvOolver. 

were and how long 

pefore the Dixie 

keeping the 

was 'hot' and 

He kept it on his 

2 rama I ve i a of vour Constitu- 

Se ”~ 

Li 

Gr promised sau 

NG TO answer 

statement was 

££ br 
statement 

with ne, I gave 

all thirteen pages to the defendant, Mr, Warren McClesky, and 

at that time I instructed him to read or 

if there was typing error anvtihing, a 

Qver the statement and 

or anything that he «id 

 



  

not agree with, we vould have it typed 

satisfaction, and he did not have to sign 
WV 

ied everything was the way 
od er 2 be 

"ei if +B 

it and after he completed reading 1t, he 

sign the statement. 

Sir. sign 

sir, he did. 

{J And did you witness all pages? 

A ies, Sir. 

a How, what wae done after the st 

Okay. After he had signed the sta 

witnessed by the people that were present, 

taken to the City Jail, 

over to 

until 

atement 

and 

  

meat nls 

he 

At thi £3 

was allowed to 

wag Signed? 

atten it was ent, 

at that time 

6 All right, sir. Sir, 1 show you what has been 

marked as State's Exhibit Number 21. Can you tell the Court and 

jury what that is, siy? 

FY Yes. buring the question and answer session I asked 

Mr. McClesky if I showed him an aerial photograph that had been 

taken from a helicopter by a City of atlanta I.D, technician, & 

Mrs, Cortez, I asked him could he show me the locations where 

he had parked his vehicle the first time and second time, and 

at that time he stated he would like to take a logk at them. 

I went and picked up the photographs. I gave him this photo- 

graph here, which my records show 1g Humber 5 of uy photograpns. 

At that time he pointed to a location, and he stated, "This is 

 



    

where TI was at the first time, and this is where I was at the 

gsacontd time." He stated he would write "first" and write 

¥"second® and he would put his initials by “first” where he had 

marked the first time he came and where he had parked the second 

time. At that time I asked hin if he would sign his name to the 

other side, if he didn't object. He did not, and he signed his 

name, Warren MeClesky, and he dated it 5-31-78, 

0 Now, did he sign the initial two locations freely 

and voluntarily? 

5 Yes, 51r. 

?
 

J
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e
 

b+
 

~
 

LW
 

re
 

% pid you coerce him or threaten | anything to have 

him initial those photographs? £ 

FY HO r 5 ir # 

x Pe 

8 tow, did vou see Hr, MeClesky at any time after 

A Yes, sir, it was on June the 2nd, 1978. On June 

the 2nd, 1978, 1 came to the Homicide Office and 1 just happened 

to look down and I saw a newspaper that had pictures of the 

defendants that had been arrested in connection with the shooting 

of Officer Schlatt on May the 13th, 1878, at the gixie Furniture, 

At this time I realized that our witnesses that I felt was the 

key withesses, Ms. Mamie Thomas, had not viewed a lineup, & 

physical lineup, and at that time I immediately called out to 

Dizie Purniture Company and I went through the procedure of 

ne
 

trying to insure that she 1} ad not seen a newspaper that they 

 



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Cffice at 

A 

(J 

area? 

oo" 

£4 

iJ 

Hqcllesky 

A 

Can you observe the lineup ares from the Homicide A 

all? 

1 Now, was Mamie Thomas ever taken back to the lineup 

HO, Bir. 

Did you ever take her into the presence Of Warren 

at that time or any other time that you are aware of? 

Ho, six. 

Po you know of an 

HO, 81tr. 

How, waa Classie Barnwell down there on June the 

2nd, 19782 

# 

her into 

Fe
, wl 

f % b Td A > ov | FON Mr. McClesky had 

urned in 

Ho, sir. 

Have you ever attempted Co or have you ever brought 

the presence of Warren HeClegky that you know of? 

De you know of anyone else that has? 

Do you know any lineup that warren MeClesky has ever 

Kow, do you recall the words that you and 

im over to you? 

  

On may the 31st when Detective Lieutenant Perry



  

Bi Yes, slr. 1 was standing in the Homicide Office, 

<a po fn 0 I ET a = Bhs ype pb roren Ne aver Nl POPS A: i Te ’ > he Fe 3» and as Lieutenant Perry walxed through the door, I think 

# 

"Jowers, he wants to talk to vou." 1 walked over to hin. 

gald, "You want to talk to me?" He said, "Yes." He said 

thing to the effect, they are trying to stick this on me 

Hr. MecClesky was directly behind him, and the Lieutenant said, 

BOE = 

Or 

are trying to hang me with this, and at that time we proceeded to 

> i 

the Missing Persons Office. pet J 

Q Curing the time that you were interviewing Mr. 

on May the 3lst, 1976, did you give him anything to eat or d 

A Yeg, sir, we had -- we started questioning him a 

M na 
~ 

A 4 aClesky 

rink ? 

na 

we started right after noon, after lunchtime, and at one time 

he indicated that he wanted some Clgarettes and some potato 

chips, and I went upstairs and I bought some popcorn, I think 

some potate chips and clgarettes, and I came back and he 

potato chips and the cigarettes, 

“ 

& Did he have anything to drink, sir? 

that this interview was going on? 

x RF ic” a oh 
£4 Yes pF & = 

ag 1 stated, we stopped so I could go upstairs and get the 

had 

A I really don't recall whether he had a drink or 

ire We had == the interview had started, 

the 

519 3 WY 

o All right, sir. Rid you ever leave during the time 

and 

drinks -- correction, the popcorn and the potato chips and the 

cigarettes, 

oi 
ba 6 B00 do 

 



  

¥ and who was left with Mr, Mellesky at that time? 

2 Me. Margene Turner, who is the secretary at Hissing 

Persons, and Sergeant Bturgis, 

4) And was she there when you left, as far as you know? 

-
 

Se
 

i
s
 

ps
 % gite just in the vifice? 

A Ho, sir, we had kind of came into her office. It was 

her office and she allowed us to come in to take the statement, 

and she continued doing her business of missing persons. 

(2 80 she didn't take part in the guestioning and 

answering? 

££
 

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£
5
 

e
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 the 

tise? 

BY oo po “now 
Fi IB, BAY 

Do you think that there might have been any time 

when she might have left? 

A I can't recalls I think she got up several times 

to go bring some people -- to talk to some people that were 

coming up to the front. Usually that is Ms. Turner's duties; 

if I am not mistaken, she gets up whenever someone comes in, 

1 think she got up a couple of tines. 

& Now, is that a long statement from what you some= 

times take in homigide investigations? 

oe FF 
a 

 



  

A Yag, sir, it's very long. 

{J Ang did that take a lot of 

{; And do know about how much time it took? 

A It was approximately two hours; could be more or it 

could be a little less, 

{2 Could it have been considerably more? 

A I don't think it could have been too mach more from 

that, This started about 1:30, somewhere in there, We had 

stopped and HS « Offutt, I think she arrives at about Lifteen to 

four or something like that, and when she came in, that's whan 

we pilcked up and ghe just finished up the last tiiree or four 

gquestiong, or whatever was on nere. 

¥ 80 she finished up when she came ony 

# bhe comes on at what Lime? 

A She reports at four o'clock, but she comes in jus pS 
-~ 

{) Did you see her when she came in, sir? 

5 HO, sir, I can't veally recall how I was aware that 

she was there, but someone told me that Ms, Turner had to prepare 

to leave, and at that time I thanked her for starting the question 

and answer session in the stetement and I immedlately went around, 

I think I returned back to the Homicide Office where we Con- 

pleted the ¢ 
i Be hp F oo Foy ME pn - - So ain i gt ge ong wg A TS UESTIONANG « I'am not sure whether the secretary came 

 



  

0, WOW, Liiacer -- rather, betective Jowers, do you 

rec ra | t vol ay, ds t FoR RY Po t PY KP w £8 Fg: TR ER ar re 3. 3 Pa Pon oh -~ % Cdl WRELNEL OF LOL any OL the pages had to Le retvped at the 
> a 

time that this statement was being taken 

z A NO 8ir, there was no pages retyped. 

ol Could it have Deen while vou were out of the room? 

Xe arity sns H Pr Bo ob om 3 pn dw Me TURNER: 1 am goldnyg to object, The witness has 

answered no twice, i don't know what further answer he 

Cp a 5% ~ Li x Boe , pe Ta ; i. § os § ! . 1 wants, but I think the question has been answered, 

THE COURT: I will overrule the objection. 

HE COURT: I will overrule the objection at this 

tine. 

ows $* «$y HN, Wu he ante ging 
any OI the pages: 

{3 The aerial view that you had taken, was that taken 

under your control and taken at your suggestion? 

= NN
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i Pcs 2% , TE o doped Bn Nw pa oS a Wa: - 1 a dh th RPh ££ ogg a MAPS © w somewhat show the area since we knew for a fact that -- well, 

we Knew that the suspects had fled In that direction, uo we 

were trying to gel something we could use whenever talking to -¥ ww 

OF EAR TER oY FET ra » nT $B 3 pre be 3 ‘ y chi hp 5 3 . wie. cov pu arine 0 Fg RR - Some witnesses or something, that we would have sone thing to 

 



  

show them so they could pinpoint things out for us. 

8 poe you know when State's Exhibit Number 21 was 

A Yes, sir, this photograph was taken on May the 24th, 

1978. 

Be wy A - » a Oo wu gen & 8 oy we x i RL 
(8%. ARG are you familiar with that areca? 

A Yen ¢ BAY» I ane 

Does State's Exhibit Number 21, is that a true and 

qecurate representation of that general area, sir? 

A Yes, sir, it is i a be £3 LR Eo a J 

1 marked as State's Exhibit us
 Lh 1 show vou what has bee 

Humber 20. Can vou entify that, sir? 

A Veg, sir, it's an aerial photograph and it shows 

the front of the Dixie Furniture Company and it shows Marietta 

rou can see the Dixie Furniture Company truck at Street. Also, 3 

the loading dock and you can see the parking lot, but you can't 

directly behind the bullding. 

{J Was that photograph taken at your request, sir? 

A Yas, Bile 

4 Do you know what date it was taken? 

A Yes, sir, this photograph wag taken alsc on Nay 

i, hind does that truly and accurately reflect the area 

 



  

s
s
 #, Sir, I show you what has been marked as Btate's 

Exhibit Busber 19. Are vou familiar with that photograph? 

A 168, S81iY. 

5
 

Fo
g?
 

Was that taken under your control and supervigion? 

A Ho, 8ir. 

¥ Did you observe that particular object in that 

photograph? 

£0 And do vou know where that -- where the logation of 

A Yes, sir, it was taken from a Dempuater Dumpster 

around the corner from the Dixie Purniture Compény. Detective 

walker supervised this particular shot. 

before or at the time or before the photograph wag taken? 

A Would vou say again, please? & Py vi FS 

ne
 Did you observe the item in that photograph before 

it was removed? 

A Yes, Sire. 

Gd Uoes State's Exhibit Humber 19% truly reflect the 

item you saw in the Dempster Dumpster on May the 13th, 19787 
Ge 

- : py 5 ¥ Fo fn PERE Sg RESON $ vg cu Xo} on Fy ES wm gn Tk eV a of bo G2 Sut you did not supervise the taking of the photo- 

A Wo, sir, I returned back to the crime scene and 

 



  

Detective Walker went back with an I.D, technician and the 

photograph was Laken. 

; All right, sir. But does that truly and accurately 

represent ve—- 
Ed 

A Yee, sir. 

2 -= the inside of that Dempster Dumpster? 

A Yes, 8ire 

» 

i Sir, I show vou what has been marked as Defendant's 

Exhibit Number 1 and ask if that pack of photographs contains 

wh > a” Sa ps on HN ss” oN ve aol me Be 4 $4 ”™~ it ame Lv a PHOEOYE aph of Defendant McCles Ly? W
w
 

Pa
ce
 

WP bt
 

#
5
 » 

2 a
 

38
5 

-
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45
: 

ed 

» 

{ and did you observe Mr, HceClesky on May the 31st, 

197872 

FL) Yad, sire. 

{1% Did he appear as he does in that photograph on 

Ho, sir. At the time that 1 first observed 

Sp Yor 5 oy FARE at Rec ni ad 5 firm 0% 3 p . es 3 ) . 2 bre pe p wie woh Yon or ps Po. oy 4 Mr. McClesky he had a poustache, and this photograph here does Se
id
 

not have a noustache, 

0 All right, sir. Where did you observe him with a 

& At == TI believe it was on Marietta Street == 

correction, Marietta, Ceorgia, on James Street at his residence 

® 

at the time he was taken into custody by the Cobb County authori- 

 



  

f Fd. 1 ri 4 h t yr = i Ve Are bf rid 

he had 3 moustache? 

Fol Ye 5 F | & i 5 * 

And. how about May the 3 

A Cn Hay the 31st he had a 

nous tache when he arrived at the 

after he was placed in the City Jalil 

photographs 80 1 could use then 

graphic lineup, I noticed that the 

however, the photograph 

a
 at the Marie Cebb County 

p Se > hy gen oo 2.2 ~ BS " wil a gk " 5 
however, I Could not use that photograph 

he Bry ee 4 wah 4 ba bg \ ws 13 PT AT, 3 vai Pa £ 
t GY: UB€ a LaCRYgTOouUnG that has lines in 

our pletures 

have lines in the back, and if 1 had 

Se tn neh RAR Ra BE gins tA 
nave stood out from our 

TR 

take 

Police Department had 

that were taken in the City of 

photographs, plus 

saving on May the 30th 

I think he the 

dopariment; however, 

I went to pick up 

in 8 lineup, a photo=- 

ustache had been removed; 

on the 30th up in a
 

2 

fi aay 

a moustache; 

because 

Dack of it and 

Atlanta, we don't 

photograph it “ 

it has the name 

R ‘ 3 * x 1 NC 

Q Also it's a different sige, is it not? 

Pes It's a different size, it's a different type. 

. S0 the photograph then that you showed to Mamie 

01 n ov sus en owabs A sadn 
Thomas was which 

r i ek a a sn ar le Bo ah 
I snowed her thesge A 

fo 8 41 pag bia ns A] ve Bx Pw Go ie hs a a 
did Not nave enouglt padtographs 

HICLOgrapns 8 here. I did not have 

from the Cobb County Police 

Department that I felt was close to the makeup of Hr, MeClesky 

tO use, 80 1 had tO go with the photographs I had. 

 



  

8 Sir, what was the date of the preliminary hearing? 

A On Wednesday, June the 7th, 1%78, at approximately 

2:00 A.M,, a preliminary hearing was held at the City of Atlanta 

Municipal Court. 

{J Pid vou observe Mra. McClesky on that date? 

Fl Yes, Sir. 

0 Did he have a moustache oy did he not? 

& Hoy Bir. TO the best of my memory I did not see a 

0 How about on June the dnd when you had Mamie Thomas 

down for a lineup, did Mr. McClesky have & moustache at that 

tine? 

i Ho, sir. 

3: How, have vou observed and checked the furniture out 

at Pixie Furniture Company, sir? 

A Yes, 8ir. : 

L# Do vou have an opinion as to whether =—- 

PY 

Re TURHEK: Your Honor, beiore we get into that, I 

think we are going to have to qualify him as sone type of 

expert, I don't know what the question is, but if he is 

going to give an opinion, there should be some == 

MR. PARKER: 1 will rephrase the question. 

y 4 FT, Tsu wav Soro ”~ 3? & 4 PE TE | do 8 3 yan » gor RR | |¥) (By Mr. Parker) Have you examined the chairs and 

” 3 . th w Bo in on prog a Fa & Y oy, Nhe pow Mi 8. Po CAT » TE gn the couches on the floor on display out there? 

 



  

a Sp TARY ih Ee x Be . SE Ba 
GLO YOU ¢go aout «oling 

when I first arrived at the 

. was locked and Seryeant Paschal had 

i £2 8 yor po $n Vl Sg jo Bie 2 dt Tg i ow a gon A ~ The first thing that came vo my mind was 

body could still be in ever yvbo 

wien the shooting started. 1 started 

for something for somebody to e¢rawl under, 

that was only had about 

of the furniture front in the gtore was $3 up 

Y, Bid to crawl under YOu attempt 

A Ho, sir. 

Q Did vou observe any furniture that 

that cover the entire 

A Yes, 8 worked the 

that was partitioned off from the 

around there. They had a bed b ’ 

the floor. The 

touching the floor, That was the 

recall in 

EA I 1 . » on 3 DRS 

Q “he only bed what, sir? 

FA The only bed that I recall 

the round bed. I think it had kind of a 

DEOWn Colors. 

-54 4 

Beene, 

a o4 ges a 
secure 

to 

walking 

three 

area that was 

other area, 

& round bed, 

framework was 

only 

  

tiiat? 

tiie front dooy 

the Crime sgene. 

look around, some- 

Bn w RE ™ x N ot ~ dy didn't get out 

around looking 

Host of the furniture 

inch clearance, 

and lamps. 

anything? 

you could have 

gtore? 

up 

and I looked 

but it round a8 a 

to floor, 

i
 bed I really 

in the store wage 

i Poa Ba ih ae A a A 
SOME Aid OF 

 



  

ou om ive an dor 4 GW i 4 hd f = 
as been marked ag Ltate's * Bly, 1 show you wha 

Exhibit Humber ll. 1I% that the coat that you showed to 

Mr. MeClesky while you were interviewing him on May the 31st? 

pal Yes, sir. 

i Is that a photograph of the coat? 

sh Of the black leathery 

Jacket that wag found in the storage room where the sale was 

located. The jacket was lying in front of the safe. 

0 That is the same coat that you digplayed to him? 

A Yes, B81r. 

0 Mow, to your knowledge, sir, has the Atlanta Police 

Departuent recovered any weapons from any of these delendanta? 

A HO, Biv. 

* How about the one in Harietta, are vou aware of oo 

that, sir? 

{) Ht 1064 James Street? 

*, Are you aware of any weapon that was recovered at 

1064 James Street? 

A Yes, sir, there was a weapon, but this weapon, I 

think, vas identified as being the property of another gentle- 

wan that was living there. 

~
 

{ » vw
 " “ §
 ~ rol 90 to Pine Bluff, Arkansas? o ¢ 

; oR » Ted a 3 “% oF 

 



  

$ Lo vou vecall when 

¥y Pon a EIT Caps kK 4 n 
+4 Yes, Sil e 4 went 

went to Harietta. 

the OL 

Aransas in Pine Eluif, 

conduct an interview with hi 

i | 5 5 LR Vl 57 

ME es PAKELDRS four 

withess, gir. 

TURNERS 

to be quite 

vou want to recess 

N V $9 wie Cross 1h the morning 

HR. TURKER: anét 

THE COURT: 

sn Po vy 8% on gon Be, 1 uN ge Fog ge adjourn or tha nights 

Pg vot 
the pase don't discuss 

it with and VOU 

os 
EO salve 

We'll start promptly at 

& 7% | TR rg, v Hoy at {¥hereupon, the 

and the 

93 

LEE ES PNERY TEE 
THE COURS: 

¢ 

Buspects, Hr. Ben Wright, 

1 was ‘ vhs ad 

Honor, tn 

Your Honor, 

extensive. 

YOu went there, i 

Lhere [Or the san 

had bee 

Te gin pt . 
gsres Lo 

LG you want 

reason I had 

- 

I was advised to go to Pine Bluff because 

go out and to 

my crogs-examination is 

to gat started 

or how do you suggest we handle 

Jarry 

4 

Ladies and gentlemen, 

don't 

on
, 

‘etired 

i 

I 8 

anyone, don't 

Gisocuss it 

4 {J in the 
£ jo! 
P33 

from 

proceedings were adjourned, to be reconvened 

30 o'clock, AsM., on the following dav.) 

the 

Mavbe it would De better to start your 

so I wouldn't have to interrupt you. 

believe we'll 

ald yesterday, 

let anyone 

EMORY yOur=~ 

BOEING « 

Courtroom, 

at 

Bring the jury in. 

 



  

(Whereupon, the jury returned to the courtroom 

after wiiich the following proceedings were had.) 

THE COURT All right, let's proceed, 1 believe 

ou are ready for cross=examination on Detective Jowers? 

HR. TUREER: Yes, sir, Your Honor. 

THE COURT: Detective Jowers, just consider yourself 

under the oath you took yesterday. 

CROSS=-EXAMINATION 

{ When you initially guestioned Mrs HeClesky in 

Marietta, that was on May 30th, I believe, is that correct? 

A Yes, Sir. 

¥ Cn that first occasion he told you he didn't know 

| # You didn't see him any more after that, is that 

A That's correct. 

i ~= Until the 31st, the next day? 

J Okay, Now, at the time that you initially arrested 

Hre MeClesky, it lg also true that warrants were belibg executed 

on one other co-defendant, is that right? 

$s ER TW | Ps rT b 4 nt PORE DPIC NE PR J a Ta be § wn 5 EE Co An PRL DI i TL A You said when I was arresting him. I wasn't arresting ” 

 



  

& in other words, the two arrests were going on at 

about the gane 

  

A I later discovered a
a
 

ve
} 

F
o
a
m
 

5 &e
 

" ES 
2 

61 rm
 

® 

¢ Up until that time you all hadn't taken a statement 

from == I believe that individual was David Burney, ig that 

A vie had not taken & statement that had been reduced 

to writing, no. 

i But you all had taken a statement from David Burney 

on the 30th, is that correct? 

A & verbal statement, ves, 

\ Bi grin dog Pay foe Fes gn § & ox N wig Boe gol ny ot de gro w 1 OY EE Ee a 
LG BNL h hat the 4 1rst sta tepent vou al 1 0a LLIN 

i 4 Yow wy NRE ee FRE bX ay a5 ie wy Tu £5 $ wn Rd ae ww 4 Agni jo Lr Le LILaY » How, Hr. Helle Sky was in Marietta at that 

#, dad you all released any news of this tO the news 

media? «8 Ge Nd w 

A I had not. 

Q Well, did vou read or see any publicity on the fact 

2 8 
ot Bg 3S 

 



  

fn Mr. Burney having given a statement? 5
 

pH
 

Ra EE re RE TL Th Tal Rr 
Fi NOy, 8i¥, OU To my Lnowledge . 

L& S50 Hr. McClegky could not have Known that Mr. Burney 

had given a statement because he was in Marietta, ig that correct? 

A I can't answer that. 

¥, let's put it like this, Did you tell him anything 

A HO, I haven't. 1 did not, 

Po i 

4 After you talked to 
* 

him on the 30th do you know 1% 

any other officer from the Atlanta Police Department interviewed 

A I don't know if -= to my knowledge nO one else inter- 

viewed Mr, HMeClesky after I interviewed him, no, except for the 

time Lieutenant Perry and Sergeant MeConnell went to pick him 

L CGkay., On one day he says he doesn't know anything 

about the crime, correct? 

F2\ yes, Sir. 

| & Cray. How, the next time vou see him 183 the next 

> 3 

day, 18 that right? 

oh
 Q And the first thing he says to you is, "I want to 

tell you what happened, they are trying to --" what were the 

% 

words he used? 

p eas as ee Eo pm ay a ai Be a - 1 is aot ee ih ~ (IY A something to the effect they axe trying to stick 

 



  

3 4 dat 1 Yor don ww oh oe RIAN. ram 34 on " 5 § pe PB So this on nme, they are trying to hang this on ne. 

om
, 

P
r
o
 pid vou ask him what he meant by that? 

A WO, Bit. 

THE COURT: Fr. Turner, I don't want to interrupt. 

you, but most lawvers do thig. You gum up. There 18 no 

provision for & lawyer to say this happened and this 

happened, The jury remembers what happened and they 

renember the testimony just as well as you do. I mean, 

it is a temptation, I used to be a trial lawyer, I did 

it, too, when I was a trial lawyer. As a trial juwige 1 

try to stop its It takes uj 1 & y time unnecessarily. 

3 FH 4 
(By Hr, Turner) Did you inguire ag Lo what he di

e 
Po

s 

meant when he sald that? 

FA HO, Bir. 

¥ Who was with him when he sald that? 

A fe was standing == in fact, he was standing by some 

file cabinets that we had. He valked in and he moved over by 

the file cabinets, He was standing by himself when he said it, 

U You stated before or testified before, I Delieve, 

that all of his statements were freely and voluntarily given to 

vou, is that correct? 

, Uo vou know what was done or sald to Hr. HMeClesky on wl — 

the ride from Marietta to Atlanta? 

 



  

{2 Who went to pick him up in Marietta? & 

A Lieutenant WwW. EK. Perry, the Conmander of the Homiclde 2% 

Sauad, and Sergeant Helonnell, my supervisor, id ’ We 4 | k 

LA S50 you don't know whether any threats, promises £51
 

™
 

we
 

~ 

inducements were made to him at that time, do you? 

A No, sir, I sure don't, 

# Okay.  Kow, what is an inducement? 

MR. PARKER: Objection; I believe that is a legal 

term that the Court will have to instruct the Jury one 

MRe WURNER: Your Honor, 1 think he testified before 

that no promises =- 

THE COURT: Why don't you ask him what he meant Ly 

the word “inducement”. 

lik. TURHERs “hat is what I thought -~ I asked him 

what does inducement mean. When I asked that I was making 

it personal. 

THE COURT: If vou are asking a legal question, I 

will answer that for the juarys If you are asking what he 

means, I will let you ask the question, 

0 (8y Hr. Turner) What do you mean by inducement? 

" Lid 1 try to force him or use some other neans or 

threats to get him to make a statements 

w
r
 

o
a
 

P
s
 S80 in your definition of inducement, inducement is 

equivalent to a threat, is that correct? 

A Sone force is used other than just voluntarily giving 

 



  

3 1%
 

A
r
 

[ 

1 #, ed
 

La
 

a
v
 -
 

=
 5 

| Sp
a 

h
a
 vour eduivalent for inducement, is that 

A Yes, sir, 

A Okay. I8 that the -~ 1 strike that. 

low, when he gave the statenent to you, who else was 

praesent at that time? 

A What statement are we talking about? 

0 In the office? 

A The one that wag reduced to writing in the Atlanta 

Police Department? 

{) Right. 

A The secretary, Ms, Margene Turner, bergeant Sturgis, 

who left, and she left and she would come back, Detective Harris 

f the Homicide 8Sguad, he came in and ne would come in and look 

and he would leave, 

Fs
 

bor
ed 

So
gn
 

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. 

5
 

$ Pi
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e 

o
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=
 

om
 

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) 

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21
 

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ps & Hn
 

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Li
 

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$
1
 

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& Yes, 8ir. 

fas there anvthing unusual about your interview 

seagsion with Mr, McClesky that day? 

A NO, 81¥. 

9 Did you do anything out of your normal practices 

and procedures in interrogating hin? 

A No, sir, not to my knowledge, The fact is that 1 was 

trying to be very nice and very polite to him since he was giving 
2 eS) Ba @ . 

-552= 

 



  

thing to force him to get angry with me or anything. 

G0 you were trying to get him to go along with the 

program, 80 LO spear, is that right? 

FN Ho, sir, I was trying to keep him in the Prog ran 

that he was in, 

i All right, and how were you trying to keep him in 

> 
t] that ogra pr 

a I wasn't trying to make a 

I Mr. HeClesky or Detective Jowers, 

the way we had started out. 

8 Which was friendly? 

A Yog, sir. 

0 All right. pid the atmos 

A You, sir. 

# Did you all have a discus 

A Ag == I don't recall disc 

an attractive lady? There is a Maan 

: 

who 18 & very attractive 

ny 

Loh Ba 

vy friction between 

wanted to the atmosphere 

phere vemain friendly? 

about fine women? 

ing anything about == vou 

gergeant, sergeant Sturgis, 

8 Lhere, She got up and 

walked out of the room, I remember HMeClesky looked at her, and 

he Kind of smiled, and I looked at him and nodded as to Say, 

yes, she's nice, 

0 You don't recall having a discussion with him about 

it? 

A fe discussed many things, I just don't -- anything 

 



  

If it 

statement, two days would have been spent, 

{ Isn't it a fact that vou all were together from 

about 1:30 until about 7:00 that night in terms of getting the 

statement? 

A It's possible, but I don't recall, 

& What is your testimony now, how many hours w= 

A I'm saying to the best I can remember, it was about 

four o'clock, It could have been a little longer, it could have 

been a little less. I really don't remember. 

a You have thirteen or: fourteen pages there, is that 

WHE CWO days, if he wanted To spen wi two davs giving 

particular about a =-- other than Sergeant Sturgis who was there, 

LE How, you say the Interrogation started at 1:30, is 

that correct? 

A Yes, sir. That is what is on the timing, ves, 

¥ And you say that it lasted or your testimony yes— 

terday was that it lasted for about two to two and a half hours? 

A 0. the best that 1 can remember, sire. I would like 

te say this. There was —-- since the very beginning of this 

investigation I have been involved in it, I was averaging some- 

where around sixteen hours a day. Time didn't mean anything to 

pe any nore, 1 was just after vresulis. I don't recall the exact 

time, and 1f you notice, I had to look up to find out what time 

the statement actually started. It wasn't that important to 

me What was important to me was giving him an opportunity. 

& 

 



  

right? 

iow long 41d it take to type them up? pe
 

re
 

Bo ~, % 

A Sir, as I have stated earlier, to the best 1 can 

remenber, they started about 1:30, it was after 4:00. It could 

have been shorter, it could have been longer, I just don't 

" Fm ks » 4 gy “8 Re FLO Ra ir a ip bi So § wy 25 an A 4 on he uf EF * fou gay you all discussed many things, This was off 

the record, was 1t? 

Fo we discussed -~ he was talking very freely. Ve dis 

# cussed many things. I just can't pinpoint ~~ if you are asking 

gid we just talk about this case, no, we discussed sone other 

things. We just kind of was relaxing, it was kind of a relaxed 

# SO vou all relaxed for about five or six hours? 

A Sir, as I stated earlier, I don't recall exactly the 

time we completed the statement and the question and answer 

gession, Yo the best I can remeber == 1 am basing that on the 

fact that one secretary started it and another secretary cane 

in, and I guess I am putting together when Ms, CI{futt came in 

it was about four o'clock. It could heve been a little later 

than that before I realized she was over there or it could 

have Leen before that, I really just don't remember. 

Q Ail right, Now, what, if anything, did vou give 

Mr. McClesky to help him relax while vou spent all of that time 

 



  

together? 

A I didn't give him anything to relax. He asked for 

some cilgavettes and he asked for =~ I think it was Bergeant 

HeConnell or somebody came back and said, "IX am going upstairs 

to get something to eat, do you want something to drink," and 

at that time I asked Mr, McClesky did he care for anything. As 

I have stated, we were talking and we were very relaxed. As you 

have pointed out, we discussed many things. le asked for a Coke, 

and I didn't see any reason to deny him potatoe chips or whatever 

it was, cigarettes; if he wanted it, then he could have it. 

But what all di £
7
 

ay
 I you all buy him? 

A oir, as I atated earlier, I do recall something 

about some potato chips and I recall something about cigarettes, 

{2 What about popcorn? 

A I think I had a bag of popcorn. We have a microwave 

oven upstairs and we can heat it up and it's delicious when it's 

HOt 

$ Who pald for all of that? 

A In all probability it came out of my pocket, if I an 

not mistaken, 

#. Was there any discussion about what type of sentence 

Mr. MeClesky might get in exchange for his information to you? 

A No, sir, I am only an investicator. The courts are 

something entirely different from my field and I can't promise, 

i can't even discuss that. In fact, as I stated earlier, on 

-556=- 

 



  

another case where & young man vanted to discugs a sentence, 

we had to agk that Mr. Slaton come over to discuss this with 

im because we are not authorized to do it, 

0 That sane young nan asked for a lawyer, didn't he? 

A Negative, he asked for Hrs Lewis Slaton. 

# on't you remember testifying that he called an 

attorney, that you allowed him == 

& No, sir, I have not testified that he called an 

attorney. 

3, He didn't try and call Mr. Bill Gower while he wag == 

ho,
 FA I have not testified to that. If he did, it was 

without ay Knowledge, and I have not testified to that. 

¥ Ghay. Row, what, if anything, did Mr. McClegky say 

to you about what he hoped to get out of making the statement, 

Or was ne just making it without any expectation of anything? 

A Biv, I don't recall him mentioning that. The only 

4 pa sis a Pre H.R Drea pr. . Bary is ¥ 1 3 Tm, " a 1 » Bn Rin ie aa ov 

thing, as I stated earlier, he did -- he stated that they are 

trying to hang this on me and I want to get it straight, or 

TX whatever, that is the only thing I recall he said, He said, 

"They are not going te hang this on me." He did state something 

about I was there and I robbed, but they are not going te hang 

i BC orf ¢ fu 4 ¥ “ty % 3 a5 ‘ a 2 OF ¥ % = zu BT i 2 Fass 2 All x cnt WOW, & little == well vesterday you mace 

PY 

a point cut of discussing the fact that Mr. HeClesky didn't have 

73
 

£ a moustache in one of the pictures that you shoved to, I believe, 

iE SR B57 

 



    

a Mrs. Mamie Thomas, is that correct 

A Ys, Bir. 

¥ All right. Were you inp 

had difficulty in identifying Mr. Heo 

A Nop sir, I didn't imply 

{ Well, what was the signi 

COURT: Well, he ans 

all he did. He couldn't know 

asked him the questions, unles 

in another man's sind, I can't 

you. 1 don't believe any of u 

MRe TURRER: I think 1 ¢ 

Wel hd * 

{ (By Hr. Turner) Hr. Hcl 

at the preliminary hearing, did he? 

a BNO py BlT ee 

L% in that day Hrs, Thomas 

A Yes, #1r. 

{ Oray.s Bow, in terms of 

oo WP TI I 2% 2h 2% gi po Sse 3 3 bron ABE 
gtatement, can you describe the offi 

that type of thing? 

A Are wae talking about the 

§ well, what was the first 

wheh vou were in Marietta, wasn't it 

? 

Licance of the 

wered cuestions, iat is 

why the District Attorney 

8 he does, What goes on 

and neithe x 

& power to Jd 

an make point in 

lesky d 

4 tol La
 ye 

44 Ud i REP TO TEN A. : " Mr. MeClesky giving 

was in, the 

tine t 

recogni 

another 

size, 

gecond time 

WE Hh 

. 

LJ 

 



  

¥ + x ¢ ¥ 

3 The second time, it's a -- it's 

roeraon i 

A SR LS WH Sl ETT CR he TI do Office and it's not really that wid 

Bin an 4 $= Te Oe gk Tx oN gi dis Tn ai Tot a0 wn Sits FF g ds Ry i a pe Yo $5 

hut it has three degks and it has a degk LO 

po 4 

for the officers and a degk for the superio 

are together, next to each other. 

5 Okay. bow, did you ever leave =, 

with the secretary who was taking his state 

| Why did you do that? 
wb oh 

Fi I went to get the potato chips 

police officer, wasn't 

8. And vou mean you left him alone 

was taking a statement from hin? 

A That ig not unusual, As 1 have 

Mg. Turner was there, and to the best of wy 

Bturgis, who is a police officer, was there 

walked out, to the best of my memory, and 1 

really walk out of the building. There are 

would come about in trying to leave the bul 

Go Well, how many times did you le 

A ir, I really don't recall, I 

a, it's kind of Ionu, #9
 

r a secretary, 4 desk 

r officers, and they 

Mr. MeClesky alone 

meant? 

re, ow foi sa Bw Br gn EB he clgareties., 

with murdering a 

stated, there was =—- 

Benory, bergeant 

in the office when 1 

t's not that easy to 

some problems that E 

sve him alone? 

go recall going to 

   



  

buy. the == to purchase the potato chips and the clgarsttes, 

| How long were you gone? 

takes about ten minutes or 

the popcorn, sO about ten minutes. 

{ How long did it take ‘you to purch 

A It's a machine upstairs on the fo 

0 Ckays. How, in terms of the state: 

Mr. HceClesky gave, isn't it a fact that he ¢ 

he gave a one page statement, and that was to 

A Sir, as 1 Btated earlier, to the 

I don't recall any statement being torn up. 

when I walked in the office I asked him to go 

ip hig » ~ in Own words what he wanted to tell about 

had made his statement that I would conduct & 

answer session with hin. 

i Well, let's put it like this. If 

torn up, would you have been aware of 1t? 

A No, sir, not necessarily. The se 

the typing, most of them have been with the d 

Make a typing error, it's nothing unusual for 

and start over. As I have stated earlier, be 

to sign your statement, you are given an Oppo 

the statement, and if there are any errors in 

it is going to have to be typed over anyway, 

are aware of this. 

550 

  

ave 

department, 

ething to warm uj 

the stuff? age 

arth fiocor. 

aght that 

& statement, 

rn ap? 

best of my mepory 

As 1 have stated, 

ahead and state 

it, and after he 

question and 

any statement was 

cretaries who do 

If they 

them to pull it out 

fore you are allowed 

wtunity to go over 

the statement, then 

and gst secretaries



  

{2 Welly, when he was giving a statement, weren't you 

ng
 sitting there listening to him 

5 BB Sv an a Boy ae i » an RS wp ws Bh ig BE 40 n - I RE TE \ 54 by ae A At the ~=- when vou start off on a statement I vithesg 

the statement, sir, and I was present, but as I have stated 

earlier, when he started talking to the secretary on the one that 

u
d
 he gave freely, the one that I didn't have anything to do with 

no questions were asked of him, It wasn't that important that 

sit there and listen to him. I don't recall if I-listened to 

every word down the line, I don't recall that, 

- 0 Wouldn't you have been present when he was giving 

any part of his statement, wasn't that your job? 

A uring the question and answer session? Yes, that 

is why at the bottom you ask them to read it and you ask them 

to sign it and that is why we have a space that says withessed 

I witnessed to the fact that he was ecknowledging that he did 

make the statement aml he signed 1t, then I witnessed the fact 

that he sald thio. 

’ 

Q 50 you are saying that insofar as the first statement 

dictated was concerned, you didn't pay any attention when he was 

giving it? 

a Yo be frank with vou, I wasn't that concerned with 

its I just wanted him -- one reason I wasn't there, nore Or 

less staring in his face, I wanted hin to just go ahead and 

tell what he wanted to tell about it. I didn't want him to 

feel like I was picking words because 1 was standing by him. 

a 0 Cg 

 



  

In all probability I stood back in the hall and let him start, 

I just don’t recall, On the {irst statement, &s I stated 

earlier, I wanted him to tell in his own words. There was no 

need for me tO be there, The guestion ami answer session, you 

can't conduct it without ne there, 

if vou don't know what he said in the first statement? 

A I take the first statement and I read it and study 

it and then 1 start my question and answer session. Mr. MoClesky, 

in up in Marietta and I had bo
ot
 as I stated earlier, I talked to i 

lot of questions I wanted to ask hin. 

Le
, well, if he had stated to the secretary who he was 

giving the statement to, or who was taking the statement, that 

something in there wasn't right, wouldn't vou have kept that 

paper or wouldn't you have at least looked at that paper in 

terng of preparing your question and answer? 

MRe PARKER: I believe that is hearsay. 

HMR. TURRER: I think it wouldn't be if he was 

sitting there with the secretary. 

THE COURT: You mean if he heard that? 

MRe TURMEN?D If he heard it, 

THE COURT: Hale your question clear, and I will 

0 {By Mr. Turner) GUkay. If you were sitting there 

PN while he was viving a statement and you overheard him say to the 

8. How can you conduct the question and answer session 

sl 

 



  

secretary, something den't right here, I want to change that, 

wouldn't you review that statement before it was thrown away? 

A If I was there and a statement had been completed 

and he sald something wasn't right, sure, I would have looked 

{ Okay, low, at the sane time, a secretary wouldn't 

have thrown away a plece of paper or a statement where the 

defendant said something was not right on it without showing 

it to you, would she? 

A They do it all the time, 

0 Chey they do? 

A Yes, sir. 

{J How many times has that happened to you before? 

A Our secretaries, they are human, they do a lot of 

typing, and most of their typing =-- and they are very good 

typists, and they have to type as we dictate to them, and some- 

times they will be typing, and if we make two or three errors 

in there, she will snateh the whole thing out, throw it in the 

trash can and start over again. 

£0 Since you Know that that was a possibility in 

happening, that didn't influence you in terms of paving more 

attention in this cage? 

A Bir, 1 really don't understand your question. 

{3 My question ie, since vou say it happens all the 

time, that statements are thrown away or corrected, that didn't 

SE Fe 

 



  

influence you to pay more attention to Mr. MeCleskyv's state 

ment of what was happening surrounding him? 

A Ho, 8iY, because as 1 have stated earlier, he had 

an opportunity, as everyone does, to lock at the statement he 

fo
n iad made prior to signing the statement, and 1f he had stated 

at that tine, "Look, this is not what I said, I did not say 

this, I an not going to sign it," at that time I would have 

turned and I would have said, "Well, how do you want to phrase 

this,” and he would have changed it and we would have went 

{ All right, Now, vou stated earlier, I believe, 

before vou interrogate someone you have a discussion with then, 

YOu gO over or you discuss the general nature of things, or am 

A Yes, sir, I like to. Aas for my investigations, I 

dike to talk with the person about what we == to get an idea 

about what we -- in fact, you could say what we are talking 

about, I &m discussing it with then, asking questions at that 

time, and then we reduce it to writing. 

0 S50 you did that with Mr. MGCL esky before he made any 

statement, didn't you? 

A I did that up in Marietta, but not in the City of 

Atlanta on the 3lst or May the 306th, I discussed prior to 

reducing it to writing, but on May the 31st, 1978, in the City 

of Atlanta when he walked into the Atlanta office and said, “1 

 



  

want to tell you what 

ne need. 

4 Why did yo 

I TT had eo pr 
MA I had talk 

TP EL a. M le 3a on ds wip wy Ea Tom, re i 
happened, that day I did not, there 

  

a 

oo Bi oo on % ~ JT | TR 
ed Mariette am there 

some things that he had sald that we believe that he had 

he knew nore about the incident, 

Q All right. Bo == well, I will just strike that 

Moving along, were the words in that first stat WEP Ls & 
WE Sew ne, 

wag that exactly the way that Mr, HeClesky dictated the state- 

ment? 

A Sir, are you speaking of the first page in the City 

of Atlanta? 

{J Yea, 

i Sir, as 1 have stated, I don't recall that I sat 

there during tr 

think 

» 

in the room. I don't 

@¢ typing of that. As 1 have stated, 

¥ 

& 4 
®w recall being 

typing of that first page. 

{ Rll right. 

AY. SS io i Be gn win . CN PU, 5 

did you refer to dr. M 

HeClesky? 

think wh 

and that is something 

I think at one 

was calling ne Jovwers, 

yy 
oS HOW , axad atmosphere, 

cClesky, did you call him Warren Ox 

ad 

en he arrived it vas Hr. 

that been doing all my 

felt that it better that ELE 

he had the detect T 4 B pe 

Groped 

3.4. 

J 

there Guring the entire 

how 

was just trying to let him relax 

 



  

§ 

detective up in Marietta, it was Jowers then, and I think I 

started calling bis Warren during our casual conversation with 

each other; however, when we started the question and answer 

session, I returned back to Hr, McClesky. 

That's right, because the guestion and answer 

session was recorded, wasn't it? 

i Beg your pardon? 

  

6 The question and answer session was recorded, wasn't 

A recorded? 

§ A Yegors was madery 

A Reduced to writing? 

LJ L&E» 

J, LF - 

£% 198 # Haile 

OJ Go for purposes of anything that was reduced to 

writing, vou referred to him as hr. MeClesky then, bot in talk- 

ing to him off the record you referred to him as Warren? 

A I referred to hiim as Mr. MeClesky ang lI stated 

earlier sometimes we got into a very relaxed conversation, and 

as I have stated sarlier, Sergeant Strugls, who was there, you 

get an idea of the type atmosphere that wae there by what we 

were talking about, she got up and walked cut and 1 nodded ny 

spproval and he did the same and we made sone statement about 

5 Sim ES ne = EP Cvarivz 1.43 HIST I felt it would x Fou on B ma ym 0) § 2 gal a a sy BY ah su Ex gh pre Be a ty on 
that, ang 1t was a very rt elagxed atmos) E, 

* 

 



  

i want you to 

but not 

RATS SATIS) 
Pitae "= JES 

Bay 

mere than 

{2 3 w 
Lad» 

“3s 4 4 5 9 

SaNner , 

a chance to ask everyth 

Bree tl times, 

I would agk that the ©oO 

read back the last answer to me, I didn't 

part of ig, 

THE COURT: fell, I don't know why ¥ 

didn't start tal 
» 

iking until you 

another cuestion. 

bh gb 

Evin 
ey TE 

read it hack. 

ups (¥herve 

A, PUY ing 

would make hin 

ER ER TPCT dl SY 
48 HE ee PCLULOEBKY e 

&£% 4 TR a 1% 
L) ARG YOu 

possible, 

A 1 didn't 

there, slr. Hy obje 

was no need going in 

ise The man walked 

La 
: 8 po RE Ligation 

3 

EL ¥ 5 ’ 

the 

very 

Ww 

Wil i Cl 3 

Turner) & 

I would ask 

iy Ret 
the reporter read 

How aid deter XE 3 

conversation that we 

uncomfortable to keep ref 

anted to make hin feel as © 

bring any lounge chairs or 

. . po . a wn Toa $a % wi - ge 5 wg ctive was to make him relax. 

there changing the tone ai 

in and sald he wanted to ti 

" PR | SN R A TRI | # 
; § 1 &¢ een QBs 14 1A. I 4 

& i 
bps 3 F ns 

Oud 

the court re 

ing three times, 

urt reporter 

the last hear 

didn't, 1 

were getting ready to ask 

porter to 

refer 

having I 

tO erring 

pmfortable as 

thing down 

felt there 4 

rude to 

il me about an 

ad a duty to 

 



  

2 

try to clear the case. 1 an not going in there and anger 

Mr. HeClesky, bul at the sase time, I am not going to hring 

down any lounge chairs or color 2V or anything. 

{J All right, How, a composite picture was made early 

off in your investigation, is that correcty 

i Who were the people who gave the composite picture? 

5 Sir, I was not present at the actual drawing. This 

drawing was made while I was still at the crime scene at 993 

Marietta Street, an artist who is really not an artist, she 

is very good and she works downstairs in the Traffic Departe- 

ment, was called in and it's ny undertanding that she made the 

GLrawingg. 

iy rs J on Bm vie A Ey Px wats So te pg 2s § apr LE WE 
L% From fre. ianie Thomas! description, right? 

A IGE, HiT, 

Gs "Th an Rive Tal Bow _ AG LHP TR PIE SH A Se SH TE be Joy 4 be Asal right. Now, in terug OL verilying any OL he 

things that were in Fr. MeClesky's statement, have you been 

oe ea a bh Vii. Wray WL | 
Sie LG AC that 

jk 4
 oe
 a »d
 

A, Would you repeat that questio: 

® Have you been able to verify any of the {acts that 
wR 

stated in his statement? 

  

Fp END EP NEY ne soya Ya al “ > : we a be orn I Sn 
ME PARRKEAS BOW, COUuld we clarifly #8 to which 

statenent we are talking about? 

MR, TURBER: I'm sorry, Your Honor. 

(J (By Mr. Turner) We are talking about the statement 

mah o™ 

 



  

the 31st, both the one page as well a F 4 x - S the question and 

BH8GLS 4 

Yes, sir, we have. 

All right. What have you been able to verify? 

We vere able to verify the fact that he stated 

nad went into the store just prior to it being robbed, 

able to verify that == where the vehicles were parked, 

were ‘able tO verify that his vehicle was used, we were 

verify that Hr. Ben Wright, Mr. David Burney and 

stn ww Fras a Sdn Ba Hy BT a "ld Toes og, Sg +7 a ow y . FRArd Udpree were also present with him. We were able to 

that shortly after leaving that location, that they did ¥ 
* 

yd, x PR TE RTT , SRT re PE pa. Fon gn NT ¥ “ Few 
FE HOERATG LUDTEE 5 ONE, We were also able to verily 

Mr. Ben Wright did use the black leather jacket that was 

a0 a is a 8 SS ol RD pe a J WA, aR bo | Pp a vis a 1a ad % a 
A460 veriilied wiere he stated he had received the 

and wie hw had received the items from. We were able to 

s Fo gen dr ow » iS Tp Bh Se Rr Fon An oh pi go a vi dh $s 
shotgun Shells that were rYegoveyed at tne 

Mr. Jowers, beiore angthe:x 

, GP Ep Now a Wie, Read he . “ p PINE OED oN or Youn TR PLE IE be 3 ps this. we were aise able to verify the color of the 

Crile SGUeNe. we Ware 

Pa
nt
 verify when he stated he went to the Ncbhaniel Street 

v hat, ware able Lo verily 

GOW Aare YOu aie (0 = 

$
k
 

Pt
s 84% Se TRL Er 2% 3 4 2% 25. hh Wg REPS EE ver Fog 

Pile FHRALKE PACQUSE MB, are You ARG LO6A , 

wn is asked? rf L
a
 c Pe
 © £&
r A
S
 

5
 

THE WIDHEESs I will read it all over if you would 

like. Everything that he said wes verified except there 

was only -- everything that he said, it went along with 

5 iw 

 



  

Our investigation. 

Pe rer PASS. FP BV wt ti le THO | RE WP ” % de y $« 
§ {By oh ag Turner) Well, RWitad You Mealy iB it wiz il 

34d 2% nn Ef ak 4 gn 3 if i ok Tp i a ea ft ONE 3 along with what Den Wright sald, right? Isn't that one of your 

verifving factors here? 

  

1 How, vou both == 

Mile PA Chdections Have you finished your 

angwer, betective? 

WITHESB:r Ho, 81. 

  

v {By Mr. Turner) Okay. Go ahead and finish, 

by Fh o N Ao 5 an ne nah wpe TR PRITIOE Tg oon oH Sale TER at REINS Bg OF GTA 
A The facts that I have stated to CH WRITS VRE ILI 18( 

I Boy peg my wo ww Bf a pd Bed 8 APR on " b by other parties that were invoived. 

{ Ben Wright and who else? 

A Mr. David Burney and sone of these -- we have =—- 

when he stated that they went fo the Mebhaniel Street area, we 

  

i Foe Fe. ~ a Wy A PTY Sg PTA i i TTL 3 Po ah A 3 po BR oo iY weg pw Yi yg 
interviewed & man who stated that he id HBT. MOCGALGBRY 

rR a da cv 3 ky $a Noa om a oi wa ELA 3 By a By | PE ot pn gt a ad gt " ¥ we 
coming in with his car, and Ben Wright, who he knew pel gonally, 

that confirmed that, the fact that they went into that area. 

into the area, how does that connect 

  

with the 

r F HO Wa SE ee SB Ry Me Eira ned has Fionad mated ro You asked me some of the things that he had sald 

a a re fe ihe so en 2 a RE. 2 N pn " 5a 4 aw fen pT oo Ps on oe 4 poy 
aponened and that 1s what 1 was Going i wag showing 

off pF 4 K] 

that == JI don't know what going in the area had to do with the 

Fiore ¥ x NS Re in ad N Bp wal a RE be BF hay EO RR, CF Be nev arte ut ” ah £2 
crime, but I am saying he was 1h the McDaniel Street area. ie 

 



  

said he left that evening and went into the area. That is all 

I was saying, that he said that, 
wh 

1 bought Hr, Ben Wright dinner, too, didn't fo HOWy YO 

you? 

A tiegative, no, sir. 

* Bidn't you go and pick up Hr. Eright from wherever 

he was? 

A From a beautiful country, Pine Bluff, Arkansas. 

{ Didn't you take Hr. Wright to a restaurant or sone 

eating place over on Fulton Industriel Boulevard? 

i oo § gay ge EL Hr ie SL er vs oe PE at. in 
Li nat wag the purpose of taking him theres 

A He stated ne was hungry. 

0 Ghaye. And who pald for the meal? po  ) 

WEE ee ¢ nS 

5 “he State. 

- ¥ 

# All right. How long did you all stay there? b, 

A I don't recall. I think 1t was about an hour. ve 

stopped theyre and he had a steak dinner, I had a steak dinner, 

when he gave you a statement, too, isn't 4
 

a
 wh
 

>
 —
 

~ (%
 

4 

Fe
np

r 
we

 i rT
 

a
 

“ 

@a
 

A Hiv, I wrote -- we left Pine Bluff with Mr. Ben 

Wright. It was some eight te ten hours driving. During that 

whole tine we held discussions with Hr. Ben Wright, He told us 

many things in that ten hours, 

 



  

{} Well, I notice that you only did one report dealing 

with what he sald, and I might be wrong about that, 1 just saw 

one report dealing with the conversation you had at the restau- Ge 

rant. Where wag that, ag a natter of fact? 

A I don't recall the name of the retaurant, but it's 

near -= it's on Industrial Boulevard, and 1 think it's next to 

the Howard Johnson Motels It's a little small place; something 

gstatencnts that were given to you along the way, as you say? 

A The biggest reason I can tell you is that 1 didn't 

make that supplement that you are referring to, it was nade by 

Detective Barris. 

{J ALY right. Bid you sign 17? 

fa pil y BALD 

{ Okay, Who was sitting with Mr, Wright at the time 

= 
he made the statements? 

& pvetective Harris. 

Fa A gn WT $i onan Warne hr i od in my 8 dn TPL 

W AnG where were you s8itiinhyg 7 

A I was sitting at a table s¢ 1 could observe 

Hrs Den Wrilgl 

A segative, In fact, 1t was an le-shape ana etective 

Sn pak A RE Se TE TET. 5 A A pi $id pee pro Rg Elm 8 ou ex de worth OF 20 Gp “ie g B ) 
Harris had hig pack Lo me, Ss San WEILYNT Was nore Or iesd 

facing me, but I was off in an Leghépe away from them sO 1 

hild= 

 



  

could observe his novements,. 

FR. TURNER: Excuse me just a minute. 

Q {By Mr. Turner) Okay. Isn't it a fact that after 

you read his initial statement that you concluded that wasn't 

enough, you needed to ask some follow-up guestions? 

A You say hig? 

A Hr. MeClesky's, and the initial statement 1 an 

referring to ig the one of the 3lat? 

i What 1s the question vou are asking me? 

o My question is, after you read his initial one page 

statement, didn't you determine then that you needed to ask him 

some questions to clarify thine 

A Ho, sir. As I have stated earlier, it is standard 

procedure with all of my homicide investigations that you are 

alloved to make your statement and immediately after you make 

your statement, any way you want to make it, if he said good 

morning, good morning, good morning, all the way down to the 

end of the page, at that time I would start ny guestion and 

answer session if he agreed, If he didn't want to conduct it, 

would stop. This is in all of my homicides Fr
e 

wa
d 

Pay
) 

TW
 

oe
 

mr
 ce
] 

will check, you may go over to the records, you will find every 

homicide that I have handled, except for maybe the first month 

i was in Homicide, I have been in Homicide for about three vears, 

I changed it, I went to that, I noticed when taking statements 

if detectives and investigators were to get what they wanted out 

 



  

of a suspect or a person they were interviewing, they had to 

somewhat lead him as to say okay, on such and such a date you 

start off and he would say on such and such a date I did this, 

and it would be almost the Investigator's words that was used 

and ‘1 didn't like it, it could be easily chellenged in court, 

and that is why 1 selected to go to the guestion and answer 

session alter every statement. You are allowed to say anvthing, 

if you would have said, as I stated earlier, good morning, good 

morning, good morning, that would have been fine. 

¥ Isn't it a fact that the guestion and answer session 

itself is a form of leading? You ask the guestion and he supplies 

the answer? 

A Me is given an opportunity, that is why I stated 

earlier, he is given an opportunity to tell about the incident, 

and when he walked into the room, I said, "Tell the secretary 

about the incident that happened on Hay the 13th, 1978, go ahead, 

just tell her what happened and when you are through, I will ask 

you some questions and answers, we'll bave a question and 

answer session if it's okay with you; if not, I won't," 

Yt 

THE COURT: 1 believe we have gone over this more ”~
 

than three times. It is the duty of the trial judge to 

11-1 an trying po
re
 

on & prevent needless repetition and that 

to do. 

MRe TURNER: I have no further questions of this 

 



    

   
           

            

        

COUNTY OF PULTOR, 

I hereby certify that the foregoing Pages 1 through 

574 constitute a true, couplete and accurate transcript of 

Volume I of the proceedings taken by me in the case aforesaid, 

\ 
Thig, the 20th day of Hoveuber, 1978. 

ans Le — 
  

He Lie Shielnutt X 
Pp s #4 A ad TT Cy 0 NRE PRI ATR MI MR le i | Certified Shorthand Reporter A=L3a 

Super 10r Court of Fulton County 

- 

re



tive, Call 

sa Fy aw 25 4 4 £3 om anys Xo 
all Detective Haryilis., 

Ere} TF raid oh 
foliows: GULLY SWOTH, 

Ey oo Bw ad 5% Fen A OT Sl i a A 3 
DIRECT DBEiINATIUI 

5% Sh Pat 
Fol RCH ARG 

Us who you Work Lor, 

Pirin Spawn A anne §. vd ie 
POLICE DELrvVviIOEs 

with the po 

aL with the Li have pean 

How long have 

Off tarae % 

) eta 

BN TR 41, EY ia 
Officer Heals 

you bec  



      

  

      
      

      

  

investigation, approximately? 

A Well, I Decane actively invelved in the investigation 

during the time that we served a warrant in Cobb County. 

5 % PRE Se TE - + Er oF 3 x A ie ge pt A an » i HAG Tass 7 Ti 
J All right, sir. Would that have been on approxi- 

mately May the 30th, 19787 A 
a   

Lin warrant was the         

        

    
      
      

           

         

    

(3 And would you tell us how vou got involved in the > 
   

MeConnell, 

     
    

he, ; a an Br aes a a kh a 8 Th es aha 
anout a subject that was liv LIL 

    Who the guy wag or person was 

i Paws ¥ 8 a Dw Be or Wh Tg » RN Tha pn x be a | TSR nD 
pW MONCC 86 into NY Neariay. io JUSK want to xnow how 
    

  

   

   

C3 Ped AE 2 wrrera ) vas oH . 3 oan §g ite. wh A a FA ee we pl Win 
you got invoived, I don’t want any hearsay. 

      there and serving the warrant “ 
A I got involved going up 

a
e
 

         
  

    

  

   

  

or that night of Hay the 31st, 1878. 

someone 

      tenant and sergeant,     

   

  

         

onnell, wv 

    And do you recall vhere these warrants were served? 

        
x 

Yes, sir, in Cobb County at, I think i     rT
 

-
 

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N
 

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Wears 

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be 

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Alig 

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Be LT 
LE 0 yr 

arrest 

OWE 

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4 

oF 
a
 

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2 ham dn pa 
ASE 2 

3 Pa 

Cad Ld (3 

 



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Ha s 2 

v3) 

to get 

Nop £4 
Ra 

elect 

4» 
en 

Ckay 
LAA Ye 

Homicl £3 LS. 

% 
A 

EES 

y ¢onducted That interviev, 81K: 

  

ir, prior to any questioning, right, 

5 

ve Jowers and myself, 

that information given to you 

¥ Lore 

sther than perhaps 

spoken, that you know of h | 

of, no physical gestures 

¥ Lieutenant Perry had brought 

TLE FE ; EE mF ayer bo  ¥ TERY. . 

Brough i HeClaesky @ Homicide ' ¥ 

tine 

you recall 

Ee 
TIERS » 

that interview?